Awful situation over inheritance-who is BU?

[whoisright]

I have namechanged as this is such a volatile subject in my family....despite the fact that nobody has even died yet

It is a long story and it is bothering me every day because I do not know what to do or say and it is causing no end of upset and stress within the family.

I am the eldest of 3, our parents divorced years ago. My mum lives in family home (big-ish house in good area) with my younger sister who is planning on moving out soon with her dp so they can live together.

HOWEVER dsis has some health issues (epilepsy) and our mum wants to provide for her so the house will (when our parents have died) go to her, if she has moved out she will just move straight back in again and take it over (no mortgage so she wont have to worry about paying as she has no job).

I have accepted this, but my brother is livid. absolutely livid and has said there is no way he will accept this, he wants the house sold and the money split 3 ways. He has said that yes, she is ill but that we all have problems in our lives and it shouldnt be just one child that is provided for.
He himself has a good job, 2 children but a lot of debt and is renting so sees the money as possibly a deposit for a house and he has mentioned to me that my circumstances are not great (we live in a council house, have 4 dcs with a genetic condition and debts too) but really after living with my sister and seeing her every day I know she will never really be able to work so will not get a chance to get a house like that-she is currently waiting for a council flat to move in with her dp temporarily untill time comes that hey get the family home.

I think my brother should really give this up now, stop going on about it and just accept it like I have. The last thing I want in a few years time is to be caught up in a horrible battle over a house. Yes, that amount of money would be life changing but at the end of the day it is my mums house and it is her choice which of her children she leaves it to.

It is causing a lot of tension between my brother and sister they are both gearing up towards a huge fight over this at some point and I dont know what to say. What do i do?

To me, it sounds like your brother and your sister are of a very similar mindset: neither of them seems to be happy to live within their means, and both consider your mother's house as their god-given right to a little extra with which to fund their dream life. It's not an attitude that sits very well with me, regardless of the differences in their individual circumstances.

Which is not to say that your mother is fair. But at least she's making decisions about something that she herself has earned.

This is really horrible. Your sister is planning her life around your mother's death. Your mum is only 60 and could have another 30 years to go! The house could end up sold to pay for care costs in the future. Your mum could re-marry - she's only 60 FFS!

Your mum might feel intimidated about this when your sister is still living with her. I'd be inclined to wait until she has moved out and is in her own home. Then the playing field among the siblings will be pretty much level surely? In any case, maybe ask to meet up with your mum, just the two of you then. I might also be inclined to write down what you think about all of this and give it to your mum, which would give you plenty of time to order your thoughts. For me the main thing would be to tell my mum that at her age she should be concentrating on her life - not her death. I'd rather see my mum downsize and spend some money on having fun than sit there watching some family members hanging over her like vultures.
By the way, your sister could be well beyond childbearing age by the time your mum shuffles off her mortal coil couldn't she?

As a matter of interest, if Dmum does intend to leave the house to solely Dsis and rings up one day to say "can you mow the lawn for me" or "the boiler is on the blink" would you go to assist in the upkeep of Dsis Dmum's house?
I think that you and Dbro would have the perfect right to pass all future maintenance problems to Dsis. Help with Dmum's personal needs but not property ones.

OP you poor thing, being stuck in the middle of this. For what it's worth, I totally respect your choice to accept your mother's wishes and protect your own wellbeing by not engaging with the fallout from it.

My own mother left a contentious and deliberately divisive will - fortunately I wasn't aware of it beforehand. It took an effort of will to be big enough not to let it affect my relationship with my sibling, but it's really OK. Luckily my dh supports the acceptance route. You sound like us in that your relationships with your siblings are more important to you than a theoretical entitlement to inherit.

All that said, unfortunately there's not much you can do to prevent your siblings falling out amongst themselves over it.

The only suggestion I have to improve the situation is to make sure that your mother is aware that she can leave the house to whomever she wishes in whatever ratios, but ensure that your sister is permitted to live in it as long as she wishes. This is a common arrangement that any good solicitgor would be able to write into a will. There are some pitfalls in terms of who pays maintenance costs during the time that your sister continues to live there, and these are best covered in the will. Effectively the final joint owners of the property hold it in trust during the time that the named person has residence in the house.

Good luck.

Your siblings can shift for themselves, but from the point of view of what you can do to stop this situation driving you mad, I suggest:

-telling your DB that you completely understand how he feels about the favouritism that's underlying your mother's decision. However, it's taken a lot of hard work and upset for you to detach from it, and you don't want to be dragged in again, so could he please not talk about it. Especially as there's nothing you can do. He should speak to your mother, if anyone;

-speak to your mother to say she needs to think carefully before she commits to staying in the family home just so your sister can have it. She needs to allow for a her old age costs, like care fees, and think about whether she can maintain the house when she is on a pension. Point out she also needs to take legal advice about what will happen to her tax and benefits-wise if she keeps the house and ditto if your sister inherits it, and work out what should happen in various scenarios, e.g. your sister pre-deceases her. Then step back and leave her to it;

-ignore your horrible sister and her selfishness.

I actually think your mum is BU.

House should be sold, and split either 3 ways, or, if your sister really needs more than split 1/4 each to you and your bro and 1/2 to sister.

Sister is being v U with all the "only want to have a family in the home I grew up in" talk.

I can see why your brother is cross. It will be a shame if your sister looses the family relationship with your bro (and maybe you?) over this. Family is more important than the house she grew up in.

Also as others have said. Say that's a 400k house, how the fuck is she going to pay the inheritance tax on that???

haven't read past the first page but I'm with the brother, completely unfair - can it be split more reasonably as in 50% to sis then 25% to both you and your brother - understand your sister's need may be greater but she seems incredibly selfish to want to have it all and you have nothing - If I couldn't make my mum and sister see sense and come to a reasonable decision I'd probably be looking at legal advice..... Awful situation sorry OP x

My parents said similair to me about 10 years ago (they plan on leaving their house to my brother, presumably because I have a husband now who can 'look after me' ). Luckily, my brother isn't a complete twat and wouldn't hear of it. It's a shame your sister isn't decent.

Sorry just realised your mum is only 60 and this is not an imminent issue. I read something the other day which said 90% of people who are 60 today will live into their 90s so this is more than likely academic and either they'll be nothing left or your lives will have all changed immeasurably by the time Mum is gone, who knows she might marry a toy boy in between and leave it all to him! Acceptance is probably the best way forward for now and see how things develop

My mum is 60, and her mum has just died aged 99. My siblings and I left home years ago, and one of them is now dead. Your sister is foolish to predicate her notional family's future on an inheritance she may not come into until she is well past child-bearing age.

Your mum is foolish to have shown favouritism, which is what your brother is responding to, as much as the details of the inheritance.

You say you've already moved on from the pain caused by your mum's favouritism, which is commendable. In your shoes I'd protect my feelings by keeping my distance.

You have to accept your mother's wishes and she does have logic to them even if the result seems unfair. If your brother and sister are determined to argue over this I would keep out of it completely. Ultimately your mum can do as she wishes with her property (assuming that your brother is not actually dependant on her).

A few things there.
1- Your mum can take steps now to protect her house if she goes into care. There are ways around it and seen the situation, that's probably best to do so.
2- Your mum really needs to have a will (properly done so it can't be contested) ASAP.
3- Your dsis is deluded. She can't plan her life around her mum death. It is very likely that your mum will be able to see her dgc (well one would hope so)
4- Your problem as a family is NOT the inheritance. It's your mum's attitude re your dsis and the issues it has created. You let go of it and decided not to 'be affected by it' - but then aren't you really. Whereas your dbro is still reeling about the fact your mum has clearly a 'favourite'

I am not even sure whether what your mum is fair or not. It is a complex situation. But your dbro is on the way to have a massive argument with his mum and dsis. Unfortunately, there is nothing you can say or do. You will have to let him choose how he wants to handle all that.

There was a brilliant programme on BBC I think, about a year ago - which looked at a very similar dilemma. Three kids, one disabled and what the parents wanted to do.

I think they worked through some really good points - like when the parents die - they want the disabled child to have a good relationship with the siblings surely? Also - they worked out that the disabled child would probably not want to live in the big house -

Might be worth searching for on the internet.

I know it's a secondary point, but as an ageing society we are really going to have to get over this "family home" thing. It's ridiculous.

It used to be something only the aristocracy and the super-rich did - and the truth is they are still the only people who can really afford it. Nothing changed, except a small number of culturally influential baby boomers convinced themselves that everybody is rich now.

Hopefully your mum will enjoy a long, healthy third age over the next twenty to thirty years, and over that time it will become clear to her that this is not a workable solution, for all sorts of practical as well as moral reasons.

The BBC show was called Can't Take It With You. It was very good and quite heart wrenching at times. There were lots of cases where everything seemed ok on the surface but where there were lots of undercurrents. I think it made the point that it was usually best to deal with the situation rather than put it off. The people on the show were usually happier at the end of the process once decisions had been made. Even where people, DC's usually, we're not 100% happy with the outcome, they seemed accepting of the situation.

If your mother sells the house now, and splits the mortgage-free proceeds 3 ways, not only is she more likely to avoid inheritance tax (which will one day render your DSis homeless) but since its a big house, it may fund a small flat for your Dsis as well as your DB's share. And if you really don't want your share you can always donate it to the other two.

I don't think its fair at all to give one child a large inheritance and leave out the other two. I also can't see how your Dsis will fund an inheritance tax bill or manage a big house on her own, if she is incapable of working.

I agree with catsmother upthread, especially on 'the emotional impact' of a will that disregards two out of three children - quite regardless of monetary worth, I'm sure it must feel horrible to feel overlooked in this way. Perhaps your brother's reaction is more to do with his feeling your mother and sister don't really value him, rather than his being concerned about the money per se? Perhaps you too feel a little bit like that, even though you can see the rationale behind your mother's thinking?

Having said that, I think you started the thread because you don't know how to respond to a situation that is difficult to say the least, certainly not of your own making, and potentially could go on for 20 or 30 years. I don't know what I would do in your place, but perhaps talking it over with a sympathetic family member (aunt or uncle?) or old family friend might help?

I can see it's stressful, OP. I hope things get better.

I've got to say I do agree with your brother. No one is entitled to inheritance but I would hate to think I would ever treat my children differently with something like this regardless of their situation.

I assume from what you have said that neither you or nor brother even though your families work could ever be in the situation either where you have a big house mortgage free either so actually its not really fair on you two either.

If your sister is medically unable to work presumably she will get help from the government and also if she is living with her DP he will support her and their children when they have them like everyone else has to.

I would be very hurt if my parents did this to me and my brother.

I also think this is a very good point: 'For me the main thing would be to tell my mum that at her age she should be concentrating on her life - not her death. I'd rather see my mum downsize and spend some money on having fun than sit there watching some family members hanging over her like vultures.'

Your mum is only 60 (not that much older than I am ) - anything could happen in her life over the next 20-30 years.

I also agree that your mum might start to view things differently if/when your sister moves out and shows that she and her DP can survive independently.

Try to be positive, OP. All these problems might just disappear over the years to come .

This happened in my family (not involving me directly). The woman had three daughters, one of whom had SN. The other two already owned their own houses. The one with SN would never work although was capable of living independently (with support). The house was left to the sister with SN on the proviso that when she died it would be sold and the money divided equally between any living grandchildren of the original owner. This was considered fair by the other two sisters, despite the fact that they'd grown up often seeing their own needs sidelined by their sisters and felt a fair degree of animosity towards her regarding some issues.

No one has a 'right' to an inheritance. It's a very entitled way of thinking. To expect it and build your future plans on the back of it is a vulgar and foolish thing to do, since life has a habit of messing up such plans. The OP's brother needs to plan his debt recovery and house deposit independent of any inheritance, since the OP's mother may live for many more years yet and scupper his plans anyway.

However, if you are going to leave an inheritance, it seems only right to try to do it fairly. I think the OP's mother could protect her daughter's needs without upsetting her son in the process (unless he is an over-entitled idiot who's going to be upset regardless).

I've been the subject of an inheritance that was left much more in my favour. I nonetheless hid this information and divided it equally because loved ones are irreplaceable. Money is just money, and squabbling over it is incredibly ugly and undignified when it's not even money you've earned.

I think it should be split three ways equally. I'm sure your sis could buy a small one bed flat with the money and after all, that is all she needs. She will be getting a heap of help anyway from various things.

Why is your mum so determined to be unfair? Can the family home be split into flats to accommodate you all?

Perhaps when the sister moves out, the mum might think about downsizing.

I wish my Dad would-rather than being determined to hold onto the house for my sister & I to inherit.

I´d much rather see him in a smaller, warmer place with money in the bank.

can you all move in with your mum?

OP, you have my sympathy

I don't have this with my own family as of yet, despite one grandparent dying last year and my gran right behind him- no one is that fussed about the money side of it. as Me and my mum like to say- you can't miss what you dont have. And gran matters more.

However, I am sick to the back teeth of listening to DP's family's obsession with his gran's will. It is disgusting how they behave, fighting, sniping, buttering the poor old lady up (yes she's actually alive and kicking although very frail!) thinking if they do they'll get more. She feeds it though my threatening them that they wont get anything out of her, she can change her will at any time. She does have dementia which doesnt help her paranoia but the rest of them need a good shake!

Your mother and sister are being incredibly unreasonable imo. Your mother has 3 children and should be treating them the same. End of. Your sister sounds like she is waiting for your mum to die. Does she mark the days off on a calender I wonder? That isn't just vile, it's chilling. I can guess how my own mum will divide her assets in her will but we don't discuss it (she is 60 as well actually). I refuse to as does my sister. I hate all this talk of wills when the person is still alive. Write the damn thing and see a solicitor, that's what they are there for fgs. No need to discuss it in depth (if at all) with your loved ones.

As Dahlen said, no one is entitled to inheritance! And life isn't fair! The OPs sister was given the hand in life which means she won't be able to work, that's not fair either. At least OPs mum can go some way in compensating and continue to look after her. Op, your brother needs to realise how lucky he is already.