To make a PSA about extended rear facing car seats

[purplemonstermunch]

and link to this page for more information?

www.securatot.co.uk/car-seat-useful-links

And to ask those in the know to offer up any other useful information they have about the importance of extended rear facing?

The P&C supermarket parking space threads attract hundreds of comments; this thread could actually save children's lives...so could I also ask you to give it a bump if you don't have further information that could help?

Thank you

Hop - from what I understand the reason simply is because the UK government are still relying on old safety standards that appear to be inadequate. There are moves to change this. Consumers don't know a lot about it because of this and so manufacturers don't see the point.

Its not about prioritizing a child's safety above all else (if it was Id have posted about the benefits of keeping children in a room sealed away from the outside world with only air provided through the most scrupulous of filters).

We manage risk with every decisions we make - can't make decisions without info.
I wasn't giving the info for people who already have it, I was giving the info for someone like me who didn't have it until I saw it on another forum.

What do you do with the child who hates a car seat full stop?

My DD rear faced until she was 2, my DS until about 10 months.

When DS was born I had never heard of ERF so was happy to Turn him, by the time DD was born I had because of a thread like this, so I kept her rear facing until I couldn't physically lift her into the seat.

So whilst I YANBU to raise the issue some of the comments this subject inevitably draws maje people who weren't aware when they mmade their choice feel very guilty.

I have no idea, thankfully. But it's not the same - if a child hates something so much they are screaming and puking and the parent is distracted and there is a safe alternative, why would they not try it instead? If they still hate if FF then it's up to the parents to decide which the child hates more/what compromise they are willing to make.

Feta - where in this thread or in the extensive research you did does it say that ff seats are unsafe? SOME ff seats ARE unsafe because they are so poorly made that you may swell strap your child in with a pair of tights (If you used Which in your research you'll know what Im talking about - blow up car seat anyone? It passed the tests to satisfy ECE regs and anyone who bought it could not be blamed for thinking they were doing their best because after all it was being sold in the shops) ANY seat that isn't installed properly is unsafe because - and given that at any one time its estimated mire than 30% if seats ARE installed incorrectly and that most of those seats ARE FF simply because they are more widely used) Some ff seats ARE way better than others on the market. ANY seat is better than no seat. Where are you seeing me or anyone else saying that FF is unsafe?

Hop - who's saying they shouldn't? If my LO was screaming in the back seat Id be hugely distracted....which is unsafe. Id have to find an alternative option that was the best option for my set of circumstances. I might not be able to use ERF - I dont know yet. If I can't Ill use the best safest option I can. If my child hates FF big car seat my next safest option is doubt use the car...which isn't possible.

So then Ill be down a lot of money (by the scenario you're giving me) because Ill have blown through 2 car seats... so Ill have to adopt strategies to not be distracted and use one of the car seats.

I suggest turning the radio up very loud.

But Hop - Im not understanding your argument. You seem to be against people knowing about (or maybe the seats actually being manufactured and sold - Im a bit unclear) ERF because some children might not like it...are you also against people knowing about FF seats because, inevitably, some children aren't going to like them?

Hop, that's why we went for a 2 way seat (Britax Elite) so if he still hated RF, we didn't need to buy a new seat to go FF. But my point was that he didn't hate RF, he just hated not being able to see out.

I don't get the "view" argument against ERF? DD has a much better view of the world being rear facing as she can see out of her side window, the other side window, and the rear windows of the car. The equivalent seat forward facing gives her a view of a headrest, another headrest if she turns her head, and about an inch of sky between the front seats.

Thanks for the tips. Will look into Britax elite. I see the advantage of facing both ways now but my baby hates the car full stop!

Babylon - I think I did see belted bases as I was looking through some options but Im not certain.

Sorry , missed quiet's post.

I have a klippan kiss from incarsafety in Milton Keynes. It fits with either isofix or a seat belt. It has no tethers so is easy to transfer between cars. It is suitable from birth. The infant carrier part can be removed (like a maxi cosi). If you have a graco buggy you can then attach it to the buggy. If not, it has an extending handle so you can wheel it like a suitcase. It fits in my golf (though you do have to have the front seat quite far forward), and better in DH's honda accord estate. It was £320. A maxi cosi + base is about £200. An isofix group 1 seat is at least £100. So actually there's not much in if price wise. I appreciate though that if you use an infant carrier without a base, and a seat belt fitted group 1 it is probably much less than this though.

Yes ERF theoretically offer less protection in a rear shunt. But these typically involve slower speeds and slower rates of deceleration (because this relates to the speed and direction) of the vehicles). Also, the ultimate effect of these crashes is still likely to be a head on collision(as your car stops by colliding with something else). When I looked at the ERF seats, some did seem to offer less side impact protection than others. The klippan kiss has quite deep sides and wings to the head rest.

DS1 however was FF, and is still in his seat comfortably at 3.9. I knew about ERF but was put off by DH, and by the seat available at the time. I chose ERF for DS2 as in needed to return the maxi cosi to its owner, and to avoid the temptation to move DS1 to a high backed booster sooner than necessary to free up his group 1 seat for the baby.

I am really struggling with this. DS who is 12 months is already 15kg and is too big for his Group 0 seat. I wanted to buy erf, but the ones that which recommends only seem to go up to 18kg, it seems to me that I would be spending £350 for something that my last less than 12 months.

My ds hated rear facing, screamed blue murder for the whole journey. It meant I drove distracted, tense and probably faster than I should much of the time.

As soon as we tried forward facing, when he grew out of his rear facing seat, he instantly loved it. Loved seeing me driving, loved peering out of the windows and sitting a bit more upright.

I now drive in a much more relaxed, less tense, slower fashion, enjoying chatting to my ds and singing along to songs.

I know that rear facing is generally safer, but forward facing, obviously secured properly in a maxi cosi pearl, is a much safer option for our family.

^^ This!!

My DS hated being rear facing. He screamed and screamed on every journey. We do a lot of motor way driving and it made it tense and stressful. We didn't rush him into his ff car seat, he was over a year. But as soon as we changed, he calmed down and was happy as he could see us and look out the window. Now I can drive stress free, it's much better for all of us.

I resent the notion that I'm not keeping my child safe. Driving whilst he's screaming blue murder is not safe either.

Lamb - Britax does one that goes up to 25k. That's all I know. Its on their website.

Pobble - please read the thread.

I did read it thanks. I'm perfectly entitled to add my thoughts.

Did I say you weren't? You said that you resented the notion that you're not keeping your child safe - it woutd be reasonable of me to assume you'd only read the OP if you believe the implication was one of judgement.

Actually no that point was made about three posts down, please don't assume what I've read and what I haven't.

They do not fit in my car. Far better to have a correctly fitted forward facing seat than an ERF which doesn't really fit properly.

The Britax Multi Tech II goes up to 25kg (6 years). That's the one we got because you can turn it to FF when they're too big to be RF.