to make a scene on the train

[photographerlady]

I didn't but AIBU to just throw my hands up and really just make a scene next time. I commute over an hour to London on the train. In my third trimester of pregnancy I applied for upgrade for Mums to Be on southwest trains. Have the pass now to sit in first class if the train is full.

The past month I've sat in first class. I am slower now and especially after work when huffing my way to catch the train after quitting time I get on with only 5 minutes to spare. About five coaches down its first class (ten coach train) and its rammed so I get on and sit in FC as those first five coaches have no seats.

Today the ticket checker came to our carriage when we was moving she checked my pass and said that there were seats on this train I have to leave first class. I was more shocked but then she preceded to tell me that she could revoke my pass and I have to move now. So at 33 weeks I walked down two carriages on the moving train til I found a seat.

Now I am working til 35/36 weeks but after thinking about today AIBU to just say "No" next time that I am not moving and take it from there. I mean they can remove me from the train or say I am causing a scene but tbh I feel as though its not worth the strain and cramps in my stomach to hustle down the platform or weave through carriages to make sure all seats are taken before I go back to the pretty empty first class section.

What a bunch of curmudgeonly old bitches!!!

This makes no sense- are you expected to check the whole train before sitting in first class? You'd have to do it after each stop because it would be emptying? You could walk up an down 10 carriages 10,12 times?

Yanbu. Email and get clarity

MechanicalTheatre

When you use a service, there are T&Cs attached. It's nothing to do with people being 'desperate to follow the rules at all costs'.

If everyone just did as they pleased, as you suggest, what sort of a society would we end up with?

I'd hazard a guess that you're someone who begrudges paying extra for food if you 'eat in' at a cafe and you think that illegally downloading content is fine, too.

Although I think the inspector was OTT, you have been sitting in FC daily for a month (since you were 29 weeks) without paying for a FC ticket. The inspectors probably recognise you - and it sounds like you aren't even checking for empty seats.

Have you asked your boss if you could leave 5 minutes early (make up the time at lunchtime) so you can walk the length of the train on the platform?

You do sound a bit entitled, tbh. Unless there are complications with your pregnancy, it is reasonable to walk through a train while 33 weeks pg. If it is that difficult, maybe you should see your midwife and look at leaving work early.

Not read thread, but can imagine ...
Op yanbu to sit because you needed to. And, while its always better to get what you want by being nice, the ticket collector was bring a cow.
I am sure you have heard lots of " pregnancy is not an illness" and " I ran marathons at 39 weeks" but just ignore it. When I was 31 weeks I was commuting in and out of central London, and found it really hard, standing on buses when your balance is totally off is actually quite hard, and crowded tubes and trains, when you are being crushed and shoved are stressful. I nearly lost ds at this point, ended up in hospital. I had been of the mindset that I could keep doing everything I had been doing, just the same way, pregnant or not. And in heels...
The lovely consultant sat me down, and basically said " you are just going on as normal. But you are not normal, you are pregnant. Slow down ! Sit down! Stop wearing heels and running for the bus!" I didn't listen to my own body, but I listened to him and kept ds thank god.
I dont know why some women are so angry about the very idea of a pregnant woman needing a bit of extra care. Not everybody is as robust as everybody else.being ill in pregnancy also made me very aware of how hard it must be travelling when old and infirm, and they need to sit too!

HERE is SouthWest Trains Mum To Be Scheme.

It seems like a good initiative.

OP, I think you've had some really harsh comments on here (perhaps from posters without much experience of the joy that is commuting long distance on SW Trains).

Surely if the train is so busy that there are only free seats in the last carriage, it is within the spirit of the scheme (which is described as "industry leading") to sit in first class, even if there are one or two seats free somewhere on the train. And similarly, you shouldn't be expected to scour the train between stops in case a seat has become available.

Yes, you could ask someone to give up their seat for you, but the point is that the train company themselves have recognised that it is helpful for pregnant women to be able to sit down on the train and have set up a scheme to make specific provision for that. It's not "entitled" to use a scheme as it was intended.

It sounds like the ticket inspector was a bit of a jobsworth (I'm no fan of SW Trains, but I should add for balance that an inspector once offered me a seat in first class when I was BF, so they aren't all bad). I don't ink you should make a scene, you just have to say very calmly "I'm sorry you think I'm in violation of the rules, I have tried hard not to be and checked all of the carriages ahead of the first class section but they were all packed. I've been using this route for X years, and the last five carriages have always been packed as well, so I decided that these were the circumstances the brilliant scheme had in mind when allowing pregnant women to sit in first class. If you have been told that it is company policy to move pregnant women out of first class in these circumstances it would be useful to know so that I can direct my complaint to the right person."

The SW Trains scheme now applies to women in the last five months of pregnancy, by the way, so clearly not just aimed at the beached whale stage.

Alligatorpie- that's what I don't understand. So you get there in plenty of time to say, Victoria. You walk up and down the train and there are no seats so you sit in first class. 6 minutes later you arrive at clapham. Doors open, people leave and join. You're supposed to get up, gather your things, walk back up and down the 10 carriages through the internal doors to check their are still now free seats. There are none so you go back to FC. 1 minute later you arrive at the next station, people leave and join. You get up again and walk through the train.....

REALLY????? No one can be expected to do that.

Serenity - I don't think the op is expected to check for empty seats each time the train stops. But i haven't read the train policy.
I think saying to the conductor "when i got on, there were no spare seats, please tell me where they are" is reasonable. Causing a scene is not.

Serenitysutton (and others), nowhere has the OP suggested that the conductor expected her to check for seats in standard after every stop. She is expected to check when she first gets on, then sit down and stay put.

She'd checked the five closest carriages - inevitably the busiest but not the five furthest - usually the quieter ones, where she knew there might have been seats. There were, the conductor pointed this out (quite helpfully, saving her from having to walk through them to check and then walk back if not).

She has said she cannot or doesn't have time to walk along the platform to the far end of the train and start there, where she'd have the best chance of finding a seat, so she chances it and sits in first anyway.

She knows she's breaking the terms of her free pass by doing this and believes she is justified in this. It's probably because she knows she's technically in the wrong that she thinks reasoning with the conductor won't work and is proposing histrionics as a first response to challenge next time.

Her question, right at the start, is not 'am I justified in sitting in first' (she is certain she is and doesn't give a damn if anyone disagrees), it is 'WIBU to create a scene next time I'm challenged?'.

So, for all that I'm sympathetic to her need for a seat and think she could try talking to the conductor about it and trying to win her sympathy, I cannot help cringing at the idea that any adult woman thinks the best way to get what she wants is to throw a tantrum.

She'd be VU, make herself feel worse in the process and only increase her chances of being marched down the train and watched like a hawk on all future journeys. Not a clever move - and unreasonable towards her future self as much as anyone else.

But the end result is the same- if the conductor gets on at clapham and finds her there when there are seats available it doesn't matter whether she checked at Victoria- the Conductor doesn't know that.

I get what you're saying about dealing with it calmly and moving (although my major feat would be those seata are gone by the time you get there and you end up going back) not screeching like a banshee, but other posters appear to be insisting she ensure there are no free seats for the whole journey

I think there are some really snotty comments on here.

The conductor was within her rights to ask you to move, though I suspect most wouldn't be bothered. It is pretty difficult to check every carriage for a seat, when people are already standing in aisles and the compartments between carriages.

If there are lots of people already standing, it would seem that most of the seats are taken, or there would be no one standing. It is not too much of an assumption to think the train is full. As for asking people to give up their seat- well some of us just feel more vulnerable during pregnancy so I understand your reluctance to do so.

Personally, I would have a word with the guard as you approach the train and ask if the train is likely to be full and if so would it be ok for you to find a seat in first class? They will say yes or no, but it would save you being asked to move by one who is unsympathetic. Also, perhaps walk right down to the end of the platform before you board, as that is where there is most likely to be a seat.

I'm sorry but YABU (even though you seem nice) if you want to have a 1st class seat without the hassle of having to check the rest of the train you should buy a first class ticket.

The guards aren't always on the train from the departure point though- often they get on to check tickets at stations mid journey.

I don't think anyone is saying she should repeatedly scour the train. The OP is not saying that is what the conductor expected, or that this is what is expected in the T+Cs of her pass. The conductor appeared after the train started moving out of London.

Any conductor would see where her ticket was from and enforce the conditions accordingly. If these are 'check, then sit and stay put' then a conductor getting on later would not be able to say that there were seats available out of London, so would not ask her to move.

YANBU at all.

First class carriages on a commuter train are ridiculous anyway, but being moved from an empty seat at 33wks pg by a member of train staff is downright disgusting. The fact that you were forced to walk along a moving train is even worse.

As for having to apply for an upgrade...

I'm in my 3rd tri and commute 2houra each way on a train. I'm starting my mat leave at 34 weeks because its going to be tougher and I can't afford a first class ticket for that length of journey.

I'd never take a seat in 1st class when there were seats or someone prepare to give me their seat in standard. There are lots of people who find travelling uncomfortable for far less positive reasons than pregnancy.

I understand your position but YABU. Sorry!

No one has said the op should scour the train for any possible seat that might be free. Just that when told to move because there are free seats, she is being unreasonable to moan and consider making a 'scene'. A scene about what exactly? That south west trains have implemented a scheme which sounds great, and are simply implementing that scheme?! If south west trains introduced a policy whereby signing up for the pass meant a pregnant woman could always sit in an empty first class seat then that would be different. But the scheme is very clear that its for in the event of no other seats being available , to avoid a pregnant woman having to stand. Eminently sensible scheme, and I don't see why the OP signed up for it and then expects to not follow it!

It's not about an obsession with rules as some people are trying to make out. It's about recognising a good scheme and using it. Not trying to turn it into something else.

Fwiw I like the suggestion up thread.. The op could simply have smiled, asked where the seats were to avoid her having to scour the train herself.

Remembering, are you really losing two weeks' pay because you don't want to sit in first class? That's awful.

Which train company is it? Do you not get a free upgrade?

Why not email customer services and ask them to clarify exactly what your pass entitles you to? Ask them if it entitles you to stay in first class as long as second was full when you got on, or whether they expect you to move as soon as a second class seat becomes available. Explain what happened and then print off their reply to show any future conductors.

You should have asked someone to get up or ask the guard to do this for you. Some people would have gladly given up their seats, yes even here in that London.

I agree that the pass is ridiculous.

It's not a good scheme at all.

What happens to the unwitting heavily pregnant visitor to London who finds herself on a packed commuter train where the only available seats are in first class?

Under this scheme, she would not be allowed to sit in a first class seat.

A better policy would be to make all seats standard class during rush hour, which I believe south west trains used to do.

surely allowing a pregnant woman a seat on first class when she hasnt paid for it is a courtesy? making a scene? YABU, you want to ensure a 1st class seat, pay for it like anyone else would have to, you chose to be working at this stage on your pregnancy, chose to pay for a ticket you seem to expect, as well

The visitor can pay for a first class ticket (if it's a one off, the cost isn't so prohibitive) or ask for a seat in second.

The scheme is open to season ticket holders, but includes even weekly tickets ie not just the annual tickets that it used to be.

I don't understand why people don't support something designed to make the lives of pregnant women that bit easier?