Private schools - want to shout IT'S NOT FAIR!

[Yermina]

Went to PIL last night and heard all about sil's children's school. One of her boys is already attending a fantastic private school. Just found out his two brothers have also got places at very good private schools.

In the mean time my dc's are in classes of 31 at the local state school. My youngest needs additional support (sn) but isn't statemented (diagnosed but no statement) so doesn't get it. SIL's middle child has got into a mainstream private school that has outstanding support for children with dyslexia, which he's been diagnosed with. And will be in classes of 18.

Our middle ds is musically talented but there is really poor provision for music teaching at his state school and very few children there are learning an instrument. We struggle to pay for music lessons for him outside school.

Is it wrong of me to feel eaten up with jealousy and anger at the unfairness of a school system which privileges the children of well-off people so openly and seemingly without anyone else seeing it as something that's wrong or deeply, deeply unfair?

How would you explain to a group of children: you lot over here will have XXXX spent on your education, and lots of opportunity to develop your talents, and you lot over there will have about half as much spent on you, and will have much less attention from the teacher because there'll be twice as many of you in the class. Oh, and you kids with sn or specific gifts - unless your parents have money, you probably won't get the help you need to thrive educationally.

I know it's the way the world is but at the moment I feel bitter about it. Really really bitter. And jealous

Every time I go to my PIL's and have to hear about all the amazing thing SIL's dcs are doing at their school, their academic achievements, I want to go home and hide under the duvet and cry.

We'll never, ever be able to afford private education. We'll never be able to afford to move to an area with really good state schools. We'll never be able to get our children into church schools as we're not church goers, and our local grammar schools (2) are bursting at the seams with children from the local private prep schools, who bus their students in to take the 11+ en mass.

It's just so fucking unfair. It really is. I just want to get that off my chest.

That is all.

The country is full of people who work their socks off who still couldn't come near paying private school fees.

A school doesn?t become shite through the MC not sending their children, it becomes shite by LEA?s SLT?s deciding, (and governors allowing) to use the easiest, cheapest lowest hanging fruit methods of getting government funding when it has a mixed intake of kids, until it loses everyone that has a better choice, which starts with the MC.

I think you might be referring to my post re: middle class drain - the distinction you make here here is possibly too subtle for me to grasp.

We can all accept life isn't fair. Whether a child's schooling ought to entrench that or mitigate it somewhat is another question.

There are some harsh attitudes to those with less on this thread. Like the idea that these children's lack of 'advantage' will toughen them up to earn more, or OP should have fewer children (what, now??) or pick herself a better job.... I have to observe there is an overlap between these rather 'sink or swim' attitudes to children and those in favour of private education.

There is nothing stopping anyone going and sitting in a church service on Sundays.

Well, apart from the fact that it won't help unless you had the children baptised within a certain time of their birth. I believe you have to be active in the church in some cases too.

Faith schools are, perhaps, the most unfair of all.

Country.

Yes, I have seen quite alot of Tims in my time.

I accompanied my dh to many school events, met parents and their dc. Its amazing what you pick up as an out sider.
I have nothing against the Tims of this world, nor the academic type whose parents pay for a private education.
It is wrong however to assume these parents are intelligent, hard working, or any other label, as they are all different types having made money or been given money through many sources.

Yes it is. Its also full of people who work their socks off but can't afford their own home let alone choose a good catchement and can't afford to be a SAHP or whatever.

elizaregina - It was a very interesting book, full of really weird and interesting facts, such as 'Why did the Crime rate in the US go down?' - apparently due to Roe vs Wade and the fact abortions were legalised...

In regards to the Private school discussion...

www.freakonomics.com/2007/10/04/more-evidence-on-the-lack-of-impact-of-school-choice/

And faith schools only get better results if they are over subscribed and therefore back door selective. Faith schools which take on catchment only qnre no better or worse than any other school with a similar intake.

Work harder, earn more, put up or shut up, have fewer children.....devil take the hindmost.

The country is full of people who work their socks off who still couldn't come near paying private school fees

Private school fees, on average are around £11k a year. You can get decent schools at £9 a year.

Two people on minimum wage can afford to send one child to private school, if they cut back on everything else (assuming they live outside the SE)

But why pick on private education as the major ishoo? Why not houses or SAHPs or access to organic food?

Like food, you mean? Rent? Heating?

Because that's what this thread is about?

I am bothered about all the issues which make life unfair. However, since you can't make all jobs pay the same, and you can't make all parents as educated/interested/loving/committed, I just think it would be quite good if, just for the time they're away from their families and seeing other bits of life and different people, children could learn in the same building on the same footing. In common with everyone who pays for schooling, I think that where children spend their days, and with whom, is very important for the sort of adult they grow up to be.

And yes, if I like communist Russia so much why don't I just go and live there etc etc.

Saski, no you've probably put it better elsewhere, I just came back in to see lots of posts suggesting crap schools would be fixed by an influx of the MC, and having fought to get into places 'good enough' for some MC, know it to not be true.

And apropos of an earlier post- the thought of people deliberately deciding not to have a child if it would mean having to send it to state school makes my skin crawl.

I wish more people would see Home Education as a real option.Its not something the government will ever promote as it means you have to have one parent at home which mean you wont be out there working and paying them lots of tax,plus they dont like the idea ofkids learning anything other than what they see as an education,but it really can work ifyou are willing to put the effort in and theres a great community of home educators out there,i would solve a lot of peoples problems imo.

would add that the govenors of mixed intake schools are usually MC, who seem to have been either ok, or powerless with systematic downgrading of schools.

Some children will grow up in private mansions and others in inner city council shit holes. Some children will have the best clothes, others grow up constantly wearing almost rags. Some have a fantastic diet and others grow up on beans and pasta every night because it's all the parents can afford.
Some will go to private schools, some have to make do with the nearest state school. You get what you pay for...and some people can afford more. No point in bursting a blood vessel over it really. It's called life.

Well crawl away, because that's one of the reasons I didn't have a second child.

The state secondary school near us is horrific, and has some serious issues which some well meaning middle class participation isn't going to solve. We can't move as we work in a land-based sector specific to this area, and I can't afford another set of fees and I wouldn't send my child to that school as it is now.

So shoot me

Actually, I don't think the issue is with private schools but Yermina's boasty PIL. Another thread should be started asking for guidance on how to deal with insensitive boasting by PIL!

How does that Desiderata thing go:

"If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain or bitter; for always there will be greater or lesser persons than yourself."

There you go - you could be worse of Yermina!

I'm afraid that I still don't get why the existence of private schools is unfair. Private education, like private healthcare, is a consumer product of a kind, one that people can choose to 'upgrade to' if they can afford it. It's like flying business class rather than economy - it's yours for the taking if you can afford to do it and choose to spend your money on that.

What's 'unfair' IMO is what many others have already said - that state provision is not equally good throughout the country. It's a postcode lottery and if you don't live in the right postcode you can end up with a shit school. Now that is unfair in the way that ending up with your local hospital being shit is also unfair. If the state provides a supposed 'one size fits all' system, then that system should provide a product that is basically the same wherever you happen to be. Like McDonalds.

Well yabu, but I don't blame you one bit. We all want the best for our children and its awful when you can't give them the best :(

Ambersocks, HE doesn't mean you have to have a parent at at home not working and paying tax, it can mean that, just like being a mum or dad can mean being a SAHP.

Amber, I'd rather poke my own eyes with sticks than home educate!

I have no patience & I'm not clever enough. I can just about help my 11 year old with maths homework, the stuff my 13 year old is doing might as well be martian! I'd be just the same with music, chemistry & physics stuff too. The thought of spending 6+ hours a day for 15 years would send me into a state of depression & I know that my DCs would be very poorly educated as a result.