To feel glad/relieved Ireland is voting through Abortion Bill

[ARealDame]

Its only a bare minimum - in the case of a woman's life being threatened - but it is also a massive sea change, on this sensitive issue. The vote in the Lower House was 127:31.

(Mary Kenny wrote very interestingly in the Times about it - saying that although the Church has played a role, much of the opposition was to do with Ireland's fear of "depopulation". Partly because of Ireland's history - famine, mass emigration. But also due to a rural pro-natalist mindset. In agricultural communities another child is "another pair of hands". In cities, another child is "another mouth to feed".)

That's a false comparison, bumbley. Women who kill their babies and young children are committing murder. As we've established, women who have late abortions are not committing murder.

Nope it didn't but at least they could be convicted for it. If you think that way then maybe we shouldn't have laws for anything - some people will break them anyway.

Most people have a conscience, and use that. Do you need a law to tell you not to kill your children? Would you do it if there wasn't one?

Hati? No I'm off to Spain in a few days!
I would never judge a country on the views of some people, or indeed it's history, but some of you are.
I am a modern woman from Northern Ireland, whist I agree that changes need to be made, I don't understand why it's any one else's business but our own country people's. it's a democracy, that's the point. It is not up to anyone who does not reside here, either in the North or the South to judge it or get involved. I think England has more than enough of its own problems to worry about right now, try sorting them out first!

I think focusing on a hypothetical 38 week abortion (something that basically never happens even where it is legal) is tremendously disingenuous when you consider the reality is, for example, the 90 women who became pregnant as a result of rape in Ireland last year.

The 90 that we know about. Obviously many more women will not even have been able to contact a Rape Crisis Centre.

So why do you steer clear of England then Nornironmum if you'd 'never' judge a country on the views of some people?

Spain has even more liberal laws on abortion than Great Britain, Nornironmum

And that's a ridiculous attitude, Nornironmum - so nobody outside of South Africa ought to have judged apartheid? Or nobody outside of the United States ought to have held opinions about racial segregation?

I thought I had made that clear in my post? Maybe not, because many many, though not all, of the people in England love to get involved in the business of other countries. Whist forgetting that maybe if they looked closer to home and sorted out the issues their own county are having,(and let's be honest they are plenty) we could all get on with our own lives.

Abortion is available in Northern Ireland as of last October thanks to Marie Stopes.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-20975653

Norn do you judge honour killings? Girls being punished for being raped? Forced marriage?

Well, given that the southern and northern Irish states export their women seeking abortion primarily to England, I think it's fair enough for English people to take an interest in abortion provision in NI and ROI.

I'm not sure why you're making digs at English people, I think pretty much everyone on this thread is Irish/living in Ireland/married to an Irish person, etc.

And people in the UK have every right to have an interest in the Irish abortion legislation given that they very kindly provide us with facilities for procedures we need.

Where would the ~1400 couples every year diagnosed with a fatal fetal abnormality who wish to terminate go without the UK?

Ironic LOL at northern Ireland being fine and dandy and "England" should mind its own business. If there was anywhere in the world that statement was so ridiculous......

Skyler - I was talking about your argument that women have 'reasons' for having a late term abortion as if having 'reasons' for doing something makes it ok.

I think some of the remarks have been bigoted to a degree though, and suggest that outside of making cracks, little genuine interest is taken.

Kobay - then why have any laws at all? Would you be happy leaving everything up to people's conscience?

Oh, I didn't know the English tax payer paid for this? Well that's fair enough if it costs the Englsih people money, though somehow I don't think this is the case.
If you read my posts again you will see that I am not saying sbortion is wrong, in some cases and yes changes do need to be made. But I am very happy that's it's not available the way it is in England and most of my friends who live here feel the same and the difference is they actually LIVE here.
Abortion is not legal in Northern Ireland! Maybe one day, but not now.

HoldMe, it makes perfect sense to be talking about a 38 week old foetus when you are discussing abortions to term.

Well, bumbley whatever a woman's reasons are for what she wants to do with her own body, they are all right with me. You disagree with that. That's your right. But I don't think it's right that your moral outlook should restrict other women's choices.

Also HoldMe, Marie stopes are still bound by the legislation within NI.

Nornironmum: abortion is legal in Northern Ireland, up to 9 weeks. Marie Stopes opened a clinic in Belfast last year.

On some matters, yes I would. This is one of them. We don't laws for every single thing.

From the make stoops website
Medical abortion service for Irish and Northern Irish women

As part of our commitment to helping Irish and Northern Irish women, all women travelling from Ireland and Northern Ireland to one of our centres in Great Britain can access a medical abortion service which can be completed within a day if you are between six and nine weeks pregnant. This is for the fee of ?420.

You can also visit our new centre in Belfast. The consultation fee is £80 and the medical procedure fee is £350.
If' you're travelling to one of our centres in Great Britain, appointments will be in the morning, in order to complete the treatment in one day. You need to arrive at the clinic by 10am so that the first tablet can be given no later than 10.30am. The second set of tablets will be given to you six hours after the first.
While we understand that you may want to get home quickly following the treatment, we advise that you stay overnight locally with friends or family if possible. This is because you may begin to experience cramps and bleeding soon after taking the second medication and you may prefer not to be travelling at this time.
We will give you comprehensive information about what to expect following the treatment and how to manage symptoms you may experience. We will also provide you with sanitary protection and medication to relieve pain and sickness.
To find out if you are able to have this treatment, you will need to have a scan to confirm how many weeks you are pregnant. Scans can be carried out at Reproductive Choices in Dublin, Marie Stopes Belfast centre or in a centre in the UK. It is important that you are aware that if you choose to have the scan at the centre and the pregnancy is found to be over nine weeks you will not be able to have this medical treatment and will be offered a surgical abortion.

If you are travelling to the UK for medical or surgical treatment please do not eat on the day of travel and only drink water in case an anaesthetic is required.

For further information on accessing this new service please call 0845 300 8090 (callers from Northern Ireland) or 00 44 845 300 8090 (callers from Ireland).

Norn you and most of your friends should have no authority over another womans uterus. If YOU dont want an abortion,then dont have one.