to consider this an act of theft?

[Lillielangtry]

Last night I went into a pub, bought a bottle of wine and sat down in the pub garden.

We had drunk just a glass each when we were told to leave because the place was closing. We were surprised the barman hadn't warned us when we bought the wine that we probably wouldn't have time to drink it all because the pub was soon to close.

We tried to take the unfinished bottle with us when we left, but were confronted by several uniformed security guards at the exit to the pub, one of whom forcibly took the bottle from me.

We remonstrated, of course, but were simply told repeatedly that we weren't allowed to take drink from the premises. I asked if that was because the pub didn't have an off-licence - they didn't know, but I'm guessing that was the reason. Also, apparently it's a crime to be out on the street in that area (I was in a big city). Of course, we planned to get straight into a taxi once we had left the pub rather than waddle down the road swigging it.

Bearing in mind that security guards have no more power than you or me (many people think they are invested with some sort of legal power but that's not true - they are simply members of the public with a uniform on), was this theft, do you think?

I don't see how it can't be. A member of the public (albeit a burly one with a uniform on) forcibly took something from me. To say that it's a crime to be on the streets with alcohol - or that the pub doesn't have an off-licence - is no excuse, surely. You cannot take someone else's property in order to prevent them from committing a crime and for that to be legally OK.

I would have downed the lot at once and then thrown up on their shoes before leaving.

Can you tell I'm Scouse?

I have a personal license and work in the pub trade. Mapos staff acted completely within their rights, in my pub, I would have been annoyed if they had done anything differently.

I have taken drinks off people for various reasons, drhnkenness, overly loud, basically at points when I've had to chuck people out. I take their drinks from them because I have the power to do so. If leaving the premises, if we allowed alcohol to he removed, we are commit it a crime and could lose our license.

Don't know what the hell mapos is, but I meant to write door staff haha

I thought it was the official acronym!!

MAPOS

Sounds very official!

Read a bit more of the thread. If you had refused to let go of the wine, the bouncers could have detained you in the building until police arrived, and then police would have taken the bottle off you.

The bouncers are not able to let anybody leave the premises with alcohol after a certain time. Where I am it is 10pm, but I think that is city specific.

I'm a big fan of Secs 1-8 of the Theft Act 1968. Stood the test of time very well and covers just about all eventualities.
Victorians were good at drafting legislation too.

My friend has often taken an unfinished bottle of wine home from the local pub which is a chain. It also serves food. You bought it. Is it not yours to take? Is it because it was Sunday night?

It wasn't me Altkin but my df. I suppose to me it is like taking a doggy bag home from the restaurant.

Can you buy a bottle of wine in a pub to take off premises like they do in soaps?

Big bag it coat next time...

I always take home the bottle if not finished and time to leave... I paid the for contents, they are not allowing me to finish it by kicking me out at closing time... Although we normally drink inside and about 10mins before closing we move into the beer garden then off to the car

AFAIK it's the law that you are not allowed to take it of the premises. It's a pub not and off licence after all. YABU to buy a bottle of wine when you know you won't finish it before closing time.

Not all doorman are thugs, the vast majority aren't, a minority howver is, but that's not to generalise the whole of the industry.

Indeed - but the "Gopher Thieves" were not the finest, brightest specimens I've ever met. I was very careful to only mention them specifically - plus the fact that it was 1988 & standards were different then, no official bodies like MAPOS etc.

If you had refused to let go of the wine, the bouncers could have detained you in the building until police arrived

Which clause in the 2003 Licensing Act do you think the OP broke? Sure, it's a breach of the Premises License if it doesn't include retail sale, but that's not the OP's problem. If bouncers detain someone who has not themselves committed an offence, then that takes them into very murky legal water indeed. The act itself is a long read, but I don't see anything there immediately which would make the OP guilty of an offence, and the CPS charging guidelines don't mention anything either.

Yes, if the OP takes booze off the premises when the premises license does not include retail sale, the personal license holder responsible for the premises has a problem. It's not remotely obvious that that problem then permits anyone to prevent the OP from going about their lawful business. Can anyone point to legislation which makes it illegal for someone who is sober and over 18 to purchase alcohol (as opposed to sell alcohol) in breach of a premises license?

I was very careful to only mention them specifically

And then you made a general comment saying they shouldn't be hard to fool with the clear implication that all door staff are thick.

Actually - that's your implication. My thoughts were that as the booze would be in a bag & the OP would be leaving at the same time that the rest of the pub was being kicked out, it wouldn't be the hardest job in the world....

My off licence is for the same hours as my on licence, so up to midnight. Each licence is individual now though so even if they have a late licence venue their off sales licence may well only have extended until 11pm or midnight. Their licence should be on display though so you can always go back in and ask to see it if you really wanted to.

By the sounds of it the door staff acted appropriately. However I would expect all my staff to let someone know that we were just about to close if purchasing a bottle of wine for 2people, it's just good customer service really. We would also let them know at regular intervals how much drinking up time they had left so you could have chosen whether to drink it quickly or leave it.