To wonder about the age you give your kids alcohol?

[MatersMate]

so, this started with my Auntie and Uncle saying when you're 14 you cna have an alcoholic drink with a meal in a pub. Then we got talking about how old we were when we had our first glass of alcohol, my feckless Dad gave me homebrewed wine aged 8 and I was sick as a dog. Anyone have any under age drinkers?

I was quite a big teen drinker, the biggest influence was a family BBQ when I was around 12/13 and my parents got hammered and seemed to have an amazing time (they got the sofa out of the house and put it in the garden, played loud music etc). That was the damaging day which spurred me on to drink with friends, rather than the little sips of wine allowed at Christmas.

Luckily for me it was almost completely our of my system by the time I went to Uni, I was completely bored of it!

Oh and as for DS (only 2 ATM) once he's over the age of 5 I will oblige an exploratory sip if he's interested, but wouldn't consider actually giving him a small drink sized quantity until 14ish (depending on his level of maturity). The main thing is he won't ever see me drinking irresponsibly as I think that's the greater influence on young people.

DD had a small Baileys on ice after Xmas Dinner last year, she was 8. I admitted it on a thread here and got mildly toasted

I'll be doing the same this year if she asks (although that's not really likely as we are having a quiet one this year, only 5 people compared to last years 16)

I'm happy with my choices, and don't see any issue with my parenting of my child.

My dad used to dip his thumb in his pint and let me lick it! They also gave me about half a cm of champagne in a feeder cup one night when they were celebrating something. Apparently I took one sip and my eyes nearly popped out!

Dd has the same suck of beer from daddy's thumb once in a while. She was also given neat gin at a wedding this year because some idiot bartender had filled up a mineral water bottle with gin. Presumably they were intending to secrete it in their car or something. Dd took a sip and screamed. As did I after I sipped it. She quite often says now "I didn't like that gin." Fortunately she's not said it in earshot of the hv...

In effect we don't know but just in case it's better to avoid alcohol?

Er ... we do know.
We now know A LOT about the damage alcohol does to human beings. People just choose to ignore it.

Alcohol is defined as a class 1 carcinogen.
Why would you encourage a child to sample it?
What next?
A cheeky little toke of other class 1 carcinogens like asbestos?

I am uncomfortable with the phrase 'giving children alcohol' - I have never and will never 'give' my DCs alcohol, but equally I have allowed them a sip when they asked for it.
They usually hate it and never ask for any more thereafter.

Even that meta-analysis I posted upthread makes its recommendations with certain caveats.

The truth is we don't understand why some people go on to have a problem with alcohol (physically and/or mentally) and others don't.

The damage alcohol does in general is not the topic of this thread, bodhran, and I am not sure I follow your analogy with asbestos

Class 1 carcinogens - some of which are antibiotics, chemotherapy meds and medication for the treatment of autoimmune diseases.
One is arsenic - no, I would not 'encourage' my child to sample it, just as I am not 'encouraging' alcohol.

Alcohol is pretty freely available, I don't think that there is much point in pretending it isn't.

the damage alcohol does in general is not the topic of this thread

Says who?
Amongst people who elect NOT to give their children alcohol the damage it does is very much at the forefront of their minds.
It is deeply disingenuous on a thread relating to giving children alcohol not to acknowledge the significant health risks.

Every single cancer authority from here to Australia has upgraded their advice on alcohol as a known carcinogen in relation to at least 7 of the most common cancers. This is nothing new, it has been known for decades but people don't want to hear it.

My analogy is fairly obvious isn't it?
People would never dream of supplying their child with class 1 carcinogens like asbestos or arsenic - and yet are happy to let them drink alcohol.

Yes, but what we need to understand, as individual and as societies, is how we can prevent people to develop harmful relationships with alcohol.

So, does allowing children to sample alcohol when they are young make it more or less likely that they will drink more or less when they are older and make their own choices?

I work day in day out with the damage that alcohol does; that's a given.

What to do about it, is hard.

Would allowing children to sample weed or ecstasy make them less likely to use it as adults? So why is booze any different?
I was given a cigarette when I was 6 in order to "put me off". I started smoking properly at 11 and continued till I was 35.

4,000 children in the UK were admitted to hospital last year with alcohol poisoning.
There's reams of evidence as to the damage underage drinking causes.
www.drinkaware.co.uk/about-us/knowledge-bank/drinkaware-research/underage-drinking-evidence-review-october-2014

And yet we have a thread on a parenting forum about giving children alcohol. Very odd. And depressing.

Thanks for the link - that was the kind of evidence I had been looking for earlier.

I did not see the OP as promoting 'giving children alcohol', I still don't.

Are you teetotal, bodhran? Sorry, just being nosy.

Sips and Christmas from age four/ five . Glass of wine at weddings etc age 14 . Family parties occasional evening in on holiday from age 15. My eldest dd is 16 and still only drinks at family parties weddings etc she is very sensible and has a good attitude to alcohol. She never drinks more than two small glasses of wine.

DS had a thankfully very weak gin and tonic at 18 months. My mum had left about 1/4 of a glass on the side table and suddenly heard ds putting the glass down. He staggered about for a bit and slept very well. We certainly didn't give it to him intentionally though.

DD is 9 has had sips of champagne at christmas last year but only tiny amounts - maybe a centimeter or less in champagne flute She said she doesn't really like it but had it to be politee

Gave my kids a snowball at Xmas from about 4 on. Watered down further with lemonade. They were never up at 3am looking for Santa

Seriously, my 15 yo is now totally anti alcohol and wont even have her snowball. At an Age where many of her peers are discovering the cider, she would rather have a herbal tea.

Mine have all had sips of our drinks if they asked for them from being 5 onwards. They never particularly liked any of them though. That said, no2 son once downed a whole glass of black russian once when I left it on the side and his father wasn't watching and I have never felt like such a bad parent in my life :( - luckily he was fine though - he was about 3 at the time!
My youngest three (who are still at home) are now 12, 10, and almost 8, and they have a snowball on Christmas Eve before bed, one with their Christmas lunch, and one on NY Eve before bed. Said snowballs have about a teaspoon of advocaat topped up with lemonade and several cherries on a stick to stir them with, so are hardly "the hard stuff"
I vaguely remember my dad giving me a can of lager/beer once when I was very small (maybe 4 or so) and being all giggly, but then I didn't have alcohol again until I was old enough to go out drinking round town (so 13 )
I'd much rather my DCs thought of alcohol as just a drink choice if it's what they fancied so to speak, rather than being a Big Deal or something people only drink to get drunk iykwim. And I definitely wouldn't want them to think of it as "forbidden fruit" as that would probably just make them want gallons of it!

Interesting question. No DC yet so can only speak from my own memories. When I was around 12, I think, I started having a shot glass of red wine with Sunday lunch - I think I upgraded to a very small glass as a rite of passage when I was 15 or 16?! I also remember one or two fairly tipsy evenings in my parents' company - family weddings where I got a 'grown-up' sized glass of champagne etc!

I think I probably do drink a bit too much as an adult but I think that's more to do with the culture of the career path I'm currently on, rather than drinking alcohol as a young teen. Certainly the first time I ever got really awfully drunk was away at university for the first time. I was a really goody-two-shoes so that shot glass of wine was pretty much it: never got drunk at parties etc mainly because I never went to any.

I'll offer them a drink when it is legal to do so.

I see no reason whatsoever that a child needs to taste alcohol or see it as normal or anything. Alcohol is for adults and then in moderation. Giving your 5 year old a token small glass of beer or your 8 year old a weak snowball is grand if that's what you want to do - but it certainly isn't a scientifically proven way to make sure your children grow up with a good attitude to alcohol. And to me it only ensures your children receive the message loud and clear (as if the entire of society/media etc isnt singing it loud enough) that life and celebrations are better with alcohol. that's not for me. I don't judge anyone else. Well actually I would think anyone giving their child under the age of 14 an actual alcoholic drink is mad in the head but I wouldn't be calling social services or anything - just saying nowt as queer as folk.

There are lots of things I label as "forbidden fruit" (without using those words) - cigarettes, unprotected sex, drugs, etc. I don't think doing so will push my children into them so why should alcohol be any different?

Can you forgive that would be age five then? Because five is the legal age.

The only alcohol I was ever given by my parents was whiskey from my (Scottish) father when I was sick as part of a hot toddy.

I never got hammered while at Uni but did drink occasionally. I don't like the lack of control.

I'm in my 30's now and teetotal.

To be frank, I feel quite bad for anyone who say they "need" a wine to relax, or they "deserve" a drink after a long, hard day... I can't imagine being dependent like that for my relaxation - that's why there's baths! As for drinking the occasional at a party, I plan to show our kids that alcohol isn't needed there either. There's way too many other options. Sparkling Apple Cider is a delicious (an non-alcoholic) substitute for special occasions. In fact, I have some in the fridge :D

Why would you give your 5 year old a drink at Christmas?
Not aimed at the poster who has just said this, plenty of people have said they do so

If I think about my broad friendship circle, there's very little correlation between how much/often people's parents drink/ drank and how much they drink. I think personality, social circle, extent of social life etc. are more important factors. To be frank, some people just like getting a bit pissed more than others. Some people's lives present them with more occasions at which alcohol is served than others. I'm not even sure it's about finding other ways to relax- some of my sportiest friends are also the biggest piss heads (I believe it's known as the "Gym n' Tonic" phenomena).

On that basis, I think you just have to be honest with your kids, not demonise it, but make them aware of the pitfalls. My ds is 4 and has started asking why people smoke even though it stinks (in his opinion). I'm sure the same questions about drink and drugs will arise. What can you do but answer along the lines of "they like the taste, it helps them relax, they get a bit of a buzz from it, but if you do it too much it can be hard to stop."

DCs are 16, 14 & 13. We let them sniff the wine we have with dinner, that's what we do before we drink it & then they usually say it's horrible & give the glass back. oldest child goes to lots of parties but doesn't drink, I didn't either at that age. The other 2 don't drink or go to house parties where alcohol is served.

My dd will not be having alcohol until she is in secondary school at least and even then it will be very very watered down if she has it at all . If she wants to join in with the adults at Christmas dinner etc she'll have shloer as a special drink.
I'm not puritanical and I do have the occasional drink but alcohol is a dangerous toxin and we've normalised it's use but it doesn't make it safe for anyone.

I was allowed to have shandy and Babycham (i think that's how it's spelt!) when I was around 8 years old. I don't drink at all now and haven't since my early twenties, so it obviously didn't have a detrimental affect on me!

8/10 probably for sip of beer or champagne at family event. We don't drink at home much. Probably let my boys have weak shandys at 10 same as my parents did (drop of beer in huge glass lemonade lol)