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AIBU?

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to feel saddened about " breast feeding covers

378 replies

Theas18 · 30/06/2013 12:43

lady on the next table in the cafe I'm in ifs beat feeding a lovely month or so old baby under a huge bib.

maybe she feels " happier about it" and all that but really. What do you see for a happily breastfeeding b baby-the back of a sweet little head? no big deal and very normal.

Why are we ( society) doing this to mums and babies. surely a 6 month old won't tolerate it anyway, so I guess they give up then :(

OP posts:
SoupDragon · 02/07/2013 07:28

I always think twat Hmm when I see people judging a woman for doing what makes her comfortable.

kungfupannda · 02/07/2013 08:43

Maybe the OP could have done her bit to reverse "societal conditioning" and taken her top off in solidarity with the breastfeeding woman.

Fine, we are socially conditioned to wear clothes that cover certain parts of our bodies. That is something that has evolved over an extremely long time. It's a bit artificial to expect everyone to shout "Bollocks to social norms!" and whip off their clothes and run naked down the highstreet.

There are parts of my body that I simply don't see the need to have on display. There's no practical purpose to it. I don't wear clothes that reveal my stomach. I wear short skirts, but not spectacularly short ones. I don't walk about in bra tops. I don't wear things that are so low cut you can see the tops of my buttocks. Some people do, and if they're comfortable, good for them. I personally don't see the need to show off these bits of my body. I'm not ashamed of them - I just live in a society where clothes are the norm and this is the way I choose to wear those clothes.

When breastfeeding, if there had been a need to have my breasts fully visible in order to feed effectively, I'd have done it without too much thought. But there wasn't, so I preferred not to. That is my choice. I'm not being suppressed by society. I'm just living in society and choosing which of the social norms I want to follow. I won't be dictated to by the rest of society if I choose to feed without covering up. Equally, I won't be dictated to by other people who think I should feed in a way that I'm less comfortable with.

Yes, if everyone stripped off on a daily basis, then we might start the process of developing a new social norm that put less emphasis on covering up, but it's not going to happen any time soon.

Yes, every woman should feel comfortable feeding her baby anywhere they choose - I fed walking about in a supermarket, in my office, while pushing DS1 on the swings etc - but new motherhood is an emotional and difficult time for many women. In lots of ways, a new nursing mother is probably the last person who should be expected to be a crusader for women's rights. She's got enough on her plate.

The world isn't going to change overnight. And no-one is going to change it by making women even more uncertain about what they can do without criticism from one group of observers or another.

Perhaps if everyone spent more time thinking about how to support new mothers in the choices they are comfortable with, we'd start moving towards being a society where women can be happy feeding covered up or entirely topless, as they choose. Instead of feeling sad that someone has chosen to cover up, why not smile at them and make them feel proud of what they're doing?

Or if defeating the social norm is more important than a mother feeling comfortable, take your own top off and start a campaign.

namechangea · 02/07/2013 08:52

Everybody's Kung Fu loving after that Grin

sashh · 02/07/2013 09:06

what kungfupannda said

Minifingers · 02/07/2013 09:09

To give you some idea about the massive gulf between attitudes to lactating breasts and breastfeeding between countries, have a look at this public information film promoting breastfeeding from Puerto Rico. (do click - you'll enjoy the beautiful song even if you're outraged by the images of small school age children and massive toddlers breastfeeding!)

Imagine this being screened on UK TV.......... Grin

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 02/07/2013 09:14

Indeed, yy kungfunpannda.

BTW reference to 'leering' in my post didn't have sexual connotations; but 'sly, sideways glance'. Irrespective, OP and like-minded 'know-besters' would made me extremely uncomfortable. Leave women alone to do what they feel is best for them and their babies. You can do as you like with your own,

CaptainUndercrackers · 02/07/2013 09:17

Well said kungfu

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 02/07/2013 09:19

Hmm boak, not the breastfeeding but the relentless attempts at brainwashing.

motownmover · 02/07/2013 09:21

To be saddened about breast feeding covers no.

I thought you post was going to read as being saddened about breast cancer.

I think some covers have really nice patterns.

soverylucky · 02/07/2013 09:21

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Minifingers · 02/07/2013 09:28

"Fine, we are socially conditioned to wear clothes that cover certain parts of our bodies. That is something that has evolved over an extremely long time."

What - you mean between the 1950's (when widespread ff began to make public breastfeeding a rarity) and today?). here

So as women have got more and more modest about covering their breasts while breastfeeding, they've shown more and more flesh in every other situation - on the beach in tiny bikinis, in public wearing skin tight leggings, cleavage on show in strappy tops, arms and shoulders bared.

Really - this isn't about women 'stripping off' to breastfeed, or being naked from the waist up and displaying a lot of flesh. I can't understand why you are insisting this is an issue of public nudity vs public modesty. We're not talking about women feeding their babies with their whole upper body on show in the pub. We're talking about the difference between a woman being able to unbutton her shirt, or pull down her vest, and allow her baby access to her breast, and a woman feeling the need to drape something over her baby while they do this so that nothing of her breast can be seen.

"The world isn't going to change overnight"

It will never change as long as normal breastfeeding remains hidden from view from children and young women before they have their own babies.

Seriously - completely covering your breast and your baby while breastfeeding is a modern thing. A look through artistic images of mothers and babies through the ages will show you that even in times when women dressed very modestly, showing your breast while breastfeeding wasn't considered immodest or uncommon. here

PoppyAmex · 02/07/2013 09:30

Would you pressure a woman to go topless on the beach on the grounds that she shouldn't be ashamed of exposing her breasts or allow them to be "sexualised"?

This is yet another stick for women to beat themselves with and instill guilt about personal choices.

Let's "be sad" about breast cancer or about babies who are being neglected and not fed.

Cheeseatmidnight · 02/07/2013 09:33

I have 36jj breasts and had to hold rugby hold to get a latch. I also cannot buy nursing bras which fit well so need to hoik(spelling) my whole breast out.

In my case my breast is 5 times the size of babies head and baby looks like she is holding onto a space hopper... Latched on an off so nipple likely to be shown...

Even a bf cover could not cover me... Need one of those tent jobs...

Society were not doing it to me, my breasts are a shock fully clothes on my frame, but out with a baby attached...

I just couldn't do it.

I do wonder though if I lived somewhere where bf was everywhere I may have tried.

soverylucky · 02/07/2013 09:36

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Minifingers · 02/07/2013 09:46

"Would you pressure a woman to go topless on the beach on the grounds that she shouldn't be ashamed of exposing her breasts or allow them to be "sexualised"?"

I don't believe the OP 'pressured' anyone did she?

Everyone on this thread who agrees with the OP also agrees that women have the right to feed their baby any way they wish.

We are talking about what the choice to use nursing covers says about society's stance on breastfeeding.

Do keep up!

or carry on insisting this is about blaming individual mothers as it plays up to a popular prejudice about breastfeeding advocates being judgemental and horrible

Minifingers · 02/07/2013 09:48

"And if the baby is only a month old, she might be struggling with latch, positioning etc."

And it'll definitely help her see what she's doing if she ties a table-cloth around her neck while she's doing it..... Hmm

CaptainUndercrackers · 02/07/2013 09:52

Minifingers - I would point you back to your own comments about breastfeeding burkas and mini tents. Wouldn't you say that comments like these feed the 'popular prejudice about breastfeeding advocates being judgemental and horrible'? I would have thought that, as a breastfeeding advocate, you would avoid negatively-loaded terms like that.

Minifingers · 02/07/2013 09:54

Again - the reasonable assumption that breastfeeding is only fit for public display if the baby covers the entire breast the whole time, and if no milk is seen, and if the nipple remains covered, and if the mum doesn't have to handle her breast.

There is massive squeamishness about normal breastfeeding in the UK, and most of the posts on this thread have confirmed this.

It's the prevalence of squeamishness and embarrassment over breastfeeding that the OP is flagging up - that's what the existence of nursing covers symbolises to her. It symbolises it to me too.

It really is a case of 'fish can't see the water' - ie that people believe that feeling 'yuck' about the idea of seeing a lactating breast is completely normal and reasonable. It's not. It's a modern thing.

"Modesty is what makes us human. It's a human trait. It's not something we've been conditioned into."

In the past women were massively more modest than women are today. But they stilll breastfed without the need to wear a tent which hides their whole breast. Again - look at the historical pictures of breastfeeding I linked you to and you will see what I mean.

Minifingers · 02/07/2013 09:55

Captain - it's the tent/burka, and the social pressure to be modest while breastfeeding that I dislike. Not the mother using it!

Minifingers · 02/07/2013 09:57

Yes - can I say:

I fucking hate breastfeeding covers. They are horrible.

I fucking love mums who breastfeed. They are doing their best for their baby.

soverylucky · 02/07/2013 10:00

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SoupDragon · 02/07/2013 10:03

It will never change as long as normal breastfeeding remains hidden from view from children and young women before they have their own babies.

Well, it's pretty obvious what the mother is doing under the cover and she, most likely, would not have fed in public otherwise so you could argue that the cover has actually got someone breastfeeding in front of young women and children.

ZenGardener · 02/07/2013 10:03

Here are examples of breastfeeding around the world.

It is totally normal in many cultures to cover up while feeding.

www.007b.com/public-breastfeeding-world.php

wildstrawberryplace · 02/07/2013 10:08

Meh, great another thing to feel guilty about.

FYI I'm very pro-BF and BF mine for 13 months but I also don't like my chubby belly or muffin top hanging out for all the world to see. A boob is no big deal but no way is anyone is catching a glimpse of my belly! I never managed to find anything clothing wise that solved that problem, so I never BF in public which was frankly a bit limiting.

I was planning to sew myself a nifty cover for next time around, but thanks, now I know that plenty of people will be judging me about that too!

CaptainUndercrackers · 02/07/2013 10:12

Well that wasn't really my point. Earlier in the thread you said that you hate it when women say 'baps' instead of breasts. So obviously you have a dislike of derogatory language and the way it feeds negative social norms. So if you are concerned about prejudice around breastfeeding advocates being judgemental, why use derogatory language when discussing other women's choices? It detracts from the debate. The difference between saying 'why do women use nursing covers' and 'why do women use breastfeeding burkas' is huge.