Why do you think behaviour in schools is so much worse than even 10 yrs ago.

[soul2000]

This is not a joke thread. I am generally interested as to how much the standard of behaviour has deteriated in the last 25 years since i left school.

What amazes me, is that teachers are not shocked when watching programes like educating yorkshire, that just shows how bad the behaviour of some pupils is.

Another shocking thing is that pupils who in my time would have been labeled a menace "ME INCLUDED" are now seen as upstanding pupils.

How has the standard fallen so far and what can be done to re address the balance.

This thread is in support of teachers.

I can see that this is a pointless argument. Schools will keep getting worse and worse and Britain will keep declining as a country as long as PC ideology reigns supreme in schools. We need to be more pragmatic, and less idealistic. Gove has the right idea IMO.

If you don't have inclusion you are narrowing social mobility.

Do you think that the education in Japan is superior to here (UK)?

Christ yes. Like night and day.

look around hun... we're not IN Japan....

You'd just exclude the 'booted out' kids from the statistics and society, would you?

Silver apples. Mumsnet takes the "PISS OUT" of people, who make mistakes with grammar or punctuation all the time.

I have been on the receiving end myself, it usually happens when you have a different view from the consensus.

Trigglesx I fully agree with inclusion but not if it involves a child being racist (I can't even repeat how severe this was. One boy lost 3 months of school due to being racially bullied in graphic terms), sexually inappropriate touching, graphic homophobia, calling 6 year old girls a 'crack whore', cutting girls pony tails off, throwing chairs at other kids, poking people in the eyes with a pencil etc etc. WTF should parents be OK with that for the sake of political correctness? My sons had children with serious special needs (autism/down syndrome) in his class with no problem at all but a child with severe violence and behavioral issues should not be allowed to disrupt the class. In some cases it IS bad/lax parenting but NOT all and not so with kids with genuine medical issues.

zower you are right. THe low level disruption really needs to be dealt with. WE had it on the run at my school with a 2 strikes and you're out policy. If a pupil had to be told twice, then still didn't do whatever it was, he/she was removed, no questions asked. Pupils began to 'get it'. Then we had a new Head of Inclusion who said she couldn't phone a parent to say a child had been removed from lessons for e.g. chewing gum. She wasn't prepared to say that the child had been removed for disrupting lessons by refusing to remove his/her gum despite being asked 3 times. THis may seem petty, but it is only with strict enforcement of rules like this that both NT and SN pupils get the peace they need to learn effectively. I get a bit cross about this

I find it usually happens when someone is correcting someone else and then makes an unfortunate typo. I think there is a term for it.

The "broken windows" policy works in schools as well as in general life. Combat low level disruption and you will stop a lot of serious disruption and worse from occuring. Zero tolerance is the answer.

Of course it's a pointless argument. You seem to think that disabled and SNs children have no right to a mainstream education and the law says you're wrong. I have to agree with the law here.

How sad for you that you think that upholding the laws regarding disability discrimination is "PC ideology" and means that "Britain will keep declining as a country" due to this. How blinkered and disablist.

I find it usually happens when someone is correcting someone else and then makes an unfortunate typo. I think there is a term for it.

Its called Muphry's Law. (that's not a typo!)

soul2000 I don't generally care HOW someone spells something...as long as I can figure out what they're saying.

Doris, my ds will start primary next year, but believe me he has worked harder in his 3 years than my dd's ever had to. He has worked hard to learn to sit, to hold and play with toys, to stand, and eventually to walk with his wobbly unsteady walk, to learn sign language and a million other tiny achievements that were seemingly effortless with my children who are nt.

When he is at preschool he works hard to even be in a room which has lots of children and things that he doesn't quite understand, but he has already achieved so much, with support. And yes, sometimes he does disrupt things, when he is overwhelmed or scared and can't communicate his needs.

And in turn, the children who are at preschool with him have learnt some Makaton to be able to sign to him, and have learnt how to be kind to a child who is basically scared of them. They are learning that everyone is different and has different needs, but everyone deserves to have a place and be treated with kindness. They seem to have got this at 3, and yet it would seem to be a concept that is beyond many adults.

By the time you have finished booting out all the undesirables I wonder who would be in the majority?

m.youtube.com/watch?v=sbMlHGEICuY

But what Gove wants is an ideal, it's his. His appeals to "common-sense" are no less ideologically constructed than any other point of view.

Doris80 for social mobility to increase, some the "haves" have to have less. There aren't an infinite number of satisfying and well-paid jobs for all those whose qualifications demand it. How do you think that will come about?

at Muphry's Law - very clever!

jellybeans has a point. my son came home today and told me his friend's mother was called a fkg c* but because the child had SN the teacher told him to just ignore it. This is surely a strange state of affairs?