to sometimes think i would rather my DC be gobby and a bit of a bully than shy and quiet?

[MoomieAndFreddie]

DS (6) is sweet, polite, kind, clever, sensitive and shy. He is lovely - I know I am biased but he really, really is.

But he is starting to get bullied at school :( i am devastated. I was bullied too and i know the devastating long term effects it can have

I don't understand why, i just can't see anything "wrong" with him looks OR personality wise - as well as him being a nice kid, he is always nicely turned out (i make sure of it) and a nice looking little chap. again, i know i am biased.

He just allows people be horrible to him - i have seen it with my own eyes on countless occasions, while walking him to school, waiting with him in the playground etc. i keep telling him to stand up for himself but he just doesn't, or can't. and i do my best to keep his self esteem high by giving lots of praise and love etc.

i admit my thread title was a bit inflammatory, i wouldn't want him to bully others really, but at the same time, the gobby little bullies always seem to have an easier time of it. :(

No gobby little bullies don't.

They often grow up into big gobby teenagers and get a punch in the face or worse.

Be very careful what you wish for because A) He's only 6 so there's plenty time for him to become a horrible gobby child and B) Trouble tends to attract trouble and I've known parents end up on their knees emotionally because they have a child who is always in trouble.

If he's being bullied then make a diary, go in and speak to the staff and don't let anyone fob you off.

Hello Moomie. My DS is 13 and I feel like this sometimes still, although he isn't being bullied now.

I remember when he was at Primary almost willing him to lamp one of the bullies so I could stroll into school and defend him to the teacher.
He just let every kid get one over on him all the time, there's no way he would hit back or say anything for fear of getting told off himself.

Now he is 13 I feel like a lot of the other kids are all streetwise, sweary and gobby and think they are 18 or something. DS is just a 13 year old.

I hope someone comes along to help but wanted you to know I have been there and is's crap.

Work on ways to give him confidence. karate or similar - NOT so he can beat people up such classes aren't about that. They're about confidence and control and they can help.

Theres a woman I know since school who socialises in the same circles I do. She was a gobby bully in school and as an adult is only tolerated by others because she is still like that. Whereas those I knew to be like your ds,most of them grew up to be nice adults. I know thats no comfort when your ds is young,but,believe me,no one wants to be adult friends with someone who hasan attitude like a teenage toddler.

I think I know what you mean. You don't really mean you want a bully for a child, but a child who can stand up for himself and be confident to do so. Bullies go around picking on children and instigating fights.

Could you try taking him to a self defence class or drama class to boost his confidence? Even team sports are good for a child's confidence.

What Worra said. It is not your DS that needs changing it is the situation. He sounds like a lovely little chap - but if he is being bullied then you need to challenge it and go into school. They need to tackle it sooner rather than later. Why should he change his character (difficult to do anyway) in order to fit in with the others? Good luck.

Dont wish for a bully! You can give him the tools/skills to be more assertive. Parenting books like this will give you practical tips, role playing etc

www.amazon.co.uk/The-Incredible-Years-Carolyn-Webster-Stratton/dp/1892222043/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1350379259&sr=8-1

I know what you mean, I sometimes feel the same about my daughter

She's a very nice 11 year old, doesn't bitch or gossip, is very fair minded and just. She's not being bullied but she does let her friends take advantage and walk all over her.

She'll buy her friend a sweet in the shop and if she hasn't got enough money herself she'll go without. Over and over again.

It's lovely and I am very proud of her and I love that she's so gentle and kind, but at the same time I do wish she'd toughen up a bit. She'll get eaten alive

DD (6) is the same, shy, sensitive, polite (at school, less so at home). I don't want her to change, but I wish she had a couple of best friends like her at school. I was similar at her age, but grew out of it around 8 or 9 years old.

Were you or your DH the same as a child? Did you grow out of it?

We had to move schools for DS1 so he fitted in with the others. He has found some like minded friends finally. He doesn't need to stand up for himself now because he's not being got at.

I don't ever think he is going to be Mr Confident but the world needs kind, sensitive, quiet people IMO.

yes confidence is the weapon of choice for bully beating. really really work on his confidence and self esteem (which may be low as a result of bullying). he's already a lovely polite boy so with a bit of confidence he will be more than capable of knocking a bully down without ever having to lift a fist or throw out a tirade of abuse. confidence confidence confidence and if you dont have any, you fake it til you make it, as nobody can tell whether you are really confident or are just pretending. practise some scenarios at home that he has told you about, suggest things he could do if they ever happen again. speak to his teacher and let the teacher know that you are supporting your son in finding his voice and expect that teh school support him too. ask that they listen when he comes to them to report bullying which to them might seem like petty playground squabbles. the staff need to know in no uncertain terms that your son has your full support in standing up to his bullies and that you expect the school to end what is happening to him. i really feel for your son. i was bullied too in primary school and it was a very lonely time.

What about enrolling him in something like martial arts? I only suggest this because a friend of mine has a 9 year old son very similar to yours, and he did it because it was a way for him to make friends away from school. He found it really helped with his confidence, and knowing that he can take care of himself meant he was less intimidated when other kids were picking on him.

Obviously you are being unreasonable.

My son has been severeky bullied, emotionally and physically but no way would I want him to do the same.

You know how horrible bullies are. You are saying you want your child to be thought of in the same way.

My way of dealing with my children is to give them the tools to protect themselves and tell them how to get help, without resorting to being thugs/bullies/bitches/mean people/insert word of choice.

ahh moomie never wish for that. a friend of mine commented on a post on facebook last night and it appeared on my news feed. The post was from a teenage boy who looked about 12 and it said "haha im guna be arrested for smashing sum gimps eyesocket at skool". Thats not funny and id rather have a lovely by like you have than a horrible bully that everyione is petrified of. And one day that bully will get a clout from someone bigger and harder.

Had you considered finding a small taekwondo/karate class for your ds to help with his confidence? My dd goes to one since she was 4 years old, they teach about bullying and stranger awareness and first aid and all sorts

When you say he can't stand up for himself, have you taught him how too?

Just want to ad that maybe if you see a child been horrible to him you can stand up for your child and tell the other politely off making they feel bad about themselves. I think your child you learn from you that bad behaviour and bullying is not to be tolerated. And if the other parent gets involved stick to your guns. I'm not suggesting fight but what is the point of being 100% polite and nice all the time if people are taking advantage and walking all over you?

It's really not up to him to stop the bullies. Your best bet is to hound the school mercilessly, document everything and keep telling your son how amazing he is until something is done.

oh yes and try getting him into activities outside of school where he may have different friends. at least then if the bullying still continues at school he has other things to look forward to and will have friends that aren't bullies. try lots of different things and see what he likes. my son goes to gaelic, hurling, scouts and after school club, he isn't so keen on the hurling or gaelic but loves the afterschool club and scouts. he has a different group of friends at each activity and now when we are walking round town he is always bumping into people he knows, both adults and children, he is confident enough to say hello and chat to them in a way i never would have been able to to aged 7. he has a better social circle than i have!

I know it must be tough to see, but through the magic of facebook I have noticed that the bullying types from my school have ended up living where we all grew up (nothing wrong with that per se, but spreading wings and seeing a bit of the world can be a good thing), married to arseholes and working in fairly crappy jobs. A lot of the quieter kids have ended up in great professional jobs and positions of responsibility and seem to have relationships in which they are treated as equal partners. I know which side of the line I would prefer my kids to be on.

moomie does your DS feel like he is being bullied or is it you that feel he is? I only say this as my DD lets things wash over her. She is actually hugely popular but on occasion this has led to incidents stemming from jealousy with one or two children. I was mortified to think she was being bullied. In reality she wasn't bothered by these incidents and didn't feel bullied at all.

I know what you mean and it is very difficult to teach them to be assertive if they are just not willing to talk to another child in that way. However, he has age on his side so the bullies won't necessarily have a set way that they perceive him. I.e if he is more assertive one day they are too young to think this is a real contrast.

It is difficult though. My DS is 5 and is very sweet, a people pleaser though and although he's not being bullied, in fact he seems well liked, but I have observed at the park after school or when we have had other boys back to play, them all bossing him around. Some bordering on mean. Some friends have very domineering personalities compared to my DS and it is uncomfortable to listen to (from the kitchen). One friend we had back was constantly shouting 'No' at my DD who is only 18 months. My DS is very protective of her but in this context he will not say anything. Whereas we've been at a soft play centre, and he has told older kids he doesn't know to 'watch it' when they have nearly knocked her over.

My DP is very assertive and will tell him to stick up for himself but I'm not sure he understands that DS is not like him in that respect. My DP was the kind of kid that never had a problem asserting himself. He once punched a boy in the face as he kept taunting him about being 'a Jew', he has an extreme sense of self belief but I honestly think he was born that way as my MIL is the same- a formidable lady! My DS seems to be like me as a child- avoids confrontation, quite self conscious. The book suggestion above sounds a good idea.

I can empathise with your feeling on this, obviously not really wanting a bully on your hands, but hating seeing your ds being trampled on metaphorically.

My dd1 (now 14) has always been the same. She's a gentle thoughtful and kind person. She thinks things through and cares how other people feel. She just doesn't have it in her to be mean back to anyone or shout them down any more than I did at her age. Not so good now since those are just the attributes she could use at school right now. Teens can be a tricky lot even on a good day

She has on occasion struggled to do what others seem so adept at. I wouldn't say it's bullying more just surviving the general rough stuff you have to deal with at school. Shoving herself to the front and others out of the way in the process (metaphorically again) I want to protect her. To make her care a little less about them and more about herself because she gets so hurt sometimes.

But you know really I wouldn't have her any other way. And she like so many other quieter less pushy people does have an awful lot of inner strength and is a shrewd judge of character which I think will stand her in good stead.

I would def suggest an out of school activity for your ds where a friend or two away from school can be made. Also are there any children at school he would like back for tea sometimes? It gives a chance to endorse friendships and make an ally or two for the playground which is empowering.

And never be afraid to step in if you do suspect outright bullying. Sooner rather than later. This is sadly the age of the 'extrovert'. Introverted characters struggle to have their considerable attributes appreciated it seems to me.

I have a feeling teachers think you can go down to the shops and buy some confidence sometimes. 'A big box of self esteem please'

Agreed sparklingbrook. There are a lot of teachers out there who prefer dealing with the louder children and don't seem to 'get' quieter kids. DD is quietish although loud with friends and family. Her last teacher kept going on to me about how quiet she was in parent meetings like it was a big problem. Got on my nerves.

Every Parents' evening through Primary Angry.

Teacher- 'He's very quiet isn't he?' said in a 'what are you going to do about it, I have no idea what to do with him' type way.

Still makes me angry now thinking back.