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AIBU?

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Original poster

to be shocked that Jack Monroe

359 replies

samandi · 29/10/2013 16:19

was on £27,000 a year just back in 2011?

This is a woman I associate with desperate poverty and yet in the space of one and a half years ? she managed to go from having a prosperous job at a pretty young age to struggling to feed her son?

At the age of 22 she had about a £20,000 net income, which is more than many people can dream about. £27,000 is way more than I've ever earned in my life and I'm over ten years older than her.

Am I being unreasonable to think this detracts a bit from her message? Or am I just living in a different world.

OP posts:
FudgefaceMcZ · 29/10/2013 21:26

Thing is, it does actually matter how long she was poor for, because she is touted as an example of how poor people should stop whining and live off tinned tomatoes and lentils indefinitely, whereas if she had been seriously poor for over say a year, she and her child would in fact have started to notice the nutritional deficiencies of such a diet in the long term (I've done it as a student and become badly anaemic, for example). If she was just being treated as someone who came up with a few recipes, then fair enough- it's the fact that she's held up as an 'example' of how people ought to be able to live off beans and fairy farts and never touch a frozen pizza/pack of cheap sausages that makes it important to question the narrative.

KirjavaTheCorpse · 29/10/2013 21:28

It's 27k she didn't have when she was food budgeting on £10 a week.

How much she earned is irrelevant.

DontmindifIdo · 29/10/2013 21:31

While £27k is above average wage, it's only just, it's not a huge amount of money and in the SE, doesn't afford a wealthy lifestyle. She was young when she got pregnant, so would have had very short amount of time earning that wage before she went off on mat leave. It doesn't say how long she was earning that, or what debts she had to pay off from study before.

She also may well have used savings to fund mat leave on the impression she'd be going back to work. While she was able to juggle work and being a single mother, that was only with family providing childcare, it does seem rather unclear why this arrangement stopped working, but it could well be her family weren't able to provide the care she needed and as it couldn't be bought (well, a live in nanny could, but would cost around £30k), she'd have no choice at the point they couldn't do the care anymore than to quit her job.

thing is, she might have made a bad choice, a choice than when looked at with the benefit of hinesight was a bad choice, but then there are very few people in poverty in the UK who haven't at somepoint in their life made a bad choice or selection of choices that led them to be in that situation. We can't just sit back from a better lifestyle and say "well, you shouldn't have quit your job" or "you really should have worked harder at school" or "well, you chose to get in a relationship with that person/have that baby" - we have safety nets for people who's life hasn't gone right.

ceeveebee · 29/10/2013 21:32

£27k is £1765 per month after tax. Full time nursery in some parts of London £1600 per month. Kind of makes sense why she would have given up her job. It's really not a high salary for a single parent in SE / London

TheAwfulDaughter · 29/10/2013 21:33

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murasaki · 29/10/2013 21:37

There are very few people full stop who haven't made a bad decision.

She's important I think, as she's actually putting out there what it's like to have to live on nothing, and eloquently writes about it, and brings it to people who haven't necessarily had to live like that , in a way that makes you think about it, and the sheer grimness of it. It makes (me at least) worry about falling through the gap, and understand a bit more how it happens and the consequences.

As I said, there but for the grace of god etc...

And it shows that the safety nets, if not inadequate, which I think they are, are badly administered, if that can happen. Which is appalling.

WithConfidence · 29/10/2013 21:48

My husband was made redundant and it took 6 months for us to get housing benefit money through.

Luckily we managed on my income but if he'd been single he would have been screwed. You would have had to save thousands to cover that amount of time.

I believe JM is a mumsnetter btw, pretty unpleasant to debate whether she should have aborted her child or how she (a lesbian!!!!) got pregnant.

WithConfidence · 29/10/2013 21:52

TheAwfulDaughter, I do agree with you about a father letting his child live like that. However, no way would I slag off my ex in the media in her situation because the important thing when you are not together is to think about what is best for the child. It could really affect his relationship with his dad if she did and that isn't fair on a young child who has already been through a lot.

Thisisaghostlyeuphemism · 29/10/2013 21:56

A 'huge' wage? Jesus.

So what do you call £35k - a gigantic, obscene salary?

And £50k? Hmm, they should be lined up and shot, the Multi millionaire bastards.

DontmindifIdo · 29/10/2013 22:06

Actually it doesn't matter what a full time nursery cost is, if you work shifts, you need family to do childcare or be able to afford a live in nanny. A live in nanny is at minimum £30k plus obviously having a spare room for them to live in. for most shift workers that include shifts outside of 8am-6pm Mon-Friday therefore, it's family that is the only childcare option. If you are single with an exP who won't/can't do the childcare and your parents can't/won't cover care, then there are no other options. No amount of tax credits will make a nursery open for business at 3am.

In the media she's very good at not blaming the people around her, but she's obviously been let down. Perhaps she thought that it would be workable with family, or thought that her employer would have to give her set day shifts under the flexible working request rules (I've heard people mix up the fact you have a right to ask for it and a right for it to be considered with the fact you have a right to get what you ask for).

thehorridestmumintheworld · 29/10/2013 22:51

I hope Jack will reply she is a great writer and will have something to say for sure! The unusual thing about Jack compared to a lot of people on benefits is that she is a very talented writer. This has led to her being able to get another career going, when many people in her situation wouldn't be able to. But having been in this situation even for only a year or so has given her the knowledge to write about the problems faced by others who may not be so eloquent.

WilsonFrickett · 29/10/2013 23:02

This is such a mean spirited thread, in parts. She is as I said earlier and as horridest has just said, a brilliant young writer. That's all. She found herself in a set of circumstances and wrote about them. She found she was good at that. Through that her circumstances changed and she has managed to create a new career for herself. I don't think she's setting herself up to be anything more than a working writer, maybe an antidote to Jamie's average £2.50 per portion 'bargains' but not much more than that.

Charles Dickens started poor, wrote about it, became rich, no-one's pulling him up for only living in a poor house for six months.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 29/10/2013 23:03

Sorry, but I agree with the OP.

I would consider that amount to be well off.

I think she writes nicely, and she is passionate, and I appreciate that. She is making people feel passionate about cooking, and she is getting her message out. Those are good things.

I do find it slightly galling that I have always considered myself to be fortunate and well off, and have still budgeted the way she apparently does, without thinking that made me a symbol of middle-class povery. I am a bit bitter about the way she presents that, but she is quite young and she will probably grow out of it. Meantime, she is inspiring people, and how many of us can say we spent out naive/daft years doing that?!

LRDtheFeministDragon · 29/10/2013 23:07

(Oh, and FWIW, I have lived in the South East, in fact in the most expensive bit bar London. So there we go.)

LRDtheFeministDragon · 29/10/2013 23:07

And 27k in the 'south east' is still rich. It really is, you know.

utreas · 29/10/2013 23:08

Isn't her problem self created though, at the age of 22 she had not built the financial foundations and so should not have had a child. 27k for a 22yo is a very high salary, it is at the higher end of the salary range for graduate schemes at major companies which are very difficult to get.

WithConfidence · 29/10/2013 23:10

LRD, I don't think she presents herself as a symbol of middle class poverty. She was in a shit place and started writing her blog, then got offered interviews and work out of it. Yes the media appear to love her atm, partly because she is young, attractive and middle class. That isn't her fault!

LRDtheFeministDragon · 29/10/2013 23:12

I don't belive her problem is 'self-created'. Having a child can be quite complex - we don't know how it happened. And statstically, 22 is a good age to gave a baby.

The issue I have is that she does not seem, from what I understand, to be being particularly honest. Her recipes could be so inspiring if she'd be truthful.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 29/10/2013 23:14

with -cross posted. No, of course she doesn't present herself as a symbol of middle class poverty!

And I don't blame her for the fact she's middle class and sometimes had to budget. God knows, I am. And I respect her for the way she did it. What bothers me is that when I read her stuff, she is not really very realistic/truthful about what people can do.

fatlazymummy · 29/10/2013 23:15

Honest about what? They're just recipes.

lisianthus · 29/10/2013 23:22

YABU i really think you need to read her blog, OP, because if you had, you wouldn't be so surprised. It is all set out very clearly in there.

Check out this post:

Hunger Hurts
I think she is fantastic. She is fortunate to have the cooking and writing skills she has, which she has not just used for herself and her son, but to advocate for other people who are stuck in poverty without her advantages (although those advantages would have seemed pretty illusory during the time when her son was hungry and there was nothing to eat in the cupboard).

She makes it very clear that every one of us is just a couple of bits of bad luck away from serious poverty. It doesn't matter what savings you have- it can all be wiped out. I know this myself from experience.

It is precisely because she had a middle-class upbringing that her message hits home to many people. No person is an island. We have to care about all of us in our society, from whatever class background, because it can happen to all of us and that makes it harder to ignore those of us who are less fortunate as "lazy", "feckless" and all the other rubbish, patronising terms you hear.

WilsonFrickett · 29/10/2013 23:26

LRD Her recipes could be so inspiring if she'd be truthful. - not sure what you mean by that, can you explain? They're just cheap recipes...

LRDtheFeministDragon · 29/10/2013 23:26

fat - well, no. If they were just recipes, they'd only be the recpies, and we'd know nothing else.

Particularly, we wouldn't be told all about prices of magic herbs that appear from nowhere, would we?

I do think she is great. She is so enthusiastic. And it is nice that there is a voice given to the thousands of people like her: that is good.

But it would be nice if perhaps we could acknowledge the actual problems.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 29/10/2013 23:27

wilson - she seems to think that her recipes are extremely cheap. They're not. They're quite cheap. That's all.

WithConfidence · 29/10/2013 23:28

Can you explain about the herbs, I don't get it.