To tell my friend I cant see her because of her 3 yo dd?

[bubbagee]

8 months ago, we moved to a new area and I got friendly with a lovely group of women who all have dc's the same age as my ds (3). I became especially good friends with one of the mums as we have very similar interests.

The problem is how her 3 yo dd acts/behaves when she is at my house. She gets hysterical if she asks me, her mum or my ds to do something/say something and we either don't hear her/don't understand what she wants us to do. For example, she wanted ds to play pat a cake and he just couldn't really get the hang of it and she went into this absolute rage of tears, really deafening screaming and almost vomited because she was so worked up. She is a big girl, twice the size of my ds (they are 2 weeks apart in age) and really gets in your face. She gets really angry if me and her mum are talking about something which doesn't include her and will scream this awful high pitched sound until we stop talking and focus all attention on her.

This happens EVERY TIME they come over and if we go their house, even if we meet out.

The problem is, my ds just cant handle it. They came over yesterday and ds went and hid under the bed. When I went up to see what was wrong he was sobbing saying her screaming hurts his ears. They had only just walked in the door and already he was anticipating the drama. When she is having these episodes, my friend cuddles her and tries to placate her by singing but it just doesn't work. When they are at my house, her dd refuses to go home and yesterday they were here for 7 hours because every time she tried to get her shoes on she would just have an absolute meltdown. My friend believes in gentle discipline as do I, but I cant expose my ds to this any longer. yesterday was the final straw. I felt like id been battered mentally. He asks me every morning if they are coming over and has a really nervous look on his face. AIBU to talk to my friend about this and say I cant see her because of this? I would suggest we meet up just the two of us, but I know she wouldn't do this because she doesn't like leaving her dd.

[shoppingbagsundereyes]

That should read 'pre SEN diagnosis'

[Nehru]

what do you wish she had done now Shopper?
to help the OP?

I mean if she had said " i need to meet sometime" then wanted to chat to you about seeing someone about s1

[shoppingbagsundereyes]

The same summer I took ds and dd to Nehru's house. She spent the weekend noticing all the lovely things he did, how bright he was etc and sent me off for a massage she treated me to and looked after my dcs. That's a good friend.

[Nehru]

oh i DID

I am so fucking loverly

[shoppingbagsundereyes]

I think you don't need to like one another's kids to be friends. She and I had been friends for 15 years before I had ds, that should have been worth something. I would have preferred her to say nothing about my son, suggest we meet for a girls only day and listened if I wanted to talk about his problems.

[shoppingbagsundereyes]

[Maggie111]

Just explain that your children aren't "meshing" aqnd your son is finding it difficult and that you'd like to continue to meet up, but at her house or without children.

As soon as the daughter gets into a fit, put your cup down and leave with your son.

I'm sure the Mum will appreciate some company away from her child - you don't have to offer physical support during tantrums - some light relief away from them might do her good too.

[greenformica]

My good friends child used to attack mine aged 2/3. It used to upset us all but at least I could see that my friend was attempting to discipline her child. We would openly discuss the problem/discuss toddler taming books but in the end I had to say to the mum that my DS found her child's behaviour too distressing and can we just meet as adults in the evenings for a while. My friend was very receptive to this and could see how it must have been for my DS - not that I went on about it.

We had a break for a couple of months and it was better when we met next time. The child had been very very disappointed not to see my DS for such a long time but also knew it was due to his behaviour.

Roll on many years and they are 11 and best friends. My friends child has really blossomed.

[DontstepontheMomeRaths]

Everyone's said it already but I do not agree with saying you're under the weather and making excuses. It's all so passive. You need to learn to be assertive.

Why didn't you say to her, 'I need to get on now, can I help you out to the car with your things?' And she could have carried her DD out. Why did you allow it to drag on for 7 hours.

I really think you need to be honest, but not in an unkind way and soon, otherwise when you finally tell her the truth it'll hurt more, when she realises you've been making excuses for a while.

My DS behaves very much like her and he's 4, he's in the process of being assessed though. However I carry him out if he's not behaving. I wouldn't remain in someone's house for 7 hours.

Can you suggest doing a Surestart centre Parenting Course together in the evening, as you'd love to go and have some company? You'd both learn a lot and it could help her immensely.

[pictish]

When she is having these episodes, my friend cuddles her and tries to placate her by singing

Holy fuck.

[pictish]

I agree OP - she is begging for boundaries that wee lass.
She is effectively saing "do something about me!"

Her mother sounds utterly ineffective.

[greenformica]

If you do ring and talk to her concentrate on your DS finding things too stressful and being scared of seeing her. You don't have to talk about her childs behaviour but more the way your child responds to it.

The alternatives are - meet in a public place and leave if her child kicks off. Text your friend before meeting saying 'I'm planning to leave if my son son gets stressed during the play date. Please don't worry if I scarper off and leave you xx'. Make sure you follow through.

[bubbagee]

Dontstep you're right, I am really chicken shit and a massive avoider

I should have been more assertive at the time - I guess I was just pulling sympathetic 'poor you' faces and felt that insisting they left would be unkind.

[DontstepontheMomeRaths]

Yes assertiveness can feel uncomfortable to begin with but it doesn't have to be rude.

Read this book, it'll change your life in my opinion. Another mner recommended it to me a while ago.

Especially now you're a Mum, there are so many situations where you need to stand your ground. Well maybe that's just me and my relatives

[pictish]

Look - if she is prepared to syop in someone else's house for 7 hours rather than pick up her child and march her out, then your friend has some boundary issues herself.

None of us here would be so selfish and ineffectual. None of us. What an invasion!

I'd never have her back. I'm on my third kid and have seen this sort of thing before. I too have ditched nice women over the behaviour of their children...as when it's a friend, you know when the problem really lies with the parenting.

Aint nobody got time for none of that shit.

[Bobyan]

I think in this case;
Gentle discipline = no discipline

As the proud owner of a 5 year old little git, I would have been mortified to have inflicted his three year old self on anyone for 7 hours.

Thankfully he's now still a handful, but a bit if a charmer!

[pictish]

syop?
stop

[YouTheCat]

I'm with Pictish on this.

That kid needs some boundaries. When has singing to a stroppy tantrummy child ever worked? And 7 hours?

She's the parent and this is just going to get worse. I know someone who took this approach to parenting (or not parenting as I saw it). Her 17 year old dd still has tantrums if she doesn't get what she wants.

[pictish]

I have a pal atm whose daughter is beastly!

However, she is visably not tolerant of the behaviour at all. I have seen her pick her dd up and march her home three times now, during social things, as she takes a hard line to that sort of behaviour.

When you can see the parent is doing a good job, and taking it seriously, you have nothing but sympathy.

On the other hand, another friend was 3/4 of an hour late metting me in a local cafe for lunch recently because her dd was refusing to put her coat on. She was apologtic but thought it a valid excuse.

She's still on probabtion.

[K8Middleton]

Singing? Fucking hell. The kid is 3yo! She needs a telling off, then a threat with consequences, then a warning and then consequences!

Singing? Wtaf?!

Sorry I can't get over that. Nor the 7 hour visit! I'm not exactly draconian and at times I'm rather indulgent to avoid trouble but when it impinges on others that's way over my line. I once took ds out when he was 2yo for a meet up with friends in his pyjamas. They were new, we were late and I knew it would be a massive toddler meltdown (at the time he was non-verbal and had hearing difficulties) so I decided to take the path of least resistance and put his coat on over the top and put his shoes on and off we went. When it came time to leave he refused to put his shoes on and threatened a tantrum. I put his shoes in my bag, said goodbye nicely to my friend and apologised for ds's behaviour and the tantrum that was about to be unleashed, then got ds in a carpet hold and wrestled the little bugger out of there. Halfway down the road I put him on my shoulders and I got his shoes on at the bus stop.

[Nehru]

I am sorry and I am usually child behaviour Nazi

there is something going on there with that kid that isnt normal

[Nehru]

and it aint boundaries

[pictish]

Btw can I just say...all the letters are rubbing off my ketboatd at the moment...I don't know what anything is and I'm typing as though I am drunk.

[YouTheCat]

Even if the kid does have SN, all the more reason for some decent boundaries.

There is no way I would have coped with ds at that age without firm boundaries in place (for his benefit and security as well as mine).

[pictish]

Perhaps there are deeper issues at play, it's true.

But singing and 7 hours....no.