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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

WIBU? Asking school to not use Mr and Mrs. R Bonkers

293 replies

bonkersLFDT20 · 09/10/2013 11:10

Got a letter from DS1's secondary school.
It was addressed to Mr and Mrs R Bonkers
R is my husband's initial.

I've just written to them suggesting they use more a more modern way to address parents e.g Mr and Mrs Bonkers or Mr R. Bonkers & Mrs M Bonkers.

WIBU?

OP posts:
farewellfigure · 10/10/2013 14:59

I like The Doctors Bonkers personally. But your's is right too Smile

MrsDeVere · 10/10/2013 15:00

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Jan49 · 10/10/2013 15:12

I'm amazed that anyone thinks it's "technically correct" to address a woman by her husband's initial and surname. Maybe according to a 1930s book of etiquette but we live in 2013.Confused

farewellfigure · 10/10/2013 15:12

Do children still get taught that 'Yours sincerely' goes with 'Dear person's name', and 'Yours faithfully' goes with 'Dear Sir'? Shall we abandon that too and all sign off our formal letters with Cheers, or Wotcha, or Lots of love?

Sorry, I know I'm being pedantic and formal, but I can't see anything wrong with doing something RIGHT. It's not rude or outdated, it's just correct. It's the same as decent punctuation and grammar.

farewellfigure · 10/10/2013 15:15

I am the wife of Mr A Bonkers, therefore I would expect my letters to be addressed to Mr and Mrs A Bonkers. It doesn't matter if it's 1930 or 2013 or 4,000 years in the future. It doesn't make me any less of a feminist to be addressed that way. It's just right! I'm still Mrs A Bonkers ie the wife of A Bonkers.

I love that the OP's name is still being used as the example.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 10/10/2013 15:17

I'm with MrsDeV rather than ff here.

Basically I think either the school should ask how you'd like to be addressed and make the effort required to follow that, or just address to The parents/carers of Child'sName.

Either titles matter a little to their owners (so lets get them right, according to person's own preferences) or let's not use them at all !

JassyRadlett · 10/10/2013 15:17

Farewell, at what point though does something that feels outdated and irritating to large numbers of people move from 'right' to 'optional' to 'I can't believe I accidentally addressed that letter to Mistress Farewell, that's been archaic for years'?

Who decides?

Etiquette isn't set in stone - always interesting to look at the news/feature stories about what's changed when a new edition of Debrett's or Emily Post is published. I frankly find the ethos behind it troubling - these guides pint out that the idea is that addressing is done in order of rank. A man outranks a woman. How are even tiny signals or overtones of that OK?

CloverkissSparklecheeks · 10/10/2013 15:18

I think it is different to address a woman on their own as Mrs 'husbands initial' surname, I think it is unnecessary as there is no reason not to use their actual initial, but Mr and Mrs 'husbands initial' Surname is surely not rude, its just a collective address.

farewell I don't think much with regards to letter writing is taught by schools, the poor efforts at letter writing when I have been looking at school leavers job application covering letters have been dismal.

JassyRadlett · 10/10/2013 15:21

Campion, your post was a little ironic. People are precious for wanting their correct title (eg Dr) but technically correct (husband's initial for a woman) is expected and accepted and people would raise eyebrows if you don't want to follow the 'technically correct' form?

Either you buy into the 'technically correct' rules or you don't.

farewellfigure · 10/10/2013 15:24

I guess optional is OK and if it offends people they have the right to ask to be addressed differently. I would find it really hard to change how I was taught though (I had parents who were very keen on good English, grammar etc and I thank them for it). I still think it's wrong.

I worry though that one day we'll all forget how to use apostrophes (etc) correctly as someone will deem it outdated. It's the slippery slope.

And don't even get me started on compared with, different from and similar to. The number of newsreaders who compare stuff 'to' something else. It makes me want to scream. And while I'm at it, 'There's 10', or 'there's lots'. 'THERE ARE, THERE ARE'

But that's a whole different thread. I'm going to make a nice old-fashioned cup of tea.

stealthsquiggle · 10/10/2013 15:29

Campion - I don't think it's precious. It's earned. What titles are not "precious" by your definition, then - Rev? Sir/Lady? Prof?

One friend does use Dr Maidenname and Mrs Marriedname interchangeably to keep her work and home personae separate. That works too bloody confusing though.

JassyRadlett · 10/10/2013 15:29

Call me old-fashioned but if I'm writing to someone I want that communication to be received as positively as possible by them. Which means thinking about how they prefer to be addressed.

farewellfigure · 10/10/2013 15:48

Yes, which is why I don't address letters to my bf as Mrs A Bonkers any more as I know it upsets her. I'm happy to do what people ask of me, but it's still wrong! Mrs means wife of, and we can't just change the meaning of a word because we feel like it. Can we?

JugglingFromHereToThere · 10/10/2013 16:02

I think we can and do change the meaning of words all the time farewell? Any new edition of a dictionary will include many updates in meaning and usage.

And I think Mrs has almost evolved to the state of being the female equivalent of Mr has it not ?

In which case it would make perfect sense to be Mrs SugarAndSpice Surname and not Mrs SlugsAndSnails Surname Grin

campion · 10/10/2013 16:08

Well stealth, I did say that some people regard it as precious, not necessarily me.
I had in mind a friend with a PhD and a stellar career who refuses to use the 'Doctor' title except at work.

There are certainly some titles that I don't feel are particularly earned- more right place right time sort of thing -but that's a whole other conversation.

farewellfigure · 10/10/2013 16:08

'Almost evolved' juggling, but not in this house where I shall stick my stickler stick of stickiness in the ground and refuse to budge, holding onto it for grim death until you will find my half-worm-eaten body shouting, 'It's wrong, it's wrong' until my dying breath.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 10/10/2013 16:12

"But why would you want to have a surname different from your husband's..."

Because DH didn't want to change his name to mine. Git. Grin

farewellfigure · 10/10/2013 16:14

You could always have gone double-barrelled Grin

curlew · 10/10/2013 16:16

"But why would you want to have a name different from your husband's, and then which name would you give your children? A surname is just a family name. It's not something you have to bow and scrape and 'accept' from your husband as he takes away all your rights."

A surname may just be a family name- but it's his family name.

JugglingFromHereToThere · 10/10/2013 16:16
Grin

Regarding the "almost evolved" ... it's a bit like how if a man says "My wife" it doesn't quite have an equivalent meaning to a woman saying "My husband" ... To me "My wife" still seems to suggest a slight air of ownership .... hence I prefer to say and hear "partner" but DH seems to like the word "wife" - bless him.

nowwearefour · 10/10/2013 16:23

This REALLY bothers me too. I took my dn surname as I wanted us both to our docs names. I did not take his first name, and I just cannot bearer when people say it is correct to do it. It is not correct and I ask anyone who does it to me to change how they address me. Not sure it is that outdated to have a name all together as one family- we chose dhs as it was nicer- but my initial is my initial!

Original poster
bonkersLFDT20 · 10/10/2013 17:06

Just got a reply from the school.

"Dear Mrs Bonkers,

Thank you for your email. I note the comments you have made that this way of addressing letters is outdated but I would point out that this particular format is grammatically correct. As a school, we will continue to use the correct way of addressing letters.

However, I have amended your salutation on our computer system in the hope that future correspondence will be addressed to you in your desired format.

Kind regards

XXX
PA to the A. Headteacher"

I think this is a good response. Acknowledge my feelings, tell me what their policy is but amend my salutation.

OP posts:
Original poster
bonkersLFDT20 · 10/10/2013 17:08

Any one want to make bets on whether the next letter will be informing us of a detention or informing us of brilliant work? It tends to be one or the other with DS1.

OP posts:
JugglingFromHereToThere · 10/10/2013 17:09

I changed my name with similar thoughts to yours nowwearefour

  • I liked the idea of us having a family name.
And using DH's surname is a long standing tradition - what all my ancestors have done before me. I'm very interested in family history and have a strong sense of tradition. I do feel I've always been a feminist too. The system isn't perfect and everyone makes their choices within that. But I didn't sign up to losing my first name - that feels very different to me
JugglingFromHereToThere · 10/10/2013 17:14

Not a bad response and glad you're pleased with it bonkers, but I think they could have been slightly more generous in the way they put things.
The other way is not "grammatically correct" IMHO.
They may consider that it is socially correct, or that it's correct etiquette.
But I think you're right that it's now an outdated form of address, and IMHO etiquette changes !