To stop contact between dd and her not so darling dad?

[MincedMuffPies]

ExFw was emotionally, physically and financially abusive towards me so I'm not sure if I'm being objective enough.

DD(8) doesn't want to go to his eow saturday night anymore. She comes home complaining of being shouted at nagged and used as a babysitter to keep her younger sister (4) entertained.

FW gas lights her, promises her the world and never follows through unless it suits him. He has never once put her (or any of his dc) first. He has never gone to a school play, choir performance, school assembly, sports day or gymnastic competition. Even when he wasn't working.

I can mention so many examples of hurtful things he has said while she is in hearing range. One example being to me, dd is my funny little princess but dd's sister she is my queen shes so amazing just look at her.

Dd hasn't just complained at going to her dads to me she has also said to my dm and dnan that she doesn't like going as her dad is so bossy and boring.

He hasn't paid child support since January, this week I have spoken to child maintenance. I have always said my child is not a pay per view channel but jheeze I am fed up. He is supposed to pay for her music lessons at school, a poxy £15 PM, he promised her that he would pay this he told me he would put the money in my account every month but he hasn't. He has just bought himself a new car so now he has two cars.

She does want to see her family on his side, her grandma who shes not that close with and her bag of brothers who she adores. She does want to see her dad but she doesn't want to sleep over or go to his house. She says it's because she misses me but my dd is used to having sleepovers with various friends and family. My DM takes her on holidays and my Dnan has her the majority of most school holidays so she is used to spending time without me so I don't really think it's about missing me.

I have done everything I can to make her dad love her. I even took him in when he got evicted and got back together with him for a year thinking if he spent enough time with her they would bond more. I have really gone above and beyond what I needed to do.

If you have got this far thanks, now IABU to think fuck you, you had your chance to build a strong relationship my dd doesn't need you around and instead of making her go do what I have been doing this last month and making our weekends jam packed with things to do and people to see so she doesn't miss seeing him or want to see him regularly again. I think it will be more damaging long term forcing her to go and see him then letting her stop.

Here we go, drip,drip,drip.... The important stuff which should have been in the op is now coming out

So police have attended..... Twice..... Almost certain that would trigger an SS involvement. So what did ss say op?

You poor thing. I also find myself angry on your behalf that despite the fact he is violent to you, letting her down, telling her he thinks more of her younger sister that YOU are perceived as unreasonable for wanting to protect her from this.
Having said this, I would start from what she wants, which is to see him without overnight stays. Is there a family member who could go with her? Personally I would not trust anyone with my children who thought it was ok to pull me by the hair and hit me. It shocks me reading responses that say you are unreasonable to protect your dd from a violent man.

No the slap happened when he turned up with container of food he cooked and I said I didn't want it. DD wasn't in the house at that time.

There has been other physical things on contact handovers but nothing more then barging his way in and shoving me out the way, and the dragging me off to shout at me and once he ha me up against the wall by my throat. That has all happened since July this year when we split up.

We now have an agreement where he beeps his horn and dd goes out. He still does other things like, make me go places with him and the dc. He made us go swimming a little while ago. He turns up out of the blue at tescos saying dd said she wants to go swimming so we're going swimming. He had 2 of his ds with him and then it's my dd and my ds all excited now becaue hes told them we're going swimming and how can I say no when theres 4 dc thinking thats whats happening. I then spent the whole time stopping him from groping me under the water.

I did bertie it was the first thing in my OP that fw is physically abusive!

It's not quite drip drip drip, right from the start the OP said he was physically abusive. What do people think that means? Why is it surprising to hear that police have been involved?

I am not drip feeding. I am showing examples of what I have put already.

The police have been involved, there is no restraining order this isn't america. All I have is that my number comes up with all info already on about previous. There is no SS although the police officer said last time ifthey come out again SS will be notified. SO I can' even rng he police again with that happening.

Sorry, because you said he "was" physically abusive, I assumed you meant he was during the relationship, and not now.

I think you need to get the police, women's aid, social services and any other agency you can involved. He is still abusing you and he is using DD to do so, that is not fair on her at all.

You absolutely must not go on joint outings etc with them - if he has wound them up and got them excited then that's not your problem. You just say "No it's not convenient" - he's counting on your guilt at "letting the children down" to force you into doing something - it's just another form of control. Actually, he is letting them down by promising something they can't have, don't let him control you.

I think you should be involving the police for his violence and don't be put into situations like the swimming - just say no. You can take your DD swimming on your own.

I think stopping contact is a good idea if he's using it to control you or be violent to you. Do you have any formal agreements about contact in place? It could end up in court and you should be prepared for that (which is why police records will be useful). I'm not sure she's at an age where stopping contact would be possible on her say so.

The police have been involved, there is no restraining order this isn't america You think you only get these in America? A temporary restraining order is also called an interim interdict, If all the above information that you had stated is 100% correct then you do in fact have grounds to apply for this and I am shocked you have not been informed. I suggest you look into it.

Yes you can. Social services will HELP you protect her from her DAD. They don't want to take her away from YOU.

Please don't let a fear of SS stop you from acting - I am sorry I was a bit flippant before, I didn't understand the whole situation, but the split was only in July, he is still in full on brain-fuck, control because I can and any which way I can mode and your DD is being harmed by witnessing this. Whether it's you being "only" pushed (no "only" about this) or him setting up an outing that she can then feel a weirdness about - she must have been aware that you were acting strangely when he was trying to grope you, that's disgusting.

You haven't got the response from mn you wanted..... So you are now upping it and adding in extras to turn it around so you get to hear what YOU want to hear: Sorry, redbus, sounds to me as if the reality is that you aren't getting the response you want to fit into the instant opinion you formed on this. It's a long OP already, she said he was physically abusive, how much more detail do you want?

I think SS might be a good thing - try would support you in cutting contact.

Get outside agencies involved, as others have said - Women's Aid and Social Services, and a solicitor. You can reject all contact between this man and you - while he does have the right, in law, to see DD no adult can be forced to maintain any kind of relationship with another adult/ .So all details of contact arrangements and handovers can be handled by a third party. Your DD can see her father in a public place or a contact centre and you need never see him at all.

Lively.

It would not always result in a restraining order, the police can apply for a very time limited protection order preventing him from entering the house but these are usually designed to be used when the couple live together so the victim has a little bit of time (usually only a few days) to have some thinking space, they can also use bail conditions but these only last until the offence has been dealt with so either NFA or court. IME court action for stuff that does not leave injury is unusual.
Anything that the police can apply for ( to the courts on behalf of the victim or bail conditions) usually exempts child contact so they are not in breach when collecting/dropping off the child so in reality are a nice polite request to not assault them whilst child contact is happening but stay away at all other times. If social services are already involved or get involved quick enough then that line may not be included.

The op could also apply for a none molestation order herself either by self repping or using legal aid or self funding but again they often contain the same line,and the first order you get often only lasts about a week.

Given that family courts have to repeatedly be reminded that DV has to be taken into account with regard to none mols and contact its quite a good indicator that they often don't.

I've lost count of the sheer volume of clients I've had over the years who have CS CP involvement due to DV and its made very very clear to them that further action may be taken to protect the children if they do not leave only for them to do so and the violent parent ends up having more unsupervised time with the kids often very quickly getting into a new relationship so the kids just get to watch a new person getting beaten up because the court has not paid as much attention to the DV instructions as it should.

As to alternative arrangements perhaps family members are unwilling to help,the op certainly shouldn't be expected to supervise and in many areas contact centre places are like gold dust and very time limited so tend to be used for the very worst situations.

The op was very clear in her first post that he is abusive if she had have gone into detail it would have been very long,she would have been ignored for that or flamed by the "its ok as long as he does not hit the kids" brigade.

I really don't think women aid or SS will help me. They will want me to move to a refuge change the dc's school and their lives upside down. We are not together no more I hope in time he will leave me alone. I do want dd to have a sort of relationship with him I just don't want her to attached or used to seeing him regularly. So he will need to know where I live so the help they could give me they could give someone else who needs it more to escape.

He will twist everything round to SS, he will come across like the nicest man ever and I am the crazy one. He will put on the fake twinkle in his eye and refute everything I say.

This man makes scenarios up and I swear he believes his own stories. He will say I am the abuser I am a control freak I am the violent one. I know this as when he slapped me I said omg you'e just slapped me and he said wtf are you on about I never slapped you you slapped yourself, go on call the police slap yourself again to leave a better mark. Then he twisted it again an said I slapped him and recorded himself shouting at me saying I slapped him.

I would just like him to leave me alone.

YABU - she should get to choose to see her dad, its not your choice. I understand its really difficult but even so you are using your dd in your battle between you - your both being unfair.

So police have attended..... Twice..... Almost certain that would trigger an SS involvement. So what did ss say op?

Most areas unless its a fairly dramatic offence or the children are directly involved in the assault take 3 incidents before they take direct action.

1 may or may not prompt a letter pretty much saying we have been informed but are taking NFA or a phone call saying the same thing.

2 may result in another letter or call.

3 will be either a visit or a phone interview that may or may not result in further action.

These incident referrals are dependant on the police being aware that children are in the household.

I want dd to be meh about him. I don't want her to walk down the street and not know she walked past him and I do want her to have a relationship with her siblings.

I also want him to reasonable and not go over my boundaries.

But thats what I want, dd doesn't want to spend time with him unless they are going somewhere or doing something.

I am really confused what is best to do for my dd.

Well where was your ds when all this was happening op?

And I'm confused.... You say your dd is 8 and your ex's youngest dd is 4.... Yet you split up in July?

The hands round throat incident is important. It used to be that kind of violence which WA said was indicative of a very dangerous man. It's got more 'importance' attached to it than a slap etc.

I am not in this case suggesting she does have him in her home but there are alternative options to avoid pulling all contact. Don't forget at the heart of the matter there is still a little girl who wants to see her Daddy and that by pulling contact entirely will most likely lead to court where the OP could be left in an even worse position of being court ordered to leave her DD for a full weekend every second weekend or something to that effect.

Personally I feel in this situation more information would have been appropriate. I read her first post with full sympathy for her but her following posts did not read well considering the information that had been omitted from the first post. She also said in the first post he was abusive. This could mean the abuse stopped since the relationship broke down. There was also no mention to begin with of any concern for DDs safety where the violence etc was concerned so please forgive me for my initial conclusions. I'm not sure where you are based but I am in Scotland and my experience with an interim interdict is hugely different from what you describe. I know the laws are different surrounding this in Scotland and England and this may be why it is not as good an option (if you are based in England)

OP I apologize if you do think I was harsh but as I said the way your first posts were written did not reflect what is truly going on in your life at the moment, or at least I don't think they did.

I very much hope that you can sort this situation out for yourself and DD.

Good Luck.

The police have removed him twice as he refused to leave my house, sorry for not being clearer I'm quite upset. He wasn't violent on these occasions just refused to leave. The police officer said (same lady both times and same man) as we're not together and he doesn't live here they would do the risk assessment thing if it happened again but were quite satisfied if I was satisfied I wasn't at risk. I haven't reported anything violent.

I was trying to be clear with the facts not weigh it down with the details in my OP as it was already very long.

I haven't reported anything violent.

Do you not think that maybe you should? You are not doing yourself any favours letting him away with this kind of behavior. It is unacceptable and to be honest if outside agencies do get involved it will not look very good for you if you are telling them of incidents that the police have no record of...

I really would advise taking advise from a professional body. You need to make sure you are keeping yourself in the right at all times.

Domestic abuse services won't want to move you to refuge. They will work with you to provide support and education on DA issues. I work with women who remain in the abusive relationship. It really isn't the case that we will whip you into a refuge and expect you to turn your lives upside down. My organisation follows up the standard DA knowledge programme group with a targeted parenting programme looking at how DA affects children, dealing with contact etc. Something like that would benefit you hugely.