to think David Cameron has done a wonderful job?

[toweraboveyou]

Dave Cameron is on a crusade to get everybody off benefits and into work, even those he thinks are probably lying about their disabilities. Therefore, he has obviously created enough jobs for everybody. Otherwise, he'd just be a fuckwit, right?

Dave famously visited a Mumsnetter and told her that his government would take care of disabled children and their families. I now wonder what he meant by that...

"They are now going to find out what hey can actually afford and many won't like it. "

Londonone Do you believe that will the end of the matter? Poor people will just accept being made poorer?

Oh yes, and during that visit he talked about his few extra quid as being a "cushion" against the cost of having a disabled child and being unable to work. It'll seem like more than a cushion when people don't have a bloody chair to sit on.

Darkesteyes - no one is obliged to do workfare, it is a choice. I don't think the current workfare policy is any good so I am not sure why you seem so obsessed with chasing me around the board to post about it!

Saskia - well virtually everyone has got poorer over the last few years and the majority have accepted it.

Book fairy - who do you think should be responsible for you and the fact your circumstances are not just how you wish?

The badger cull m's have been put on hold but the tired are doing a great job of slowly culling the poor and the disabled.

Argh! This jeffin phone! may and Tories FFS!

But if it isnt Camerons job to create jobs then it isnt his job to create workfare either.
Im just saying that its contradicting.

No it's not contradictory, obvs the govt creates some jobs i.e. the public sector, NHS. Those are service provision jobs, it's not their job IMO to create private sector jobs for people. I would agree that workfare shouldn't take place in private companies.

londonone Yes, but there is a world of difference between having less to live on, but still being able to get by, and having so little you are forced to choose between buying food or heating your house or buying shoes for your children. If this government force more and more people into the latter position there will be consequences in terms of rising crime and even civil disobedience, even senior police officers have warned of this. (And it's happening at a time when police budgets are being cut!)

Personally, I'd like to keep the stuff I've worked hard for, I don't want my house to be burgled by some poor sod who doesn't want his kids to freeze.

Yes I'd like to keep the stuff I've worked for, not have it taken off me in great swathes by taxation.

londonone And no, it's not Cameron's place to create private sector jobs. However, he is responsible for ensuring the private sector is vibrant and growing - his government have spectacularly failed to do this.

Roosevelt did it in the US, and the Atlee government did it in 1946, but for some reason DC and his chums don't seem capable of learning the lessons of history.

No Saskia, you and I and the rest of he population are responsible for that, th govt may be able to help but they are not responsible for it.

What exactly do you consider yourself to be responsible for? Getting p in the morning and breathing seems to be about the limit. Everything else is down to the govt in our world

Your world not our world

londonone If you are paying that much in tax I can only assume you're also earning a great deal, so are not living on the breadline. And personally, I'm happy to pay tax, I see it as part and parcel of living in an ordered and fair society.

That's great Saskia, you think the govt know how to spend your money better than you do. That's fab, you must be very happy with how your tax is spent. I am not that's where we differ!

londonone "No Saskia, you and I and the rest of he population are responsible for that"

Umm, it doesn't work like that. The government have to create an environment were businesses can successfully grow. it's basic economics. Businesses do not exist in a vacuum. In a hostile climate there will be no growth and consequentially no new jobs.

As for the rest of your remarks, I'm afraid you've lost me. You seem to be talking to some else.

londonone Yes, they do know better than me when it comes to the NHS or the police force, or fire service etc.

Hang on, are you one those oddballs who believe we don't need any public services? Oh yes, that'll work really, really well ...

Actually Saskia that's exactly how it works. The fact that you think govts creat jobs rather than people is rather scary. Unless of course you are talking about the state running all industries a la communism? Is that what you have in mind? As I asked before, what do you think the population are actually responsible for? You seem to think the govt s responsible for everything. Scary.

Public services are different from growth! The wealth generation does not come from public services. Where the hell does the taxation that pays for many of these services come from? Private enterprise that's where or do you think they should just print money to pay for schools and hospitals etc?

David meat face Cameron is a cunt of the highest order and I hope he regularly googles his own name.

No allthose people who were suddenly cured of their disabilities turned out to still be disabled on appeal! No gold star after all

londonone No, it really isn't. And nowhere have I stated that I think the government are responsible for everything. Stop making things up.

But once again in terms as simple as possible: the government are responsible for all sorts of measures that affect businesses. If they make these decisions badly, they create a climate that is hostile to business growth. If businesses can not grow, they will not employ more people. It's very simple. This is also the reason we need people with actual business experience in government, not the career politicians you so support.

Public services are different from growth! No?! Really?! I'm so glad you told me that - can you further enlighten me: is it true water is really wet?