To wonder why so many honour killings happen in Islamic countries when Islam preaches peace?

[Mooblies]

Also, how could a parent who loves their child consider killing them for honour, or do the people that commit them not really love their children?

Who mentioned their Dad? Nice how you don't care about them anyway.

That's what amuses me about these threads. Such "concern" about Muslim women, and yet you all sound like you wouldn't so much as tell someone the time if they ask.

i was replying to mathanxiety that all those that now live in america considers themselves american

but once again no doubt my personal experience will be wrong

Freud- you are only a Muslim woman remember, you should know your place and let the non-Muslim ladies patronise you and talk down to you for your own good.

They only do it because they care so much about us. Apparently.

It wasn't my personal experience there (22 years in the US). People who were born abroad tend to see themselves as hybrids at most, but their children tend to see themselves as American. I never became a citizen so always considered myself Irish.

GAD, It is really obnoxious to introduce the BNP into discussions of face covering. As if you are saying 'If you don't accept this fully then you are in the BNP'. It just ain't so.

And just because something is a common sight doesn't make it right, as I am sure many Muslims would say about bikinis, etc. When something is a common sight it just makes it difficult to do something different, if fitting in is important to you, or if not fitting in would make your life difficult.

Math - if people use tropes commonly used by the BNP, particularly comments about being "British", I see no problem with that being pointed out.

I think people should be able to dress as they wish, whether it's a niqab or tons of facial piercings.

Goth i am not a muslim :) i shall probaby be told differently in a mintute so i could be wrong of course

but having read the koran, have family who are muslim have lived in a muslim country, my exh is muslim, lived with muslim family i believe i have a good understanding of islam. one thing i absolutely hate is the hatred and ignorance shown towards muslim people

that apparently makes me hate british culture too or have some deep guilt or hate america

i have enough muslim female family and friends to be well aware that muslim women are allowed a voice and can be as vocal as any non muslim woman

but hang on Goth have you not been on here long enough what about your husband, i guess he is having to read your replies before you can post them that is if he is not beating one of his other wives

not my family if anything my cousins who were born in the states want to embrace the culture even more it is common amoung families i know here too both asian and african i do not think it has anything to do with disliking british or american culture but more to do with celebrating where family came from something their parents/grandparents were not in always encouraged to do

not my family mathanxiety ....

in my area niqab is a common sight,

so are hotpants,

so are pyjamas in the day time with uggs

I don't feel the need to fit in with any of those groups....

Salaam nailak, I wondered where you were

lol, can't believe i missed all the fun!

wasalaam

"this isnt about 'poor muslim women', this is about 'putting those uppity muslims in their place'"

Er no. It's about honour kilings and Islam - a problem you deny, deny, deny. You lump all Muslims together as lovely peaceful and kind. I don't do that for any group - all bad, all good, whatever. It's not good to generalise.

GothAnn I cannot conceive of anyone being amused on a thread about murdering women. But there we are - takes all sorts.

Freudian - you have conceded honour killings take place (how could you not) but put down to coincidence the fact they're associated with Islam. What was your comment earlier? "Some Muslims kill their daughters, some don't, so it has nothing to do with Islam". I paraphrase. It was a right old shrug.

I now see why honour killings will go on - it's appeasement, refusal to admit that there's a problem in the Muslim community. If there's no problem, how can the Muslim community address it? How can things change?

I hope to God that this is a minority view. What massive chips on the shoulder are displayed here.

If anyone is ready now to admit a connection between Islam and honour killings, go ahead. I will fall off my chair in amazement.

"particularly comments about being "British", "

it was FreudianSlipper who said what's so great about the British way, what about colonialism.

Ludicrous.

I believe there are imperfections in all religions. I can't speak to honour killings, as I do not have enough information to speak about it. There are fanatics in every religion known to mankind. Some of the bloodiest battles have occurred in the name of Jesus.
I am not Muslim, but Jewish. I certainly understand how antisemitism feels to me. I know the catch phrases used by racists. This entire thread feels like one big go at Muslim people.

brycie you do seem to have a bee in you bonnet about something. I have not said Islam acts like a pack.
Are you now needing a lesson in English as well as Islam and history!? You seem to want to agitate people and get a reaction.

I am not Muslim. I agree there is a high rate of honour killings in the Islamic population. However, I do not believe it is due to teachings of Islam. I believe it is due to lack of education. In particular the lack of education of women in countries with a high level of poverty. Such as Africa and Middle East.
The problem is not because of Islam. It is despite of it.

Since history there have always been two sides of Islam. One that is sword holding, statue destroying forced conversions and the other is where people convert as they are on the low rung of society and Islam offers them an absolute solution. People don't need to think for themselves what their religious philosophy means and every aspect is clearly spelt out for them. What to do Day to day, what to eat, what will happen for sure after death.
I bet you also that religions where a high proportion of men (priests) hold these powers, there will be problems. This is not because of the religions but because of the incorrect/immoral interpretations of them. We get that in Christianity. Now not allowing women bishops is not comparable to honour killings but is comparable that only men have all the power.
In the Islamic holy books, women are give equal power and their wealth is safeguarded. From what I know of the profits life, he had a very high regard for women. (Apologies but I am not Muslim to be able to go into this deeper). Islam does not teach honour killings and suppression of women.
Christianity however, history has destroyed many mentions of women in the books (Mary Magdelen?!)

I don't want to get into a debate of Christianity vrs Islam as that is not the point and I respect both of these great philosophical thoughts equally.

All I am trying to say is that it is men and their greed for control/power causes a lot of issues. Not these philosophies per say.

You will find Muslims people against wearing scarfs and niqabs. Most of my Iranian friends think its a travesty! Specially the men! Islam asks men and women to dress modestly. Now, how you interpret that is your call.
I disagree with being forced to wear a scarf and the burqa which apparently causes a lot of illness etc in women due to a lack of sunshine and vitamin d. Plus all the tripping hazards. Islam does not force women to wear these. Men do.

But what's wrong with wearing scarf if that's what you want to do!

I agree the face covering is a barrier. I have no problems with the scarf.

I don't think this thread is a big go at Muslims. Open debate is a good thing. Some of the comments however are not well thought out.

Silibilimili, there is no such thing as 'Islam'. It does not have one voice, one spokesman. Islam is whatever an imam says it is. Islam is whatever an individual believer thinks it is. Sadly, the loudest and most forceful voice drowns out the others.

I wasn't saying that if you're anything that you're not British! Wow talk about serious projecting GAG.

There are some people who enjoy the benefits of a free country and/or welfare and/ education, NHS etc etc (Things that are brought about ONLY because of who the British people are).

The Burka is a different debate, it is extremism, tribalism at it's most offensive, basically it's two fingers up to the West. Everytime a woman makes herself invisible it makes this country a more shit place to be a woman, just like everytime a woman takes her clothes off for money. They are opposite ends of the same message, that women are owned.

What is GAG?

What does everything that Islam does that you don't agree with to do with 'two fingers up to the west'?!

Talk about a seriously flawed view on life!!

I think that part of the reason that people fully cover in a country where it is not the norm and goes against the norms of the host culture is political and protest. I think it's definitely tribalism.