Shoplifting..... So desperate at Christmas

[stubbs0412]

Not me btw
Whilst waiting in supermarket queue someone was escorted out by the police...."shoplifters" says the cashier. "Well, people are just so desperate this time of year aren't they?" Says the person in front of me. I could feel myself actually agreeing, is this u? R my morals slipping? I honestly don't think I would report someone I saw shoplifting food either.

When I worked in a pop up perfume/toiletries shop at Christmas as a student, you used to get teenage lads nicking perfume sets and the more valuable stuff. My manager used to make us hover around any teenagers in the shop, just in case, which I did in the least committed way possible- for £4 an hour I was not going to challenge and confront someone! I'm not a burly 6ft security guard.

The government is dismantling the welfare state

Maybe edam, and that if true is wrong, precisely because of the chaos that ensues.

However, most shoplifting is carried out by criminals who are not desperate or starving.

There aren't enough food banks and there isn't enough food.

A local church near us started serving Christmas meals a few years ago for people who had nowhere else to go. This year they have more than 150 people turning up. Some are just lonely and some can't afford to feed themselves or their children. One woman got in touch with them and begged them to save a place for her and her 7 children.

Many MPs have voted against an investigation into food bank usage which would have proven a direct link between welfare cuts and rising demand for food banks. Iain Duncan Smith was videoed grinning the whole way through the debate in Parliament.

Many charities which would have helped those suffering have been forced to close due to lack of government funds. Others rely on the help of local people.

Food banks give families enough food to live on for just 3 days. They can't give them a weeks supply.

It's so easy for people to think that shoplifters stealing food must be doing so to fund drugs; it's better to demonise them than face the truth. I don't suppose the taxes we pay go towards drugs or arms deals or anything like that No, it's always those damned poor people who are criminals.

Shoplifters don't ensure the prices of things go up, that is a fallacy.

How lovely it must be for those who will be sat at home surrounded by family and gifts, rich food and drink, who will actually have to throw away leftovers to tell those without that they don't need such treats at Christmas. Do you not see the irony of judging others whilst sat in your ivory tower?

I would not report someone stealing food.

Those who sell stolen food have stolen large orders from warehouses, they don't steal the odd cheese block or chicken fillets from Asda.

i was listening to jermey vine yesterday and they were basically taking the piss out of people who wait for knocked down prices in supermarkets, ok they were laughing at the ones that grab and appear to be greedy but people called in saying how entertaining it was :( how nasty when you are desperate and have no money what choice do you have

i have had to count pennies for milk and bread, thankfully this was long before i had ds it is no way to live it is so depressing to have no money and i am sure if i was in that situation now stealing from a big supermarket would seem very tempting and the pressure to buy presents is immense

Honestly? Crime is never justified. And no, shoplifting food is no exception.

well it is justified for certain members of our society our MP's

Actually THECliff people were stealing meat joints and large cheese blocks when I worked at the Co-op a few years back. It's why all the expensive joints of meat have security tags on now in most supermarkets.

They're not going to take large bulk stock from warehouses which is harder to hide, harder to transport and harder to shift - much of the meat we lost through theft we think was stolen to order. It's organised crime, but organised on a small scale.

Don't forget the big corporations who pay no income tax.

And the bankers who use our money to go on cocaine and champagne fuelled benders. Oh and I wonder how many champagne dinners our taxes have funded for the MPs and other dignitaries?

But no, let's demonise everyone else instead and judge, judge, judge.

Some people are completely desperate yes. But others are just thieves who are doing quite well out of their habit. Impossible to tell which is which.

some facts about food banks

But they are criminals too Cliff.

Not foodbanks obv.

To be honest I would say that professional thieves these days would not chance going round a supermarket to steal bits of food. I would imagine that the majority of people stealing food are doing so for their own usage.

With the amount of cameras and security guards and tags, etc I think most professional thieves have come up with better susses. Those who get caught are likely to be amateurs who haven't done it before.

Of course there are exceptions.

But to heartlessly claim that no-one needs food over Christmas and no-one is that desperate and that there are plenty of charities to help, whilst tucking into your own turkey at Christmas is really taking the piss.

Anyone who thinks that obviously doesn't live in the real world and prefers to ignore the truth that food poverty is a very real problem.

I used to be a food retail manager and main theft was meat, cheese and alcohol. We had regulars who would steal to order, or those that would do store to store stealing lamb. They were often dangerous tbh and you really shouldn't feel sorry for them, they couldn't give a shit about me or you.

Mind you the petty small shoplifters were generally older gentlemen wearing Barbour wax jackets !

It's also worth noting too, THECliff, that shoplifing cost the UK retail market £4.4 BILLION in 2010, so I don't believe it's a fallacy that shoplifting affects pricing - when pricing stock, shops take into account the amounts for loss, whether that be damage or theft, and when one has a figure as large as that, most stores will need to increase prices on high-value items to ensure they take an overall profit.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11571022

Yes AchyFox they are criminals.

So let's just throw them all in jail and not look at the wider problem.

I read a news story at the beginning of the year about how a desperate mother was nicked by a copper for shoplifting. She'd been caught by the security guards. She was taken to the police station where the police were so moved by her story that they had a whip round for her.

At least some sections of this society still have a heart.

I don't know, it's a hard question. I don't think I would report any shoplifter, no. It might be more about the fear of them doing something to me because of it though!

I would have a lot of sympathy with desperate parents (desperate for food, not presents) but I would also have sympathy with drug addicts. I agree that they are not 'low lives'. The only person I know who shoplifts on a regular basis is my severely bulimic friend. She is in such poor health that she cannot work and so badly affected that she eats and throws up hundreds of pounds worth of food a month. So she steals it. She's a drug addict in a way, it's just that her drugs are the food itself. Her life is nothing but stealing, eating, throwing up and repeat on an endless cycle. I feel incredibly sorry for her. I also wouldn't blame anyone who reported her though. Very tricky situation.

Sorry but this is rubbish debating level 'dont judge shoplifters, because rich MPs exist'.

This is a thread about shoplifting, not about MPs. We can judge them both, separately.

Have we really forgotten the mass media storm that ran for weeks when the MPs expenses scandal broke? I watched Question Time that week and it was close to civil unrest.

So it's not a case of ignoring one kind of criminal. All criminals must face judgement.

FyreFly your article states "More than a third of thefts were carried out by shop staff"

It also states that shoplifting as a whole has gone down.

Do you know how much food is thrown away by supermarkets each year? Food that is perfectly good to eat but that is simply surplus to requirements.

Some supermarkets are now donating this surplus food.

My word, some posters are full of the milk of human kindness.

Of course some people in this country are desperate and living in poverty. I feel the same way about this as I do about people begging in the street: if one out of 100 is in genuine need, then it's worth giving/turning the other cheek so that they are helped.

Morris I have more sympathy for shoplifters than I do MPs.

Unfortunately this society does not treat each criminal fairly. Nothing is done about large corporations who do not pay tax, who cost us billions every year. Yet the law clamps down hard on the single mother who shoplifts or the small independent company who fails to get their tax returns in on time.

It's one rule for the rich and another for the poor.

In 2010 shoplifting cost the UK economy (i.e. you and me) £4.4 bn

That's an astronomical amount that the rest of us are paying for (I think that is approx. £73 for every man, woman and child in the country)

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11571022

THECliff - yes, I do know how much food is thrown away by supermarkets (I used to work for Co-op) and I believe that is a disgrace too. Stock that will not be sold also comes under the "loss" umbrella and will be accounted for in pricing, the same when it comes to loss through shoplifting.

The article stated that, in 2010, the effect of shoplifting added an average of £180 onto a families food bill a year. I was countering the point you made that shoplifting does not cost people anything because it doesn't put the prices up.

Loss of stock through wastage also puts prices up, and as I already said, it's a pretty big disgrace that we waste so much good food, but that's not the focus of the thread.

Unfortunately ModernToss Tory papers such as the Daily Mail have done a good job in making sure benefit claimants and immigrants are seen as scum, that gypsies are criminals, that large corporations help keep our economy afloat and that our poor MPs aren't paid enough.

The government need to blame someone and as usual those who can't easily defend themselves, such as the poor, disabled, elderly, etc usually get the blame.

When you consider the huge profits supermarkets make FyreFly do you really think that they are "forced" to put up prices because of shoplifters? Or is that a convenient excuse?