To encourage my girls to do pageants?

[Sparklymommy]

Ok, sure I am going to be blasted here, however:

I am in the UK, where the pageant scene isn't nearly as bad as it is in the USA. My daughters WANT to compete and ooze confidence and stage presence. They both already perform in dance festivals and talent shows and love the whole dressing up, being beautified thing. My eldest is 10, my youngest 4 next month.

I would never "expect" them to win, or put pressure on them if they didn't do well. I am not into "sexualising" them or turning them into mini adults I just think they would enjoy the experience and it would be good for them.

Well. Why are you asking then? Clearly all nine million of us are wrong....but you are right, so go ahead.

I still think its revolting, sorry.

The whole "socialising, making friends, raising money for charity, judged on personality" is so disingenuous, OP.

I did.
I think the sparkles brought out the worst in me.

Why, OP, do you think it is healthy to encourge your dds in the attitude that dance is all about competition and winning prizes? There must be something wrong with the dance group they are currently with if that is the prevailing attitude. Can't imagine any dance or drama teachers round here who wouldn't stamp firmly on that attitude.

Surely most areas of the performing arts (not to mention mainstream education and life in the workplace) are about developing your own skills and ability to work with others, not stropping because you aren't getting a prize.

Developing personality = the kind of personality that you need to get on in life, is something far different from "look, look at me" attitude developed by competing in pageants.

If I were you I would try to get the girls into reputable dance and drama schools where they will learn to perform as part of a group and pull together for the good of the show rather than to be picked by an adjudicator. Those are far more valuable life skills and are also very good for developing confidence.

My 16yo started dancing at 4, moved on to drama and is about to start her A-levels in theatre studies and performing arts. She takes part in at least 4 shows a year, sometimes as the lead, sometimes as a humble crowd member. Success to her doesn't mean being picked by an adjudicator, but being part of the success of the show. Whatever she does in life, I think she has learnt something that will stand her in good stead.

They are about personality. They tend to have four rounds (or outfits, talent, formal, themed and outfit of choice) and its about the child. ermmmm if its about personality and not looks why do they need 4 different outfits to show their personality? YABU and know they are heavily frowned upon and looking for a glimmer of acceptability, apart from a room full of other mothers living vicariously through their children, you wont find justification for this anywhere

"Beautifying"?! Are they not beautiful enough as they are???

OP pageants are just grubby. No one with trully talented DC would put them in. No one with any intelligence would put them in.

If they want to perform, then they need to understand that it is all about craft and hard graft. Theyw ill need to work and work and work some more...it aint all sparkles and tiaras.

cory you misunderstand me. The school my girls attend do not put a lot of emphasis on winning. It is children we see at festivals from other schools who have a 2nd isn't good enough attitude. My daughters school enters many groups, with the ethos of all are equal and anyone who wants to be in a group can. We do not have "hand picked" kids.

For those parents whose kids don't play at princesses, I bet they do when they are away from you! If not I feel sad for them. Make believe and role play are important parts of being a child.

It all sounds very passive.

Being beautified, waiting in line to be picked by an adjudicator, even the dancing they do seems to be about being picked and assessed by a judge rather than about doing and learning.

The "personality" the OP talks about seems another word for "attracting the eye of the adjudicator".

op why would you want other people to judge your children in such a way

ok there may be some talent involved a little tap dance but it is mainly about how they look

i can not get why anyone would put their child forward for this what if they come last what message does that give them they do not have the right look to do well and if they come first it is about how they look

it is very fucked up

How the fuck do you play at being a princess?

Unveil a plaque at a new Swimming Pool in Dudley?

Practice looking bored at the trooping of the colour?

Have explicit phone calls bugged and then reprinted by tabloid newspapers?

Doesn't sound much like fun to me.

OP - did you not feel pretty or noticed when you were younger? I just always think that parents who push their children into these things are playing out their own insecurities. Having always been gorgeous I don't feel the need.

You obviously are going to do it, anyway, so why ask a group of intelligent, independent minded women, unless you are looking for controversy? If you want more than to start a bunfight, go to the pageant boards. There are loads of insecure, sequin-headed pushy mums on those. They'll lap you up.

Umm ... Both my boys do drama club - they love it and it certainly builds confidence - but if I had a daughter I'd be totally against her doing a pagent as they're basically a cattle market and can't be a good thing for their sense of self worth.

That said, my niece was Carnival Princess and it doesn't seem to have done her any harm ... She's off at Uni and seems to be pretty laid back about how she looks.

Going to Brownies and playing/dressing up aren't the same things as being entered into a pageant, OP, and I think you know that.

Sparklymommy Fri 17-May-13 08:45:09
"cory you misunderstand me. The school my girls attend do not put a lot of emphasis on winning. It is children we see at festivals from other schools who have a 2nd isn't good enough attitude. My daughters school enters many groups, with the ethos of all are equal and anyone who wants to be in a group can. We do not have "hand picked" kids."

But just now you felt it wasn't any different from dancing, because they would still be waiting to be picked by an adjudicator on very similar criteria.

"As for dance being about the performance, yes and no. Most of the time you can tell which child an adjudicator will pick before they have even danced. The skinny one with good turnout and a long neck. For me, pageants appear to be more inclusive in that sense."

This doesn't seem a vindication of pageants to me, more like an indication that the dancing your dds are doing is possibly not the best for their development. Around here, dancing is about learning skills and putting them together for the good of the show.

Why does dancing have to be competitive? Why not do it to give other people pleasure? The members of a symphonic orchestra or a theatre company don't compete against one another- and they wouldn't be any better at what they did if that was the way they worked.

Compos

Dance awkwardly with John Travolta
Perfect Well-Bred Rabbit in Headlights look
Parade around in the finest examples of regrettable 80s fashions

For those parents whose kids don't play at princesses, I bet they do when they are away from you! If not I feel sad for them. Make believe and role play are important parts of being a child.

Is playing at being a princess the only make believe an role play then?

Only I used to make believe I was a school teacher/shop owner/vet/police officer. The list is endless actually but never included being a princess.

I had no idea there would be grown women feeling 'sad' for me

Eughh just eugghhh

Ok - I get what you mean by having stage presence and oozing confidence at age 3. Dd does Baby Ballet and is in a class with little girls aged nearly 2 to just 3. The is a little girl who has just joined the class who is just like that.

But - that doesn't mean that she should be doing beauty pageants. I don't really think that personality is very important - it's all about the looks and the outfits etc.

And if you really believe that your daughter's ballet competitions is all about who is the skinniest then that is a really good reason to stop doing the ballet competitions - not to start doing more things that judge by appearance.

Why even bother posting on AIBU? It's clear you're not here to get people's opinions, but to try and persuade us that what you want to do is a good thing. People don't agree with you, they've given their opinions. Deal with it.

I'm starting to wonder if this is the most misguided stealth boast ever.