to feel sorry for Amanda Holden re her article about Mumsnet

[GrowSomeCress]

www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2305111/Why-I-hate-negative-judgmental-Mumsnet--Amanda-Holden-Britains-Got-Talent-star-accuses-site-fuelling-mothers-guilt.html

Seems to be newly posted.

I think sometimes it's forgotten that famous people are actually real people with genuine feelings.

Don't agree with her about mumsnet just being negative and judgemental all the time though, really excellent support available on here.

I don't think you are selfish for wanting a career.

I think that being a sahm has cost me rather a lot, in terms of career, pension etc. I do have the odd wobble about that, particularly in today's economic circumstances. I do feel quite vulnerable, actually and can fully see why other women make different choices to me.

That said, if I had my time again, I would still be a sahm for the early years because it was important to me.

Xenia, most sahm don't have nannies looking after their dc. I would put them in a different category altogether. They are women who have chosen not to work because they have enough money not to need to and they don't want to. They haven't chosen it because they want to do their own child care. I think men don't do it because society doesn't really encourage it and because a lot of women want to do it.

I don't think that it is at all selfish to want a career. I just wish it could be understood that it isn't top priority to some people.

I loved being at home, I am naturally quite lazy so love the chance to opt out of work, deadlines, early starts and late finishes, it is a good job however that there are women who are willing to combine a career with children, the country would be in a bit of a mess if we all refused to work.

But again I am not working or not working for any greater good, it was just what I wanted to do at the time and could afford to do.

My career is not my top priority tbh, I chose my career because it gave me time with my family, as a teacher I get to play at being a SAHM for 13 weeks year.

Agreed Aritbottle- very grateful that not everyone is the same.
I just did as I wanted and could afford it.
I just get cheesed off with Xenia thinking it means you are a downtrodden woman chained to the kitchen sink! (And for some reason married to your house even if you don't have a DH)

At the root of it for me, was that, as a child, I was looked after by a cm who was not kind and who did not treat me the same way as she treated her own child. So it became important to me that my own dc were looked after only by people who loved them. That's a personal thing and people whose experiences were different may make other choices.

I consider that my children have been happy with me at home. My youngest is now at school and I am thinking about a future return to work, but even now, they are still benefitting from me being a sahp. I am quite involved with my dd's school, which would be impossible if I was working. I know that she values this.

Even if my dc grow up and don't appreciate it at all, that doesn't matter, because I have done what I felt to be important and what I wanted to do. And actually, I think that is a fine example to set for my children.

I am a teacher too. I had worked full time long enough to know that my ambition was to be a good teacher and that I didn't want to be a Head ever or even a post of responsibility. I didn't want to leave my DC to be looked after by others so that I could teach after other people's DCs. Child development with my own was endlessly fascinating.

I know people who are child minders and do a good job, but they don't really like all the DCs they look after. They don't show it,but I find it sad.

You get plenty of parents who don't like one of their children and pick on it. It is nothing to do with whether a childminder is with them or not.

Yes, you get plenty of people who work full time who are rapists and murderers. Obviously you need to discount the fact that they can be good parents.

Oh Xenia - you spend so much time denigrating other women ...

Yes Xenia-I am such a toxic parent I should be kept away from them all!
I can't believe you sometimes!

Xenia-there are lots of different people in the world-we all have different ideas, different philosophies, different abilities. There is room for all. If everyone followed your view on career there wouldn't be enough jobs (there aren't anyway).

It seems beyond your capacity to understand that you can be ambitious, very busy and fulfilled without having to earn masses in a full time job. If I did have a high flying career and no children I would want to get off the ladder as soon as I had earned money and do something like keep sheep in Wales and spin my own wool etc. (probably not that specifically-I haven't given it a lot of thought not having pots of money.

I would certainly expect to retire early and have time to enjoy myself with what I had earned-have a change-volunteer for things.

JK Rowling would never have made her fortune with your way. Sitting writing in cafes with a DC because she couldn't afford the heating. You would have had the DC in a nursery and her climbing some career ladder.

There is no room in your system for the creative, the artists, the lover of the outdoors, archaeologists, museum curators etc-those who earn a pittance but have a ball doing it.

As a role model to my DCs I want to say-have choice. If climbing a career ladder and pots of money is not for you don't do it. If it is what you want then go for it! But don't think you have to do anything.

Exotic there is no room in her world for the nurses,police,shop assistants etc who are happy,enjoy their jobs and who we need as a society.

Would just like to point out that we know several families on a lot less than us who managed to juggle and didn't use childcare.Yes they went without holidays,activities,reduced hours,did funny shifts,used grandparents if they had them etc however in some cases with a bit of juggling it is possible.

Good for Amanda Holden. Her career is obviously very important to her... Everyone makes different choices in life... I chose to be a sahm... Yes she should (have) perhaps thought more about the immediate needs of her newborn baby than bgt or her older child's sense of routine, but it was her decision... Like it or not

You get plenty of parents who don't like one of their children and pick on it.

I've heard it all now. Of course there are bad parents but there are more likely to be bad child care workers. CM, nannies and nursery assistants don 't have to like or love the children they care for. They get paid to do it, they don't necessarily do it for the love of the children. The children are just part of the job description. The fact that there are a minority of toxic parents out there, doesn't mean to say all children are better off being looked after by somebody other than their parents.

And tell me, Xenia, if it is so traumatic for babies to be left at 9 mths if a mother takes a longer maternity leave, compared with being left at 2 weeks, how traumatic must it have been for your children to have the nanny who had been their main carer leave after 10 years. They must have been really traumatised by that.

Squarepebbles, I have argued the same point with Xenia several times in the past and have never got an answer because there isn't one to give that is remotely sensible. If all women were out there earning 100K who is going to do the child-minding and cleaning and general dirty work that she pays other women to do? Who would even be teaching at the posh schools and the Russell Group universities if we were all out in £100k pa jobs because those kinds of jobs don't pay that much. Her lack of logic and her teenage style arguing are astonishing - I can remember having those sort of ill thought out ideas as a teenager but I grew up.

Before anybody jumps on me, I see no problem with other people outside of the family looking after anybody's children if that is what works for your family but we aren't all the same and I was just making the point that child care workers are not necessarily better than parents at caring for children.

BBB, interestingly not. I thought it would be but when you're a strapping great 10 year old girl very into school and your hobby and your friends at school I don't think they did really even much notice which is fascinating. perhaps when you are cared for and breastfed by your mother, cared for by your father as much as your mother and by your nanny (rather than Winston Churchill set up - never much saw parents ever and utterly bonded only to a nanny) it is different. I suppose it is because once you get to school you are seeing more of your parents than your nanny so your conscious memory age 5 upwards is of parents may be rather than the nanny but I was certainly interested in that impact and that was one reason we kept her for 10 years in case they were upset when she left. I then realised it was not actually as important as I'd thought before she was hired. This was always a daily nanny. i never wanted anyone living in and by the way if you have 3 under 5s and work full time it is much much cheaper to hire one person paid per day than 3 nursery places. Nanny does not mean posh rich people. Her pay was 50% of each of our net salaries.

If you have 3 under 5s I'm sure that most people find it isn't worth working-it all goes on childcare.

I can't believe that there are people who really think that working mothers are giving their children second best.

Not only are we giving them second best we are also not prioritizing out children, For example I am putting shoes and holidays before my children, Bad mother.

I work because I want to.I like it,it's good example to kids
Holden works industry were it's all in the moment,her collateral post baby was high
I completely understand why she went back,she is own brand and needs to take opportunity asit presents. Risk sitting at home fir year,in year time she may not be so in demand

Aris - same here I thought I was doing it to pay for a roof over their heads, food, treats, clubs and school, but apparently not