to tell my in-laws they can't pay for my child to be educated privately because it seems a huge waste of money?

[StripeyBear]

My in-laws have offered to pay school fees for my son. He hasn't started school yet, so this would be all the way from preschool intake. They also did this for their other grandchildren. A very kind and generous offer, but....

I have been comparing the possible schools. Our State catchment school has a pass rate of 20% of S5 leavers achieving 5 or more Highers (sort of eqivalent to 3 A levels in the English system). There are 2 nearby private schools - one is selective and helps 80% of its pupils achieve 5 Highers, whilst the other takes anyone who can pay and gets 50% of its pupils 5 Highers. It is costly. Both private school charge around £10k a year - so we're talking about £120k for the whole thing in today's money.

My observation is that the private schools don't seem great. The State school can't select, so if you compare its results with the non-selective private one, it doesn't do that much better. I mean, half of the pupils at the paying school still don't get 5 Highers. Also, the State school is taking pupils from all socio-economic backgrounds - whilst you'd expect pupils at the private school to be privileged in terms of parental income, parental education levels etc.

My feeling is (given DS already benefits from educated parents - a good predictor of exam success, lots of encouragement and stimulus) that he probably stands as good a chance of exam success at the State school, rather than the ropey looking private ones... and that people will be more inclined to think his exams are good if he achieved them at a State School.

Neither of the private schools make it into the Sutton report of the top 100 schools. The only one anywhere near to us that is mentioned has fees of £20k and is very elite.

So, I think he would be better off in the State system, even if it means a polite - thank you, but no - to the grandparents. AIBU?

I think rather than going off grades (which in the next 15 years could change a lot anyway!) you need to look around the schools and decide which you think is going to be best for your DS for the primary years and then do the same when he is looking to move to secondary.

and what is your husbands opinion?

is your son likely to grow up feeling a bit cheated out of the opportunity that his other cousins had too?

I think that is a really generous offer and one I'd have to think really, really carefully about declining. I don't think you should decline it on exam grades alone.

They have offered something but of course you can refuse it if it is not something you want.
Would you make your DC go to a school you wouldn't want them to because you don't want to say no?

Because I am struggling to see why this is an issue.
'Thank you, your offer is lovely but we think these/this state school is better'
Why is that hard?

Unless the thread is about private schools vs state schools

Employers won't take whether he went to a state or private school into account when looking at his exam results. Universities may say they do, but they don't to any meaningful extent really.

But I wouldn't send my kids to a private school unless the only state alternatives were really dreadful.

You don't have to take your in-laws offer up if you don't want to, though your reasoning seems a bit flawed as the difference between 20% and 50% is huge, so statistically if it is just exam results you are worried about he stands more than double the chance of doing well in the non-selective private one.

YANBU because of course it is perfectly valid, and your decision, to send your child to the state school instead of the private - there are loads of good reasons for making that decision, although your analysis of exam results points the opposite way, so I would think your real reasons are not based on that :)

Thanks Sirzy The local primary school is very nice, and is viewed locally as an attractive school to go to. It is generally difficult to get your child in unless you are in catchment.

Both private schools take children from preschool, but are further way - so that option would involve a car journey. That puts me off, as my bias is that going to school locally with all your existing friends would be more fun!

I suppose my assumption is that the main advantage of spending £120K on your child's education is that they end up better educated - which to me, I'm afraid, mostly means with better exam results. I suppose that is why I framed the dilemmas as I did.

So the 2 private schools have a pass rate of 80% and 50% and the state school 20%?

If I'm understanding that correctly then that alone would probably make the decision for me.

Why do you think the private ones are ropey?

YANBU to observe that there may not be much difference in terms of the results and general quality at the moment.

My caveat would that your research is all based on the exam results at what will be the other end of his school career, and you don't know yet what kind of needs and interests he will develop as he grows. You also, I guess, have not visited any of the schools. Both these things might point you in the direction of a particular school, or away from others.

In short, does it have to be a Yes or No for all time now? If it was appropriate and what he needed at the time, could your DS start out in the state system and move into private if the respective quality of those options had changed by then (quite a long time)? Or vice versa?

If the PILs are as reasonable as they are generous they may be happy to discuss this and revisit it over the years - it is an investment for them after all.

Could you start him off in the local state school, and annually keep an eye on the other private schools?
A lot can happen in education either way, in 13 years.
Would your inlaws be happy with that?

You don't have to take your in-laws offer up if you don't want to, though your reasoning seems a bit flawed as the difference between 20% and 50% is huge, so statistically if it is just exam results you are worried about he stands more than double the chance of doing well in the non-selective private one.

The 20% and 50% pass rate isn't comparable though. The private school presumably takes highly priviledged children and the state school takes everyone, minus all the rich kids who should be (in theory) better placed to do well.

It doesn't mean my son has a 20% chance at the State School - and it certainly doesn't mean he has double the chance at the private one.

I've no doubt there are good private schools - it just seems to me that these aren't. I don't really want a private/state argument. My issue is that there are good private schools - they have nearer 100% of pupils getting 5 Highers... and lets face it, that is just a minimum requirement for a half decent university place. If you look at the list of top schools, they don't even get into the top 100. They just seem to offer poor value compared to other private schools. Yet these are the only local choices - so that's what we're stuck with.

It's all very well saying employers will only look at your grades - just universities who care where you got them... but come on - no employer is interested in what O levels and A levels I have - they are interested in my degree and Masters - and which university you go to makes a huge difference to final destinations. So, to my mind, going to a second rate private school, that is not very academic may be a dertiment when it comes to Uni admissions.

Husband is opposed to the whole thing. He has moral objections. I'm not bothered - I just want to do the best for my son.

YABU

The so called excellent primary that my dcs went to was a load of crap. We'd give our right arms to have them privately educated. Private education opens doors.

Its the support that private school children get that is so valuable really. If its a good, supportive state with extra curriculars etc, then go for that.

Maybe ask your PIL to put the money they'd have spent on school fees into an account for your DS to pay for his uni education?

I agree that you should do what you think is right but also to ask PiLs if you can revisit the decision over time. While your son is in the state system your PiLs could always help out with educational trips, music lessons, sports club memberships etc. Cheaper for them but they would still be contributing to your son's wider education.

Personally I would use the money to move house to a catchment with a good state school, then pay for extra curricular activities and private tutors if needs be.

Stripy I meant universities will pay lip service to caring where you got the grades, but in reality - they won't :)

Either way though, if you don't see the benefit and your husband has a moral objection its a bit of a non-issue isn't it. YABa bit U for bothering to post it as an AIBU :o

I went to a ropey second rate private school for 11-16, did me neither harm nor good as far as I can see, probably a bit of a waste of money, it was all about the image my parents had of how they would bring their children up, so served to support their view of themselves as parents - they were most upset when I point blank insisted I was going to the local 6th form college despite the fact it saved them thousands of pounds :o They were also disappointed I didn't want to consider an International school for my own children (we live in Germany, and I wanted them to go to the local schools, but I am fairly sure they must have a good idea we couldn't afford an International school and would have had to ask them for help. For me it was a non issue as the local schools are a better choice for our family anyway)

If you are open to the idea then go and look around all the schools and get a feel for them, exam results aside, pay attention to atmosphere and opportunities to pursue other possible interests - theatre, music, sport etc. Alternatively tell your in-laws you are happy with the local primary but would like the opportunity to re-consider in a few years time...

If you don't want to send him private just don't though! The travel would be what would put me off - for him more than for you.

Tetchy. Unfortunately I am just as likely to shorthand pupils at the State school from the lower socio-economic classes, as the great unwashed - so I might not be safe there either ;-)

What about saying local state for primary, save the money for the super good secondary?

I used to be against private schools. My reasons being cost and not wanting my kids to grow up spoilt precocious brats and basically "stuck up". Then, to cut a long story short, my son was bullied at 3 different schools. We decided when he was 13 to send him to private school because we were at our wits end! We had to make sacrificies but it was one of the best things we ever did. The pastoral care was brilliant. He had self esteem issues, which over time improved at his new school. My perception of private school was wrong and out of date. Lots of "ordinary" people send their kids to private school now. Things have changed. By the way he is now 23 and has just got a 1st at uni. That wouldnt have happened if we hadnt sent him to the private school.
Having said all that its you and your dhs decision

"Husband is opposed to the whole thing. He has moral objections. I'm not bothered - I just want to do the best for my son"

YANBU to turn down their offer then. Perhaps they would like to review the situation when he's older. Personally I wouldn't take them up on the offer.

We are already in the catchment for the secondary school with the best results in the city - the primary school is very good too, and as I said, it is difficult to get in unless you're in catchment

PILs are very reasonable people and the Trust is set up very loosely to benefit the children in the family. If you wanted to be mercenary about it - the issue is that the money in it is not ring-fenced for individual children. So if my son does not draw down his 120K for private schooling, (there is additional funds for uni anyway) then when the trust is wound up (when the youngest reaches 25) the money gets divided by all the children...

I suppose I am uneasy about it because I don't think the private schools available to us are that great... it just feels a bit of a waste of cash to me....

Hi stripey,

My children both go to private school, one of them is paid for by grandparents, they both love their school and are doing very well so even baring in mind what I say below I wouldn't change the situation now. I think there's some great advice already so there's only a couple of things to add:

1. In my experience the fact that the grandparents were paying meant they felt very entitled to an opinion on educational questions I would've considered really only a matter for myself and exh. You have an opportunity to speak to other people in your family about this and I would check that the money is given on a no-strings basis. I hope in your case it isn't a problem but has meant a lot of boundary reinforcing being required in mine.

1. Would they consider putting the money they'd pay into savings for either university or a deposit on a house when they're of age as an alternative. I've often wondered whether this would actually have made a bigger impact on the beginning of their adult lives than private education.

Good luck.

Ah now am I skim reading badly or has the trust not been explicitly mentioned before.

What you are really saying is you'd like to chose a better way of spending the 120 thousand pounds for your son's benefit. In which case YANBU to want this and sto be frustrated wishing it was your 120 thousand to give him as a house deposit or to use to fund university - he could get through a PHD with all that and still have money left (though for all you know he may prefer to be a car mechanic or a sculptor or something else not requiring higher education)

However as it is your in-laws' money YABU to expect (rather than secretly wish) you could decide how to spend it.