To be a traditional sahm ??

[ProudMum4Eva]

I personal have never been flamed for my choice in life, however I see many people who continuously get some sort of insult for their life choices. So here I thought I would share all for the first time.
I am 34 years old I got married at 18 straight from college. I am happily married with five wonderful children who I adore and do everything for. I have NEVER worked (outside the family home) my DH has always worked. He works traditional hours leaves about 8:10 mon-fri and is home for around 5:30. I do everything in the home cleaning, cooking, bathing the younger children, ironing and so on. I dote on my children and my husband. I love it they do not need to help me in the house I look after them and that is what I am good at.

Many people are not trying to make the world a better place, Annie. Using WOHM as a shorthand for trying and SAHM as a shorthand for not is very lazy and naïve and not a representation of the world.

And many people who actively try to make the world a better place are not looking for fame, fortune or recognition...

FergusSingsTheBlues "want to get involved with local politics, start my own business etc". Exactly, you have plans and ambitions, so why would anyone think that means you have less to society?

Oh FFS, I have not at any point said WOHPs are trying and SAHPs are lazy. You are putting words in my mouth and that is somewhat lazy and misrepresentative of my argument. Why do you keep harping on about recognition?

Because you seem unable to recognise the contribution that people make to the lives of others unless it has some kind of organisation or label to it.

I am not anti-SAHP. I am anti selfish people who don't care about anything beyond themselves. It doesn't make any difference whether they work or not. But at least people who don't care with jobs are still contributing to the economy, so are being helpful by default.

I will stop now - there's not point arguing with people who are determined to misunderstand me.

Bonsoir- it was this quote:
'Personally I see about me two sorts of parents in our economically and socially advantaged environment: complacent ones where both parents work, did fine and think that if they provide their children with similar opportunities they had themselves, they will be fine. And realistic ones, who know the world has moved on, that the competition is really frightening and that their children will need 3x or 4x the skills they had at the same age to go to the same universities and have a similar lifestyle.'

Perhaps I interpreted it incorrectly.

I think AL was suggesting that SAHMs usually have more time/ flexibility to contribute, especially once the DC are at school than someone working full time. I think she was referring to the attitude that some have (a minority) that raising a family is enough of a contribution and that once this is done or the DC are fairly independent, they should just amuse themselves.

The fact of working and paying taxes does not a contribution to society make per se, AnnieLobeseder. Many dual-working families are net beneficiaries of the tax system and many families with one SAHP and one WOHP are net contributors to the tax system.

"I think AL was suggesting that SAHMs usually have more time/ flexibility to contribute, especially once the DC are at school than someone working full time. I think she was referring to the attitude that some have (a minority) that raising a family is enough of a contribution and that once this is done or the DC are fairly independent, they should just amuse themselves."

^^ this

You appear fixated on outward appearances, Bonsoir. I am talking about attitudes.

"amuse myelf"-yes that is exactly what I plan to do

ProudMum, please can you let me know what your husband does which supports your whole family on those hours? I wouldn't mind doing that or getting DP to do it. If only one of us works (which I would love) I doubt the other would spend the whole time doing housework. but it's your time, whatever floats your boat. Anyway what is it that your husband does, and it is hard to get into?

I think people are allowed to amuse themselves once all their responsibilities have been fulfilled, yes.

I am much angrier about people who use work as a trump card to avoid any kind of domestic or childcare responsibility than about mothers who spend half an hour having a coffee and chat in the morning before getting on with their often quite lonely days.

I think I am the one that has been explaining attitudes on this thread, Annie and that they are deeper than volunteering for toddler group and shouting about it.

Then there is a difference in opinions regarding what is a persons's 'responsibility'.

Bonsoir- I may be wrong but I am sensing something personal in your posts when you say that you feel angry about people using work as a trump card to abdicate responsibility.

This isn't the first time we have been unable to see each other's point of view, Bonsoir. I will disengage with you now. I have work to do .

Perhaps Mayisout, I was influenced by the fact that I knew it was temporary . Although one of my SAH periods lasted for quite a long period .

My DH does sometimes work away so there are times when I am looking after all four on my own .

I would love to be a long term SAHM, but I did not make choices in life that allow that.

Mayisout:'Also others do not feel they are scrounging from society they are living their life.'I think you have proven AL's point entirely with this sentence.
That is the whole point. These women (generally women) are so insular and concerned only with living THEIR life that they do not see the bigger picture and consider others at all. Of course they do not see themselves as scrounging because they simply do not think

OMG - i wasn't referring to SAHMs or whoever you think 'these women' are sugarandspiced I was referring to people in general who are living their lives, and lives are generally much busier than when I was a child in the 50s, being described as selfish and taking from society!!!!!
NOOOOO they are just livng their lives, as you are and AnnieL, according to what choices you have made, they are not BAD because they are not doing whatever AnnieL thinks they should be doing, even if she isn't doing it herself!!!

Don't shush Annie.
Like I said, I agree with you mostly.

I think I recoil from anyone saying 'sahms have free time, they should do this with it' because it plays on a stereotype. It's just a bit 'well they arn't doing anything important' when most sahms I know are doing loads - they just don't talk about it.

Plus it plays to the backdrop of 'the big society' where people who are far too busy doing important things tell other people they should do more.
And women always get told to do the stuff no one else will do. That's why squillions of us are carers and why that is less and less valued.

YOu must live in a wealthy part of teh country AnnieL to hold these views on the idle post SAHMs with their selfish lifestyle. Or you read about celebrities in the DM and think it's true!
They're v thin on the ground round here.

Well, if more men were SAHP I'd say the same about them. My "telling people they should do more" falls on women unfairly, yes, I see that. But only because women tend to SAH. Not because I think women should be doing it.

PP was to pag, btw.

Mayisout - I don't know many SAHMs to form an opinion. And I'm not generalising about SAHMs, I know that most are very busy. It's the people, some of whom happen to also be SAHPs who do nothing but indulge themselves that concern me. There's so much wrong with the world, and I don't see how anyone can not want to fix it in some, albeit small, way. I'd love to have the time to do more myself.

AnnieL you have patiently explained your point many times and it's clear that you are talking about attitudes rather than dictating that anyone should do voluntary work for X Y or Z hours per week.
Anyway, I think the whole issue about how much time people have isn't central anyway, since IME experience, those with an outward looking 'can do' approach to life will fit more in and achieve more, whereas those with the opposite approach will do less. My teacher SIL makes a similar observation about her school actually... She says the brightest hard working students are often the ones who arein the orchestra, play in the school sports teams and choose to mentor younger pupils too. Isn't there a saying- 'if you want something done, ask a busy woman'

Yes. I see that.

And yes, the people who contribute nothing, whatever their family set up, bother me too.

if you are bringing up your kids properly then that is enough of a contribution imo.

If more people did this then there would be a lot less fucked up people.who would also contribute to society.

Excellent nutshell post, Pagwatch, at 11.43.