AIBU to want to punch the mother I saw yesterday getting baby's ear's pierced?

[ElleBelly]

Was in Claire's Accessories yesterday with my 4yo daughter, and there was a Mum getting baby's ear's pierced. Bab must have been about six months, and was screaming her head off, made me feel sick. Cannot for the life of me understand why people put their children through that at that age. It's so cruel. And mother was laughing with friends about it! Have got DS second lot of imms this week and dreading it, pathetic,over emitional,hormone befuddled woman I am, and just think its so wrong to put a baby through that pain uneccessarily.
Sorry for the rant but I so wanted to give her a slap.

What are you twittering on about ? Her post was offensive. She does not have to be here to defend herself. It was offensive and I am not sure why she needs you to wade in on her behalf.

Plus I am still waiting for an answer to my question re my not having children theo.

Had mine done, at 15. Fortunately, I had a job with BUPA because, after getting one caught in a jumper, aged 22, by the time I was 24 one ear looked like /\ with it healed up and a gap at the bottom. I hadn't realised as my ear ring had held it together.

Cue (1990s) £850 worth of plastic surgery. Apparently a very common operation, particularly in those who had their ears done young, or wore heavy jewellery.

Now, surely, if it took 9 years for mine to "wear through" (and it was badly done, too low down) then after years of a hole, someone done young, in tiny ear lobes, is likely to ed up the same way.

16 stitches. Expensive op. All for my OWN vanity. How would my mother have felt had SHE caused this (and I had been forced to pay myself - not available on NHS, rightly)?

we may all make judgements at times but we do not all go about judging people who do things differently and pitying others it is so patronising

because not all of us think we are superior parents to others

theodorakisses sorry to hear about your friend, what is happening in syria is just terrible beyond words

Theo already answered you.

Right. So not being in favour of puncturing little babies makes me superior and patronising. Whatever. As a non-parent I am not allowed an opinion apparently. I shall leave you to it.

Rabbit, I know what you mean about Syria. But I bought it up because we all seem to have lost sight of the bigger picture. In the grand scheme of things, a pierced ear is not important compared to other stuff going on.

We can care about many things at once, but some things need more consideration, is all. Or to put it another way, some things don't need the amount of angst and hand wringing that we accord it.

Amrapaali - I know what you mean, I find it hard to watch the news most days because everything just makes me despair/cry/scream

Maybe that's why people are quite invested in this? Because it feels like something we could have control over, maybe through making it illegal in the UK before the age of 12 (?), or asking Clare's to stop doing it (boycott etc?) I'm not sure. It feels like somewhere we could possibly change things whereas with Syria I don't feel that at all

But maybe I'm a cow because I do feel superior to parents who do this. I might fail/make mistakes in loads of areas of my parenting, I try not to but I'm sure I probably do, but in this area I'm pretty confident I'm making the right choice. I have no problem admitting I judge though, same way I'd judge swearing/smacking etc

Would you still judge if you knew ear piercing was important to some parents and families? That it is do with a sense of well being? Not just physical, but also a mental sense of rootedness, of belonging, of continuing traditions that goes back many generations?

Nah don't punch her...

Hold her down and go nuts with the piercing gun, see how she likes it...

It might cheer the poor kid up at least

Not sure, I'd find it hard to get my head round that I think.

Amrapaali - sorry to harp on, but you haven't answered any of the points I raised in my post on page 15 regarding body autonomy, I would be very interested to hear your views on this. I'm afraid I don't believe that any religious or tradition trumps this. You clearly do, but I still would like to hear how you feel about it.

To answer one of your points, I do not believe that children should have to grow up in a smoking household, precisely because a child has not been asked if they are happy to breathe in second hand smoke. I say this as someone who did grow up in such a household, whose parents smoked in the car despite knowing it made us feel sick. They were twats in that respect, utterly selfish.

None of the comparisons you have come up with (smoking household - se above, scratchy clothes (no, never dressed DD in clothes like that, soft comfy clothes all the way)) hold water. And, out of interest, what exactly would happen to you or your DD if you didn't get her ears pierced - would you be shunned? Would God smite you down? I am genuinely interested.

Regarding long hair, as I battled with combing the tangles out of DD's hair today at bathtime I asked her if she liked having long hair, despite this, and she said yes quite firmly (to be honest, if I brushed it every day, there wouldn't be all these tangles). One of the reasons why I kept her hair long was because I though she would hate getting it cut, I could well imagine it would involve having to hold her down, which I won't do for hair.

Oh, and not having children doesn't make a jot of difference, I was very anti babies and young children having pierced ears before DD, and nothing has changed.

Amrapaali - yes I would.

I have no problemwith campaigns to ban piercing till a certain age, I have said I don't like it myself. It's just the insults and shouts if abuse against parents who do this is they have never thought to question it or challenge it as it is normal to them and their culture. Maybe they think there little girl will feel left out if she doesn't get hers done like all her friends and family.

Used the hair example as people just grow their little girls hair here as it is normal and often expected. what if I was from a culture where we cut our girls hair till they are old enough to decide for themselves as we think it is unnecessary and cruel to inflict the extra care and pain on them that there brothers don't have to suffer, just because the parent thinks it looks pretty. Why don't people question their own behaviour - maybe because we just accept it and it's normal to us even if it doesn't really make sense.

Amrapaali - yes I would

Me too. I'd still look on it the same way and it wouldn't affect my feelings on piercing a baby.

Littlemog
What you said was offensive and now in typical bully fashion are trying to make out you are the one that's being wronged, you cast aspersions on a huge swathe of mothers from African Indian Arabic (I could go on) saying you felt sorry for our children, my Daughter doesn't need sympathy from someone as judgemental and prejudiced as yourself she is extremely happy and proud of her cultural background despite of occasionally encountering bigoted people

I would still judge. All a baby needs to know at that age is that they are loved,safe and secure and to trust that their parents will be there for them and care for their needs; that is universal. They aren't aware of their cultural background.

Used the hair example as people just grow their little girls hair here as it is normal and often expected - again, simply not true, there are plenty of girls in DD's nursery who have short hair. I let DD's hair grow for the reasons I gave above (and because it seemed like one of the bonuses of having a girl, not to have to bother with endless haircuts - this is also why she doesn't have a fringe), I couldn't give a hoot what anyone else is doing, it would never even occur to me. If she turns round and says she wants it short - fine, she can have it short - though, there is a greater chance then of her wanting to do what the other girls are doing because she's a total sheep.

My mum told me in Bangladesh she remembers getting hers done as a little girl, no clean equipment there just a needle that has been dipped in boiling water then cooled down. Then child is given a boiled sweet to distract and bite on, whilst the needle pierces their ears and sometime nose too.

We are so lucky here I'd never want it done like that. Ironically my mum never got my ears pierced. When I was 18 or 20 can remember which, I got 3 done on each ear, went home mum went bonkers. She said you look like a rebellious punk kid what will locals think. How will I afford gold earrings for you on your marriage one set is bad enough but 3! She then did the classic Asian thing threw her slipper in my direction missed me as always lol.

I've not got my daughters done yet. Oldest girl is 6 she's been begging me but I don't want to deal with infections and she has a huge scream I kid you not like a banshee I can't deal with that in a store. I've given her clip ons which she's only allowed to wear in the house. I dunno I think they look too ladylike not for her age, maybe I'm prudish who knows I think she can wait till she's a bit older, maybe 10 or 12?

personally I don't find it barbaric even on a baby but perhaps It's because I've seen lots of toddlers with their ears done. Also i dont think it would anger me as it did the OP. But I do think its unnecessary. There's no need to beautify a baby in that manner, babies are perfect as they are. I think it looks out of place having piercings and expensive jewellery on little kids. 22k gold nose rings and earrings on a 5 year old I find it weird isn't it all too like the sexualisation of kids? You know mini adult clothing, bras for prepubescent girls heels for toddlers? Cringeworthy.

If I were living in Bangladesh or india or Nigeria yes it would be normal to me, but every country has their norms and its not the norm here. But looks like things are changing by the sounds of it?

No, MrsOakenshield, nothing would happen if I didn't pierce my child's ears. no thunderbolts from heaven, no one shunning us. I follow a very placid religion. In all honesty, if I hadn't done it, my mum would have moaned at me for all of oh, maybe two minutes. That's it. But I wanted to do it, see?

And I am not so presumptuous to suggest "my child, I'll do whatever I want to". Where I grew up, the ear-piercing was just a part of childhood, no different than graduating to big boy pants or getting your first haircut. It was an integral part, mind. That is why I cannot understand body autonomy or consent. It wasn't part of our vocabulary. You may argue that is bad.

And the deep rootedness of this cultural belonging is not something that can be easily or effectively conveyed to a different group. Comparisons with similar scenarios can only be so effective.

That is why when someone who has not even thought about or looked up how other people live, comes on a thread and says its abusive and they will damn well judge, it just raises my shackles.

For what it's worth, this is what we believe in. Ceremony. The thinking behind it may be just superstitious claptrap, but as I mentioned before, its about continuity, a sense of rootedness and belonging.

"I cannot understand body autonomy or consent. You may think that is bad."

Er...yes! Are you actually mad or just deluded, coming on a parenting website rejecting the notion of a child having consent over what is done to their body. Where does that stop? Your words make me very angry.

Actually unbelievable that you have posted that.

Periodmath
A child does need a parent to consent to operations imms and all medical procedures, they cannot give consent legally, your argument is flawed and as usual from some typical superior types, hysterical

Lookingforwardtovino
Your post makes no sense have you been drinking, I know it's acceptable to binge drink in some cultures

oh the drama

do young children give consent or do the adults looking after them make decisions for them until they are old enough to make decisions

i have never asked for ds consent to cut his hair, when he does not want to have a bath or his hair washed i do not think ah well i must respect his right for autonomy

it is something that comes with age and responsibility and through learning as children get older

and children being allowed to make decisions is quite a new concept to our society and a very middle class attitude have you not watched Outnumbered

GhanaGirl your posts are hilarious! Realised that you are a wind up merchant and not to be taken seriously.