To make a PSA about extended rear facing car seats

[purplemonstermunch]

and link to this page for more information?

www.securatot.co.uk/car-seat-useful-links

And to ask those in the know to offer up any other useful information they have about the importance of extended rear facing?

The P&C supermarket parking space threads attract hundreds of comments; this thread could actually save children's lives...so could I also ask you to give it a bump if you don't have further information that could help?

Thank you

It's emotive because it plays on our worst fears. Not many of us are in a position right now to go and buy a RF seat but if, god forbid, we are in an accident tomorrow our agony would be increased by the feeling that we didn't adequately protect our children.

I wish that my son never, ever had to go in a car. I bought a M&P cushion seat because Which reviewed it as having the safety benefits of RF but it had the advantage that I could actually get hold of one two years ago when I needed it - an ERF seat was impossible to buy where I live and, yes, the cost was prohibitive. I don't drive so my son goes in the car with my husband, parents and childminder. Even if we could have got an ERF, I could hardly insist that my parents and childminder forked out for one too - I certainly couldn't have afforded to buy three and I imagine swapping it from car to car would be open to all sorts of errors. When I take him anywhere - park, shop, wherever, we go on the bus with no car seat at all. How dangerous is this? Should I never go anywhere? Thanks to this thread; I feel additionally anxious about my cushion car seat and his FF seats in the other cars he regularly travels in - I know raising awareness is important but there is little I can do except worry even more than I already do!

I think maxi cosi are due to bring outa rear facing pearl (the one up from pebble I think) and a two-way isofix base. I will definitely be looking at getting that when dd is big enough. Definitely more options coming onto the market now anyway.

Jelly - but you're doing the best you can for your circumstances. I once didn't have a car - I had to take DC on the bus, it was either that or hitch a ride to school with whichever stranger would take us. I chose the bus because it was the safest option available to me for my circumstances. Did I worry? Yes, but I was doing the best I could.

I didn't begrudge people who did own a car doing the best they could for their circumstances for their children and don't begrudge someone who can afford a better car seat than I can according to crash test ratings.

Should information be withheld from people just because not everyone may be able to implement that information?

Any car seat is was better than none, but I'm pretty sure most people would like to know which car seat would be the safest for them when applied to their own personal set of circumstances.

Purple - thanks.

Been looking at the Britax website. Some of their chairs are both rf and ff. they specify weight bands for ff. Does anyone know if, at this weight, the child can remain rf or if the seat must be reversed?

Also, can anyone recommend an erf for a non isofix car ( 2003, ford)?

Finally, if the seat is attached by the seat belt, does the seat belt have to be undone every time like a group 0 one? We bought a belted base for ours and it is so much easier.

Many thanks

Babylonmood - I think there is a Britax rear facing seat which works with a seatbelt that you don't have to un-do each time (I have been looking into this!)

Better still - if you go onto their website and find the model name you can then find the product brochure which lists a huge number of popular car models and sets out their compatibility with the particular seat - it's really useful!

Babylon - the Britax 2 way elite may well be suitable - you leave them belted in.

I was vaugely aware of ERF when getting DC1's car seat 2 years ago. He was 1 and had reached the maximum length of straps on the 0+ car seat. The cost at that time, and not having isofix on my car (not that old, but a an older model from first production rate) meant it wasn't a viable option. I went for a FF seat that could rotate and had good reviews as that seemed to be a safe choice, and was going to be helpful to me when pg with a sibling and lifting a toddler while suffering with SPD (which it was). I also had the issue of DS screaming every time he went RF, and being happy, and not distressing and distracting while I was driving. Like a PP, that is a bigger safety factor to me.

There is information about helping raise awareness (did you realise there will be a new law), and phrasing information in a way that makes people feel like they've made an unsafe choice, especially when it's not a totally open choice. Safety is rarely a clear cut issue as lots of factors are at play. All you can realisticly do is create the most favourable set of circumstances within practical boundaries.

There is a slow improvement in the last two years, now they are sneaking into mainstream stores- that's probably the biggest way to make a change.

I'll have to look into a seat for DS2 soon. I don't know if he'll ERF or FF. It has to be the right seat for my car (which is exempt from the new rules coming in), and FF might still be the bettter option in current circumstances. I don't want to blind-buy something I've never seen over the internet, I want to get it tried and checked so I know it fits properly.

Hijacking slightly but can anyone recommend an ERF seat that's easy to take in and out of cars? DS will need one for when he's at the CM.

As far as I was aware front facing car seats were more as secure for the child in the rear shunt type of collision, which is more likely on the journeys I make - basically what MrsCog said!

If you can't afford a rf car seat but you can afford a car I really don't see the logic. If you are so poor that you can afford to keep your child as safe as possible in a car then you are too poor to have a car and you shouldn't have a car.

Sorry, that's bollocks. Our car cost about £700. We have to have a car for work and due to where we live (out in da sticks). Spending that £700 sent us into our overdraft a year ago, which we are still struggling to get out of.

Sorry my phone left out pages of this thread. The collusion described where ffacing seats are safer is the only one I've had with my dd in the car.

We park vertically in bays outside our house, I had parked nose in, opposite neighbour have reversed in. We both drove out at the same time in opposite direction iyswim. You look at your situation & make the decisions that suit your driving routes/needs.

we have erf car seat, read up on the research and thought it was the best decision for us , it was expensive and takes up a lot if space, but i have confidence in its safety and am pleased with the decision we made, if asked for advice i would suggest people read up on the pros and cons and also suggest they visit our local independent baby kit shop, as the staff there are very knowledgeable and would find the best car seat for your car and child, forward or rear facing and then make sure its fitted correctly.

Excuse me Miaow? Wow. No it really wasn't. Wasnt my intention at all. If you read my posts its clear that my position is not judge or self-righteous. I thought I was giving helpful info. You're generally a lovely person - that was a really nasty and untrue statement about me. Cheers. I don't need to be seen as anything - I name change that bloody often that Im "invisible".

And since you're judging - your post is all about your need to to put a label on someone (bully, self-righteous) who you only know from one post.

Posters I am really sorry - my intention was not to "bully" or be seen"self-righteous". I guess I didn't think it through. Where should I have put the post? How could I have worded it better? I didn't know about this until recently and was glad of the information...where would brought the best place to put this?

I'm quite grateful to MN for informing me about RF so I could make my own decision to get one, so YANBU OP.

One last question though Miaow? If people don't have information how can they possibly use their brains to make best decisions foe themselves?

Looking back at my OP I went wrong by saying about saving lives didn't I? Im sorry - that wasn't intended as guilting or emotionally blackmailing(I've lived with that day in day out - its fucking horrible and certainly something I avoid doing to others) - it was simply a statement based on the facts as I read them - but I can see how it came across that way.

I am sorry to anyone that I've upset.

I ve just watched the crash test from the link.

The "child" wasnt strapped in tight enough in the harness and thats why it flew so far forward. If the straps were alot tighter, then the child wouldnt of flew anywhere near as forward as that model

The whole.seat flies too far forward, regardless.of anything else. Plus, the straps force all.pressure onto the neck.

Google internal decapitation - a very real.danger of a toddler too young being placed into a FF seat.

I'm sorry you have had a hard time purple. Although people are a lot more aware of RF seats than a few years ago, a lot of people still aren't aware of them. Personally I would rather be aware of all the facts so I can make an informed choice and actually was made aware of RF seats through a post on a forum a number of years ago. If it hadn't been for that post I wouldn't have known about the benefits of RF at all.

I didn't find your post bullying or self-righteous, but if some people choose to take it that way there's really not an awful lot you can do about it.

What erks me about this debate is that people often trot out the "oh if I just gave you the information, so you can make an informed decision" line.

Which is actually hugely patronising. I knew all the information, researched extensively and made the decision whereby my DD would be safest.

The thing to remember is that FF seats are NOT unsafe if fitted correctly etc.

The point is Fieta is that a lot of people don't know all the information. Just because you did, it doesn't mean everyone does. It would be patronising if someone said that to you alone knowing you were already fully informed. However, the OP's post wasn't directed solely to you.

Perhaps if ERF car seats weren't so fucking massive that they relegate the front seat as unusable for anyone over 5 ft tall, more people would have one? We tried an ERF seat (only one compatible with our car available locally - other option was a three hour drive to a specialist shop to try and see if any others would fit). It was HUGE. The seat belt went round the top weirdly so you had to get the child in by going through the opposite side door, or limbo underneath the belt. It was a nightmare to fit and whoever was sitting in the front passenger seat was at risk of knocking their own teeth out with their knees. I live in a big city and there is still no where local to go and try other rear facing seats. If it is so much safer (and a money spinner given how expensive they are) why is it so hard to see them, try them and get information on them?

And lets face it, if we were really prioritizing our children's safety above all else, we wouldn't put them in a car to begin with.

melonribena and MrsMook re your DCs being happier when they went FF. It may have been because they could see a lot more rather than the move from RF to FF. DS was much happier when he moved from his first stage seat to the next stage ERF seat as the latter is far more upright so he could see out the window better.

Of course, your DC may have hated RF full stop! I just want to mention this in case others have DC who hate their first stage seat and are assuming that ERF is therefore not an option.

OP, YANBU to raise awareness.

But if you spend £300 on an ERF seat and they are still screaming until they puke every time you put them in the car, you're out £300 and then need to buy a FF seat.