AIBU to think Scotland are gonna have moring after regret

[Sadoldbag]

Just heard today that Asda and morrisons will hike there prices up as the store in the uk subsidise the ones in Scotland.

Also the persident of the European union has said last week on hard talk Scotland will not be able to jump the que on the back of the uk coat tails and will have to join and fresh and wait in the back of the que


And royal mail have also said they may stop mail to the far flung parts of Scotland if they go ita lone as they loose money in the shetlands ect and they would only be required to provide mail in the uk.


And it seems to me all the bits in the white paper are all assertions and weather they keep the pound ect is not actually up to them.

I think this is gonna be like ringing your boss when drunk it sounds like a good idea at the time

But They will regert it in the morining

[Fluffytent]

Does a person stop being Scottish if they don't live in Scotland? That seems to be Salmond's point of view in the skewed voting.

[Fluffytent]

Ubik , ex pats who live in Spain and spend their money their still get to vote in UK elections. So the two aren't the same.

[SantanaLopez]

if you don't live there, pay tax educate your children or use any services then why should you vote?

Funnily enough, they'll be citizens (if they want) if the vote goes through. A citizen who couldn't vote...

[Fluffytent]

Exactly SantanaLopez

[mirry2]

How does a person living in England qualify as a Scot at the moment? There's no formal proof. Anyone can say they're Scottish
. My relatives call themselves Scottish but some weren't even born in Scotland

[Fluffytent]

Passport or birth certificate

[Ubik1]

I take your point about Spain - but actually I don't think that's right that they get to vote in UK elections either.


if you don't live there, pay tax educate your children or use any services then why should you vote?Funnily enough, they'll be citizens (if they want) if the vote goes through. A citizen who couldn't vote...

why would they be citizens?


it's like me saying i should have a vote in the London mayoral elections because i was born in London...why should I? Or that because I am English I should have the right to vote in England's elections because I am english (and a quarter Welsh and 1/8 Russian Jew and God knows what else)

[SantanaLopez]

From the White Paper:

372. What will independence mean for citizenship in Scotland?

Our proposal is that on day one of independence, all British citizens who live in Scotland and all British citizens born in Scotland but residing elsewhere would automatically be considered Scottish citizens. Others may be able to apply for citizenship following independence through routes such as citizenship by descent or by naturalisation.

Under these proposals Scotland would not create a barrier to individuals holding Scottish citizenship alongside British or any other citizenship.

373. What would being a Scottish citizen mean and how would I prove that I am a Scottish citizen? Would there be a registration process?

As outlined above, all British citizens who are habitually resident in Scotland at the date of independence and all British citizens born in Scotland but resident elsewhere would automatically be considered a Scottish citizen. There would be no registration required and there are no plans to have a Scottish ID card.

[mirry2]

Do the Scots have different passports from the rest of Uk? I thought we all had the same EU ones

[Grennie]

You know they don't Mirry. But they do show place of birth. I am assuming that is what was meant.

[Ubik1]

That does seem contradictory then doesn't it...it must be a political move then, because they think ex-pats are more likely to vote no...

[mirry2]

Greenies the post explaining about who qualifies as a Scot came after my post so there's no need to roll you eyes at me. So my relatives, who consider themselves Scottish by descent aren't really Scottish at all because they have neither a birth certificate nor a passport stating they were born in Scotland. How far back does one have to go? If my Scottish line ends at the Battle Colluden can I still claim to be Scottish by descent ?

[SantanaLopez]

Coupled onto allowing 16 and 17 year olds to vote too, ubik.

[Fluffytent]

Without getting all misty-eyed like some Americans do on their erm heritage- The UK legal system has the view that the person born in that country is a citizen.

[mirry2]

So fluffytent, if my passport and birth certificate state that I was born in Paris to English parents des that mean I'm French. I've never thought of myself as French and have lived most of my life in England so surely I am English?

[Fluffytent]

[mirry2]

Fluffytents this is a genuine question so stop it. you are being patronising.

[Fluffytent]

I think you know what it says on your passport, so I think the patronising is from yourself.

In short, with regards France

Child born to British parents in France- You do not acquire French citizenship at birth if you are born in France unless at least one parent was born in France.

HOWEVER, UK legal system states ...

Section 1(3) applications - children born in the United Kingdom to parents who are now settled in the United Kingdom
If the child's parent has become settled in the United Kingdom or becomes a British citizen, the child will have an entitlement to register as a British citizen. This registration would be under section 1(3) of the British Nationality Act 1981.

[mirry2]

Fluffytent you are being obnoxious. I don't know what nationality you are but I hope it isn't Scottish

[Fluffytent]

No just summarising some legal facts for you HTH

[mirry2]

Thank you very much.

[flatpackhamster]

Babanouche

Are you being serious? You don't see the difference in what you describe and an entire nation of 5million people with their own border, and their own identity, having to tolerate a govt they despise?

One Tory MP in Scotland. One.

The problem with this argument is - I live in SE England. We had 13 years of the Worst Government In The Universe from 1997 to 2010. And despite our voting consistently to get rid of the fuckers, they were still with us. Labour has no representation to speak of in SE England. And yet there they were, dependent on Scottish and Welsh votes to hold the balance of power in the Commons.

It swings both ways, this 'unrepresentative government' argument.

[Babanouche]

I don't see how that's the same as an entire country getting a govt they didn't vote for. If Scotland gets independence, we will elect a party to govt and there will be people who aren't happy about it. But at least that will be within our own borders. I just don't see how it's the same thing at all, sorry.

I also don't see why Scotland shouldn't pursue a change to something its unhappy with just because people 400 miles away are prepared to suck it up.

[SantanaLopez]

You are being very obtuse, baba.

There's actually more people in the South of England than in the whole of Scotland. 8 million to 5 million. Do those 8 million people count less than Scottish people? Why? A country and a border is a rather arbitrary notion.

'prepared to suck it up' is also a ridiculously offensive way to say 'vote Tory'.

[Babanouche]

Try to criticize the argument and not the poster, Santana.

When I said 'suck it up' I was referring to the effects on voters in the SE with regards the flaws in our electoral system. So no - not an offensive way to say 'vote Tory.'