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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to not understand how peiple afford to live?

320 replies

pregnantpause · 22/10/2012 13:04

I'm so fed up ATM. Me and dh work, me part time, as young dc, we live in a very cheap area if the country (and I suppose our wages reflect that), jointly we bring home under 26 thousand pa). We get 40 a month tax credits, which doesn't seem much, and I've just got a letter to say they've over paid us by 200 in the last year. HOW? Forty quid a month, and that's overpaid? How do people survive? Paying that back will take us into overdraft ans furture payments will now be around twenty quid less? Are we the scroungers everyone talks about? Am I the lazy feclkless parent that won't get a full time .job and sponges off the state? I can't go full time, my employer has no hours to give. Dh can't get a better paid job- there are none. With energy bills going up and food costing the earth how do people live. I seriously worry that people with even a little bit less than me will be pushed over the edge, old people, disabled people, how can people afford to survive now? Aibu to think that it won't be long (or already happening) before people are made homeless, just because the cost I'd living is so far apart from what we earn?

OP posts:
FunBagFreddie · 23/10/2012 19:40

Actually londonone might come across as a nazi, but they are right, having a qualification doesn't entitle you to a great wage straight away, people have to earn that shit.

Somebodysomewhere · 23/10/2012 19:40

So you are suggesting that we should all collectively have asked for more money (and risk being told to feck off essentially)or turned down the job ? And the second job i posted ? That wasn't a graduate position. It was graduate with several years experience.

We cant not be available because we are desperate and all need the money, which the companies know.

Somebodysomewhere · 23/10/2012 19:42

I do understand that fun but it should count for something no ? I mean compared so a 16 year old straight out of school rather than someone with experience.

If they demand a certain qualification that costs thousands and several years to get, the position should surely pay more than just over min wage ?

expatinscotland · 23/10/2012 19:42

'London, perhaps you should consider moving to the US? Your views are clearly in line with the Tea Party. You'd be a welcome addition to their ranks. '

I was thinking the same thing, Vintage.

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:44

No I suggest you take the job and cut your cloth accordingly.

Freddy have you heard of godwins law

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:46

Way to many socially illiberal types in the tea party for me.

FunBagFreddie · 23/10/2012 19:46

Somebodysomewhere you would have thought so, and I wish people would explain the realities of the workplace before you get dispointed. My first design job was for 13,000 p/a. Not as highly qualified as a scientist granted, but what I'm trying to say is that my real eductation started when I left Uni. If you live in places like London or Bristol you'll probably earn more.

VintageRainBoots · 23/10/2012 19:47

Again, I agree with Somebody. I'm not a 20-something year old kid; I'm a full-fledged adult. In between my degrees, I worked. As in, I sat at a desk in front of a computer wearing office attire (e.g., business suits) and did stuff for my employer, and I was compensated for that. I have work experience, in addition to my supposedly "in-demand" degrees, but it's not translating to employment opportunities.

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:47

Why should it somebody? Give me a solid reason

FunBagFreddie · 23/10/2012 19:48

Way to many socially illiberal types in the tea party for me.

I'm proud to be a wooly mided liberal! Grin

Somebodysomewhere · 23/10/2012 19:48

Well Londone that is exactly what i did do at the time. I meant i just feel that perhaps the thousands of pounds of debt to gain a degree may not have been worth it for such a salary.

If i had instead worked for those 3 years i may well have been better off at 21. Whether i will be better off at 31 because i have a degree rather than if i didn't i cant say though.

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:48

Why don't you teach vintage, they really are crying out for physica teachers

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:49

Illiberal freddy illiberal!

WilsonFrickett · 23/10/2012 19:50

They're really not crying out for teachers. I know lots and lots of newly-qualified teachers who bought into this myth. In Scotland, it's easy to get a one-year contract post-qualification, but after that it's very hard to get a f/t, permanent job, as they just roll onto the next year's (cheap and keen) post-grads.

VintageRainBoots · 23/10/2012 19:50

"Way to many socially illiberal types in the tea party for me."

Are you kidding? The Tea Party is the embodiment of all things conservative and capitalist. They abhor socialism in all its forms. They want small government, minimum taxes, and everyone to pull themselves up by their bootstraps.

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:50

Well yes the question of whether degrees are worth itin monetary terms is a whole other thread. We certainly don't need 50 per cent of the population educated to degree standard

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:52

Wilson thereis an ongoing shortage of physics teachers in England. Vintage read my post again, you have misunderstood

VintageRainBoots · 23/10/2012 19:53

Wait. Did she say illiberal or liberal? I assumed that that was a typo...

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:54

Illiberal!

MrsDeVere · 23/10/2012 19:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

VintageRainBoots · 23/10/2012 19:55

London, I would teach physics if I had to, but I don't really care to be around children all day and I would like to avoid it if at all possible. Plus, don't teachers need some sort of certification? From what I understand, you need more than just a relevant degree in order to teach in the UK.

catsmother · 23/10/2012 19:58

Errr London ..... yep, my life isn't "as nice as I want it to be". Same as it is for 100s of 1000s of other families.

Actually, I don't get any state help other than child benefit ... as another poster (or posters) said previously, I was scared to apply for tax credits after reading all the horror stories about mess ups and claw backs, or indeed the scenario of getting used to a certain level of income then having it taken away all of a sudden - as is happening now. In that respect I'm relatively lucky that we could - just about - manage, but not without a great deal of budgeting and doing without the sort of thing which many people wouldn't think twice about. Obviously .... now that the cost of living is rocketting things are getting much much harder. This isn't about "nice" .... it's about being able to afford to live to a basic, decent standard and NOT effectively being ostracised from mainline society because you can't afford to partake in it. I'm not even talking about some sort of "entitlement" to nights out for example, but, as I mentioned before, being able to afford dental care when you need it. Or being able to travel further than the confines of where your legs will take you - because you can't afford recreational petrol or public transport ..... so you can visit and support ageing parents for example.

My partner and I both work - but just like so many others, what we earn is not enough to live a basically comfortable life. That is a ridiculous state of affairs and I do consider the gap between wages (for many working people) and the cost of living to be the state's problem because exactly what more are we supposed to do to earn more money and make our lives better when there are no more hours to be had, a dearth of alternative jobs and a lack of affordable retraining (notwithstanding whether or not that if we all retrained for better/newer skills and qualifications there wouldn't suddenly be sparkling new jobs for all of us just like that anyway).

I'll tell you what we've done so we're not the state's problem .... what we did/do to maximise our income and minmise childcare expenses. For many years DP and I worked opposite shifts - like ships that pass in the night. I worked 7 days a week for years. We had practically no time at all together as a couple and were rarely all together as a family. It's been hugely damaging in ways you can't imagine. In the last five years, I have taken ..... ummmm .... about 14 days annual leave. Because I don't get paid if I don't work and because when things are already difficult I dreaded the thought of losing more and having to make it up. I had no choice - because I couldn't find another job - but to take a 7.5% pay cut last year. I feel run into the ground.

But hey - this isn't all about me. Far from it. I despair when I read about how other families live. Families who'll shortly see their incomes slashed. Families affected by disability and illness for example who quite literally can't work even if they wanted to. Other families who desperately want to work but for whom there's nothing. In as much my partner and I still have a job we are "lucky" compared to them .... I was simply trying to describe how working - bloody hard, and anti-social hours - doesn't necessarily provide a basic, decent standard of living for many any longer. That should bloody well be the state's problem - because in a so called civilised society being able to afford to live - without choosing between heating/eating, and without running yourself ragged isn't an unreasonable expectation for someone who's earning their own money. Similarly, people who can't work - either because they're physically unable or, because there aren't enough jobs to go round shouldn't have to live hand to mouth. Again, that should be the state's "problem" - taking care of people who need a bit of support is the humane thing to do.

What else do you bloody suggest London? When people are doing all they can to help themselves and things still don't add up ? Should they beg ? Should they be totally reliant on charity ? Should they just jump off a tall building ? Should they pray for a 21st century Black Death which would wipe out a third of the population and free up some jobs ?

londonone · 23/10/2012 19:59

Oh well if you dont really care for it! My guess is it actually the money stopping you as you think you are worth more. You could do your teaching qualification on the job asit were, or work in an independent school or academy.

londonone · 23/10/2012 20:01

I think there are billions of people who would be astonished that you don't think you live a basically comfortable life, as I am.

VintageRainBoots · 23/10/2012 20:02

If I were going to spend the time and money to re-train, I wouldn't bother with teaching. I'd apply that time and money to medical physics or accounting. Teaching isn't for me.