Interesting - Bus Company on wheelchair/Pram spaces..

[Bathsheba]

Yes -that old chestnut.

The Chair of the NCT has posted a letter on her facebook page (and has asked for it to be shared so I doubt any problems with doing this) from a bus company's solicitor - the bus company are being accused of being disabalist in not insisting that parents fold down prams/Get off etc. I've posted the info from the bus company below and will happily post a link to this thread on the facebook page as they have been asked to garner as many opinions as possible.

---------

I write further to our recent telephone conversation. As I explained, we are solicitors acting for Arriva North East Limited, which runs bus services in the North East. Arriva is currently involved in a court case brought by a number of disabled passengers. They are alleging that Arriva has discriminated against them because of its policy on use of the wheelchair space by parents with buggies. The court case is very important as it is likely to decide how wheelchair spaces in buses and trains across the UK can be used in future. Arriva?s policy is that drivers will ask parents with buggies to fold them down if a wheelchair user wishes to board the bus, but if parents cannot fold down the buggy or refuse to do so, they will not be forced to. Arriva believes that its policy is in line with the government guidelines and aims to minimise conflicts between passengers by striking a balance between the competing rights of parents with young children and disabled people to use the wheelchair space. The people bringing the claim have proposed various changes to this policy, to ensure that wheelchair users have absolute priority over the space ? the proposed changes are listed below. Arriva is obviously concerned about the impact of these proposed changes on parents of young children and their ability to use public transport. Arriva has been given until 28 January 2013 to gather evidence on the potential impacts of these changes. We would be very interested in hearing your members? views and experiences on the practical impact of the proposed changes on parents of young children. I would be very grateful if your members could respond directly to me with their views by 18 January 2013.

Proposed changes:-

1. Prohibit prams on board
2. Get drivers to ask passengers to fold down their buggies before they board the bus.
3. Get drivers to warn passengers each time they board the bus that they will have to fold their buggies and/or vacate the bus if a wheelchair user wishes to board.
4. Offer passengers with buggies onwards tickets if a wheelchair user wishes to board and buggy cannot be folded down.
5. Refuse access to buggies, prams and pushchairs which cannot be folded.
6. Refuse to continue the bus journey until the passenger with the buggy moves from the wheelchair space.
7. Insist the passenger with the buggy leaves the bus if a wheelchair user wishes to board and buggy cannot be folded down.

Kind regards,
Adam
Adam Hedley
Solicitor
(contact details follow but I thought best to remove them - Bathsheba)

at 'buy a cattle prod.'

Er no, it reads "if the buggy cannot be folded down"...

But you want to leave poor, innocent families at the mercy of cows!

but you would if it was the only way of getting a needed space

Maybe this should be in those stupid information leaflets you get from the midwife at your booking in appointment? 'information for parents attempting to use public transport - a list of do's and don'ts'

Do - fold your pram, ask for help and be courteous, the world does not revolve around you.
Don't - be an entitled mare.

You wouldnt have to get off the bus if.you folded your pushchair so you are making a CHOICE to get iff and get cold/wet/be in a dangerous position.

Again I will say, what is the problem with requiring the bus company to have a pram space and a disabled space? This solves the problem better than any of the other solutions.

I'm concerned about the cows. Is this a zombie farm animal situation?

Dont take your pushchair on the bus if it cant be folded.

I dont think you can even buy a non folding pushchair now. They all fold even if they have to be taken apart ie bugaboo.

By refusing to accept this you make it seem like you all just want to have a go at people with prams using the bus for the sake of it...

That is a good solution, and one that people have suggested. The problem is that that is going to cost lots and lots of money. In the meantime, clear rules about bus usage would go a long way to help disabled people access the facilities they are entitled to.

No-one has to buy a non folding buggy and take it onto a bus. Wheelchair users don't have an option.

My local bus company allows selected mobility scooter users on (if they've had the scooter pronounced safe to use on the bus by the bus company). I'm sure SN pushchair users could also have a card.

Has anyone emailed Adam Hedley a link to this thread? It is likely that the Bus Company and the wheelchair users who have brought the claim wish to seek some sort of compromise and effect change, rather than litigate. There are some v useful points on this thread. I'm happy to do so but don't want to bombard him if someone has already contacted him.

Offred

Disability groups campaigned for bloody years for spaces and or accessibility.

If the massed ranks of the permenantly pathetic want to have spaces for their unfolded prams then let them campaign for them rather than doing what they are doing right now, which is saying 'thank you disability campaigners but you can still wait in the rain because I am massively selfish'

Years ago, when buses were not accessible there was a "home James" bus that brought children home from school for a fee and there were local shops and a local hospital, it didn't do much about disabled people not being able to use buses but there were also fewer disabled people and they also would have benefitted from local shops and hospitals.

If I was my mum I would not have had to use the bus at all. The facilities which used to exist do not anymore.

argh. I actually cannot wrap my head around the idea that not having a special space for pushchairs is discriminating against parents....you have the CHOICE to buy a FOLDING PUSHCHAIR YOU UTTER IMBECILES.

They would have to build entirely new buses! And it would be LESS convenient for parents.

Imagine a bus with a designated wheelchair space (fits one wheelchair)
and one pram space (fits one monster pram or two foldable buggies)

In each journey you could only have at most 2 buggies, with some families having to wait for the next bus, while the wheelchair space would frequently be empty.

Whereas if parents were sensible they could stick with the buses I see most often which have one wheelchair space, use it when it's free, fold their buggy if a wheelchair user needs it. Also a few foldable seats which an extra buggy can get into if necessary.

Why does it have to be 'this is my space and they CAN'T have it even if i'm not using it' instead of 'this is a space for X, but because everyone is sensible it's okay for other people to use it when X doesn't need it, as long as they make space whenever X comes along'

Zombie cows shock

Can I just lol at you telling others off for 'refusing to accept' your point of view in the face of a tsumami of posters trying to explain why parents should just old the fucking buggy up.

Yes. Everyone else is being closed minded.

Fewer disabled people? Huh?

Don't you mean that it looked like there were fewer disabled people because they didn't get out as much because it was fucking impossible in a lot of cases?!

And years ago women still managed to get on a bloody bus with a pram and a bunch of kids. I would argue that more women probably did this as less women used to drive and people used to have more children.

Not 'old the buggy up' but 'fold the buggy up'

Lolling and lost my f...