Are UKIP just a 'respectable' face of the BNP?

[vivizone]

The title says it really.

1 - are they more popular than Labour and Conservative?
2 - Lib Dems are still popular?!
3 - What are UKIP all about? The Daily Mail are crazy over them (including the people who comment on the paper)
4 - What is so bad about the EU? why is the Daily Mail so against it?

I hate politics but I am Labour through and through (hate all parties actually, but I can just about stomach labour)

1. What would the country look like under UKIP leadership?

Arrgh so many questions. Thanks so much

I'd like to know too. For ages I thought that "Independence" simply referred to the fact that they are independent from the other main political parties. So, I thought this must be a good thing --as I can't stomach the rest?and maybe I should support this new alternative political party.

Imagine my embarrassment when people told me they were similar to the BNP. I must be supremely thick, because the racist element passed me by for ages. Right wing, racist politics is totally at odds with my outlook on life.

I bloody well hope not! Part of my family is Ghanian/ British and they're staunch supporters of Ukip. I'm a bit MEH myself.

they're certainly the acceptable face of Xenophobia; & xenophobia is the slightly more acceptable face of racism.

1. No. You might want to google the results of either 2012's local elections & or the general election of 2010 to clear up any confusion.

2.The Lib Dems are still the party with the third largest share of the vote & the third largest number of MPs, but this is only really true of England & is expected to change dramatically in 2015, due to Nick Clegg's betrayal of centre-left policies.

1. UKIP are predominantly a party for people who don't think the Tories are right-wing enough.

1. The main problem the Daily Mail has with the EU is a piece of legislation called the human rights act. Whilst this offers many safeguards & legal protections to all EU citizens, the Daily Mail belives this protects those who don't deserve it ; namely asylum seekers, terrorists & other criminals.

1. Much like Nazi Germany.

hth.

Am not really well read on them, but reading between the lines yes they are.

All a bit scary.

Bunfags I thought like you when I first heard of them. It was only when there was a bit of a stir over that permatanned man's (can't remember his name) involvement that I realised they were a bit unpleasant.

I don't believe there's anything 'respectable' about UKIP. Their policies are all about sending the country back to what they perceive as its golden era (ie 1950s ish). It may well have been a golden era for white middle aged, middle class, able bodied men. But it wasn't for the majority. UKIP want to bring back corporal punishment in schools. They want children with SN removed from mainstream education and they want adults with SN removed from society as a whole and housed in enclosed communities.

I agree with bang on about the acceptable face of xenophobia.

UKIP are only popular in certain parts of the country too. They don't tend to run candidates round here, presumably because they'd inevitably lose their deposit. I guess it may partly be to do with the fact that the government in London clearly doesn't give a shit about this part of the country, so the whole 'don't want to be governed from Brussels' argument makes less sense.

Yes they are IM(in my no way)HO.

i think people are fed up with the constant lies and double standards of all the three main parties - they are all in politics for themselves, its nothing to do with serving the country or doing whats best for the people who voted for them.

you can see from the comments on here that people havent read about any of their policies but say they are the acceptable face of the BNP - how would you know that if youve not read about their policies? readers of the daily flail no doubt, either that or you listen to gossip, read about them for yourselves, make your own minds up do a little bit of research instead of believing what you read in the gutter press and what you hear.

best we leave the EU - we dont need a nother layer of politicians which are even more corrupt (EU accounts have not been signed off for 13 years now as they dont add up) than the ones who run this country telling us what to do and spending our money. i would agree with the EU if we dont away with every politician in our govt - cant understand why we need three layers of politicans(EU/UK/Local) telling us what to do and trying to fit us all into little boxes, we dont need all these rules, its rules for the sake of rules.

The main problem the Daily Mail has with the EU is a piece of legislation called the human rights act. Whilst this offers many safeguards & legal protections to all EU citizens, the Daily Mail belives this protects those who don't deserve it ; namely asylum seekers, terrorists & other criminals.

If that is genuinely their main problem then they're even bigger idiots than I first thought. The Human Rights Act has nothing whatsoever to do with the EU. It's to bring the European Convention on Human Rights into UK. The UK was the driving force behind the ECHR and signed up to it 20 years before the French allowed us to joined the EU.

" They want children with SN removed from mainstream education and they want adults with SN removed from society as a whole and housed in enclosed communities."
I had no idea they were that transparent about their true colours. Are even the bnp that openly disablist?

I think this is really an unjustified smear on UKIP.

UKIP is a right of centre, somewhat socially conservative but really more libertarian. They are a relatively "small state" party. They also think that key decisions on our agriculture, industry, fishing, taxation etc etc should be taken by our democratically elected representatives in Parliament rather than unelected unaccountable apparatchiks in Brussels. They don't think that this can be achieved while we are in the EU. They gain their support across the political spectrum but I think it's fair to say more from natural (or former) tory voters who feel that the present Conservative party is not really Conservative.

You may agree with them or not but it seems to me that this is a perfectly principled and honourable position to take. (Cameron's abusive description of them as "loonies, fruitcakes and closet racists" will, I believe, come back to haunt him.)

The BNP is a National Socialist/ White Nationalist party. They believe in a racially homogeneous society (which is anyway no longer even a remote possibility), protectionist trade policy, and a number of basically traditionalist left wing policies such as increased old age pensions, a fully funded national health service, and workers' cooperatives. They are a "big state" party which gains its support largely from disaffected natural labour supporters in poor areas, though their claim to be "the labour party your parents voted for" is pushing it. There is clearly a nasty racist core to them - largely I suspect their support consists of bigots and losers.

It seems to me that they are more accurately descibed as a party of the left, not the right.

So I'd put the BNP and UKIP actually at opposite ends of the political spectrum.

By the way I'm not myself a member of UKIP, or indeed any other party.

"Westiemama":

"They want children with SN removed from mainstream education and they want adults with SN removed from society as a whole and housed in enclosed communities."

I have had a look at the UKIP website and can find nothing about this. Do you have a link?

Very similar, IMO.

I had someone from UKIP try to talk to me in the street a while back. All very 'ohh, we're just so keen to help England, we need sensible policies' but they backed right off when DH explained he was Russian and (at the time) waiting to hear if he'd be granted leave to remain. Very nasty reaction.

Admittedly, that might be one deeply unpleasant individual, but it doesn't make me keen, and nor does the fact they've got the Hamiltons (who are creepy dishonest types) campaigning for them.

I have had a look at the UKIP website and can find nothing about this. Do you have a link?

Their education policy states:

'Abandon the policy of ?inclusion? and allow parents to chose special schools for children with learning disabilities'

I have looked at ukip policies. Makes me shudder.

Well, I agree with that part of their education policy! I had a child with SN who was in an ordinary Primary.......and he caused chaos. He suffered, the pupils suffered and I certainly suffered. Once he was at a Special School all started to be well.

somebloke123 - your attempt to smear socialism (by most right-wingers's reckoning the depository for so much peace & love, lentil-weaving undeserved tolerance of all minority groups) by calling the BNP 'National Socialist' is transparent. You're not fooling anyone.

Yes, 'National Socialism' is what Hitler claimed to be creating, but anyone who's ever picked up a GCSE history textbook knows this to be utterly false. state-sponsored capitalism is more accurate. The BNP are opposed to Socialism, like all right-wing parties, stop deliberately misinforming people. in order to purue your own dubious agenda.

Special school may well have been the best option for your son Cassarick but agreeing with a policy which takes away the rights of all children with SN to be mainstream educated on the back of that isn't right or fair. They are not talking about parents being able to choose between mainstream and special schools, they are talking about abolishing the right to mainstream, that's what the 'policy of 'inclusion'' refers to. So parents have to choose between special schools instead.

No they are not anything to do with the BNP. The main parties and their friends in the media try to conflate the two to put people off voting UKIP. It's a PR ploy, see through it people.

somebloke123 Cameron's abusive description of them as "loonies, fruitcakes and closet racists" will, I believe, come back to haunt him.

Yes it will, Hell would freeze over before I would vote for the Tories led by that pillock. I voted for the Conservatives last election but by his insults I would not consider ever doing so again while he is in charge. I don't believe his promise of a referendum either, his promises are always broken.

if the main parties & the media really wanted to dissuade people from voting UKIP, they'd do what they do to most minor parties & simply ignore their existence.

Bangon is nationalisation of transport not a socialist policy? Just looking through the BNP manifesto. I was very much under the impression that the BNP is old fashioned socialism with added nationalism and also unfortunately racism.

Bangon they tried ignoring, it failed. They are now trying vilification and that seems to be failing. At some point they are going to have to accept UKIP and deal with it in a grown up manner.

'Abandon the policy of ?inclusion? and allow parents to chose special schools for children with learning disabilities'

The key word there is CHOSE nothing about banning sn children from mainstream.