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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

My friend's ds has autism, she would like my ds to spend more time with him.

509 replies

BatwingGirl · 16/10/2012 11:44

I find this very unfair on ds (6) as he has made other friends at his school who want to come round and play. Both boys have pretty much grown up together, seeing eachother since they were babies. They go to different schools but as her ds has become older, it's become more challenging to have a decent playdate without tantrums every 2 minutes. I've tried to see my friend more while the boys are at school, but she tries very hard to time it for after school so that the boys can be together. I didn't want to say it to her and have said I'm busy after school, weekends I've stopped going out with her and the two boys as there will always be a scene in town. She ends up leaving him with me, walking off in a temper herself. It's very stressful.

For the last few weeks she has been coming round with some excuse (to see the kitten, to see the new rug, they made biscuits) and I can't exactly say no. She asks my ds to play with her ds (7) in his room. I don't like them being out of my sight as I know her ds can get very aggressive if he doesn't get his own way. My ds who does not know about his condition ends up very frustrated and scared. I'd like to keep my friend but not force my son to have to be his friend if he doesn't want to. I know if I say it to her she will really take offense. She feels like she has no one else and other mums from the school have dumped her since his diagnoses.
I just want an easier life. When Ds's other friends are round, they are like angels compared to my friend's ds.

OP posts:
zzzzz · 20/10/2012 07:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 07:54

Venus thats good, no your dd shouldn't be boosted about or bullied by anyone. If there is a child on the side looking lonely or sad, just to ask them if they want to play, you don't have to be best friends, you never know your dd might just make a new friend

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 08:01

Page yes my dd 5 is like that, developing some imagination, loves princes/princesses, non aggressive or stalky and would be happy to parallel play. Really a child is the product of the parent, learns their behaviour from them, I guess if the parent lacks empathy or is not compassionate, the child might be, though not always bu most of the time. Yes the op has long gone and I really don't know what to suggest in that situation, as friends son sounds quite severe, it might be unrealistic to expect a young child to play with him, when they are on two different wavelengths. But I do think that tree is no harm in the op explaining generally about differences and disability to her ds and making him aware of it, not just fr the friends ds bi generally

FangsGoForTheMaidensThroat · 20/10/2012 08:18

Aggression isn't always a product of lack of empathy or compassion or 'learned from the parent"..that is a dangerous road to go down in terms of thinking of children with ASD.

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 08:28

No fangs I was referring to parents with nt chi,dren not asd

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 08:29

Like a certain poster on here

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 08:31

If parents lack compassion or empathy towards others differences than their nt child might also be the same

FangsGoForTheMaidensThroat · 20/10/2012 08:58

I get ya Wink

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 09:20

Unfortunately I don't think Venus would be very happy if her dd had friends with sn, that's the impression I get. After all her dd has nothing in common with them, she likes to play complex imaginative games. Therefore I feel that she thinks that children with sn just would not be on the same wavelength. Sn is very wide no two are a like, some children with sn would love those games. Love dressing up and pretending to be princess marrying er handsom prince or pirate

FangsGoForTheMaidensThroat · 20/10/2012 10:06

Oh well, as long as her DD is ok and has lots of friends, never mind if everyone else is like her DD and won't play with the kids with SN, they can just have no friends.

saintlyjimjams · 20/10/2012 10:16

Venus, maybe read back your posts. Your posts are reminding me of the annual review report I mentioned above from the mainstream school. They sort of read as if you see the kids with SN as being not quite the full ticket, not quite 100% human. A bit what I call 'thingish' or 'vegetabalisation'. Not quite as valuable as an NT child.

As for we've all been on playdates where we can't believe the behaviour of the child concerned - it is slightly different if a child can't help it. As adults we should be able to have a better understanding of it. For example I once bought a new DVD player. Within hours ds1 had smeared Vaseline on a disk and shoved it into the player destroying it. A few (clueless) friend's went on about it being 'wilful'. of course it wasn't. He had no idea that would damage the DVD player (indeed he was most annoyed when it wouldn't work). He just likes putting things in and out of slots and I was stupid enough to have left Vaseline out. Entirely different to my other children.

Which brings me back to a previous point. You can help things not go wrong, but there will usually be some issue, even with supervision. A good friend copes with those pear shaped moments. A good friend sees the value in your disabled child (I think these two reasons are why a lot of my own friendships failed tbh)

The 'inclusion' at the school sounds like segregation! Ds1 was in that position when he was at the hell that was mainstream - lots of talk about how wonderful it was for the other children to have him there (and he wasn't at all aggressive - and doesn't try and foist himself on other children). But I think only one little girl saw him as a friend. He was totally isolated within that school. (this is one of my bugbears about inclusion - all too often it is exclusion within that community).

saintlyjimjams · 20/10/2012 10:21

And I have to say having read this thread I can see how valuable ds1 has been for his brothers. Ds3 made a genuine best friendship last year with a boy with moderate ASD and had no idea he was different. He wasn't scared by flapping - don't think he noticed it (and really if children are scared by flapping it is up to the adults around them to redirect that) and he was gutted when he left (cried). Never mind how important empathy/pity are - how nice that he didn't even notice.

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 10:36

Sanity exactly that was What was highlighted at dd mainstream at her review meeting. Though she would be within the schoo, she would be taught away from oter children because developmentally she was not on that level, how inclusive would it be. Therefore a specialist autistic school was recommended which she now goes to. Sn children are children, they may like the same things as nt children, they are not some different entity who should not associate with nt children because they have nothing in common with nt children and who will be a bad influence on nt angels. It would do nt children some good to help sn children, ask them to play, help them with things

Barbiebabydoll · 20/10/2012 15:29

The apple never rots far from the tree. If you think that it is acceptable to ditch this otherwise good friend due to her son's disability your own DS will go through life with the same views as you.
Friendship shouldn't be conditional, you should be there during the good times and even closer during the bad because when people come through difficult times they remember who built them up and who brang them down.
Just try for a minute to put yourself your friend's shoes, how exactly would you feel if that was you and it was her writing this post?
You should explain to your DS in age suitable terms about this little boy's disability and then he will begin to understand otherwise he will never grasp the concept that he doesn't mean to act like that, he isn't doing it on purpose and he can't help it.
It will be good for him to have a friend with special needs, i expect he could learn alot from him and realise just how lucky he is.
Stop being so judgemental about something that unless you was her you could never understand. It is easy to be on the outside looking in, imagine dealing with him 24/7. I think parents of special need's children do a wonderful job and i have the upmost respect for them, they never give up even when times are rough and the dedication to their children is truly amazing.

Sirzy · 20/10/2012 15:36

It would do nt children some good to help sn children, ask them to play, help them with things

I agree, and the sad thing is that comes naturally to most children when they are young and they don't really notice differences but as they get older they quickly pick up on the responses of parents and other adults and to often they are negative views. When children start asking questions parents to often seem unable or unwilling to answer the questions or give negative answers which passes predjudice onto the next generation.

My friends son is in a wheelchair but other than the fact he has "cool wheels" DS (nearly 3) has never commented on him being 'different' because he is growing up with it it seems normal to him

(I hope my waffling makes sense, I know what I mean)

perceptionreality · 20/10/2012 17:28

Oh zzzzz, don't you realise it's ok to discriminate against disabled people and nothing at all like discriminating against people because of their race? Hmm Venus is wonderfully enlightened - she thinks her posts come across as kind and considerate.

Urgh indeed.

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 17:52

Sirzy that s unfortunately the intubation. I have found that those parents who tell their dc about dd ASD and hw it affects her, have more compassionate dc. They maj that special effort Wth dd and ts so lovely. I am open about dd dx an feel that thi will help people understand her more. On the whole our experiences have been really positive

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 17:52

Meant situation darn autocrrect

olibeansmummy · 20/10/2012 18:16

She sounds like she's really struggling tbh. In your situation tbh I couldn't NOT be supportive.

zzzzz · 20/10/2012 18:28

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

lovebunny · 20/10/2012 18:49

The apple never rots far from the tree. If you think that it is acceptable to ditch this otherwise good friend due to her son's disability your own DS will go through life with the same views as you.

i think that is unfair. why would a mum want her child to have to suffer at the hands of another? to have to tolerate bad behaviour? its natural to want to protect your child.

o p, don't let this 'friend' force her child upon you. when she arrives, pick up your keys and say 'i'm sorry, we were just going out'.

no matter what mners might say, it is not your fault that the other child's disability leaves him unable to play in a reasonable way. you don't have to sacrifice your child's happiness and contentment for the sake of political correctness.

maybe one day you and your son will feel ready to try, maybe not.

i don't for one minute blame the other mum for trying to maintain contact. but if it isn't working for you and your child, then put a stop to it, just as you would if it were any other child.

Learning70 · 20/10/2012 19:52

It can cut both ways, this. I've had to distance myself from an NT mum for my own sanity. Things like turning up on my doorstep unannounced, interrupting dinner, knocking on door so her NT child can show my SN child his latest toy, then getting the nark when he wants to touch it, inviting us round at short notice (usually when another friend has let them down) and then stipulating what rooms we are not permitted to enter, telling me her NT kids are so good at talking because they went to nursery, bombarding my child (who has great difficulty processing language) with endless questions and explanations that he can't comprehend and then going all sulky when he doesn't respond appropriately. Life's too short really. Though said friend does mean well really, and is maybe trying to be the kind of friend the op is fed up with being. Which makes me feel a bit bad now really! But for now I am concentrating on understanding my child's difficulties and he is lucky to have an older sibling who thinks he is a pain, but loves him dearly. And I am lucky to have friends in the same boat as me. As for new friends, I am still working out who is interested in my child and the ones who just want to know what he has 'got'.

FangsGoForTheMaidensThroat · 20/10/2012 20:00

"you don't have to sacrifice your child's happiness and contentment for the sake of political correctness."

what a warm and lovely post

pigletmania · 20/10/2012 20:18

I agree with that statement that fangs quoted for all children nt/sn. I am not having much to do with my good friends nt son who can be nasty and rude to dd. we were in the park and she said freddy (nt real name)your my friend and was fapping and smiling at him, he pushed her to te floor and shouted at her 'your not my friend, I hate you'. I was so Sad it took a lot for her to say that. My friend was mortified and made him apologise which h refused to do, she apologised profusely, and marched him out te park, on the way out he said goodby to all the other nt children by name except dd. my fiend as tried explaing dd to him. We just meet up when kids are at school as friend is ashamed for his behaviour. Hs sister who is a couple of years older is fantastic with dd a lovely little girl who makes that bit extra effort with dd since my fiend told her of dd dx.

socharlotte · 20/10/2012 20:18

I don't mean to cause offence .That is why i put the term 'pity playdate' in inverted commas. They weren't kids with SN just ones who have no friends.Often the mum asks again and again foryour child to come over to play (because your child behaves civilly to them), your child really really doesn't want to go and so in the end rather than totally reject them and their mum , you invite the child to come to your house.