to sometimes think i would rather my DC be gobby and a bit of a bully than shy and quiet?

[MoomieAndFreddie]

DS (6) is sweet, polite, kind, clever, sensitive and shy. He is lovely - I know I am biased but he really, really is.

But he is starting to get bullied at school :( i am devastated. I was bullied too and i know the devastating long term effects it can have

I don't understand why, i just can't see anything "wrong" with him looks OR personality wise - as well as him being a nice kid, he is always nicely turned out (i make sure of it) and a nice looking little chap. again, i know i am biased.

He just allows people be horrible to him - i have seen it with my own eyes on countless occasions, while walking him to school, waiting with him in the playground etc. i keep telling him to stand up for himself but he just doesn't, or can't. and i do my best to keep his self esteem high by giving lots of praise and love etc.

i admit my thread title was a bit inflammatory, i wouldn't want him to bully others really, but at the same time, the gobby little bullies always seem to have an easier time of it. :(

Yes, from my personal observations I do think loud, overly confident, obnoxious are all attributes revered in the modern day school context. One child who came to play didn't like the dinner choose I had planned so I said, 'what about tuna then, I have pasta too.'. He replied, 'well cook that then, cook tuna and pasta!'. Another friend of DS's saw me put a pizza in the oven and said, 'I had pizza last night.' as in he didn't fancy it again. I replied, 'well your mum said that you'd like it. Friend replied to me. 'well ok I suppose.'. I mean I'm gobsmacked. My DS would not have the arrogance to even comment, let alone question. Both these children sort of took over my flat. Telling my DD off and what she could do. I'd correct them and say she can do what she wants with those toys. They were in shock that they had been told differently I think. Another child in DS's class is constantly scooting in the way of my pushchair when we are walking home after school and will tell us where he lives. His mum never says anything like get out of their way for instance.

I know what you mean about some teachers with the quieter ones

Last year my DD was all but ignored. She did her work, handed in her homework on time, got on with everyone, let others go ahead of her, etc, etc but was never given the star awards or chosen for anything. It was always the loud ones who got the praise and attention (not naughty, but those who made sure everyone knew what they were doing iyswim)

Her teacher has clocked her this year and isn't quite so impressed with the drama queens

I am with you 100% I was so shy and didn't say boo to a goose and hated being that way..

3 of my 4 dc are total opposite and I am so please not one of them will take any shit off of anyone but are all nice well behaved children

I have just one that is real quiet within himself and it always worries me that other children at school not so much bully him but boss him and push him around.

He doesn't have it in him to say No or argue back. And it makes me feel so awful to think he wants to answer back but doesn't know how.

I have no truck with teachers who use 'quiet' as some sort of criticism. It's not the law of the land to be loud. Well not yet anyway. In our sleb-driven, look at me me culture I wonder sometimes

Quieter people are not always shy either, that's another favourite myth I'd like to jump on. Maybe a reserved person just sees no point in yelling louder than those about them to be heard.

I think it's very lazy teaching to default to the 'quiet=shy=I haven't a clue about them after two terms' formula. Make the effort to get to know them then! Give the quieter ones a chance to be heard ie take control and keep the louder ones quiet for a change Teach all types of people or don't bother.

Good teachers recognise that children come in all shapes, sizes and personalities. The minute I hear the 'oh dear isn't she/he quiet?' whinge I know full well we're in the company of someone with very little imagination or ability to see beyond the obvious.

I think I should have asked the teacher what she was going to do about it TBH. Then she went and told him 'Only bring me your work if it's right' and that sort of killed any potential pupil/teacher understanding altogether.

Sparkling Your post of 10.25 is spot on.

There is room for the sensitive, quiet ones

My DDs previous teacher was always pointing out how quiet she was.
I just kept 'giving' it back to her by saying...is her quietness a problem??
Does her quietness disrupt the class??
Drove me mad tbh.

Thanks Room, I do believe that. And i believe that DS1 will probably always be a quiet sensitive thinker. He probably won't be a teacher either.

My bully now shovels horse shit for a living

OP you must tell your DS to get a teacher as soon as anything starts. This is what I tell my DS (he is shy and not inclined to do this). Last time the child behaved badly, my DS went straight to the teacher and the teacher not only dealt with the bully in school but called the bully's mum in and had some stern words with her as well. At 6, there should always be teachers nearby.

I can understand what you mean OP.
I have a child like yours, and no matter how much I try and "instill confidence" he just wants everyone to like him.
There is one boy in particular who teases him mercilessly, and ds just sort of lets him. I know it bothers him, and he has become quite worried about what people will think, in a way that I know I wasn't at that age.

I also get the "he's very quiet" comments at parents meetings, which is odd as he never stops talking at home.
He didn't say much when he started school, but then,faced with a room of 60 kids he didn't know, being reserved and trying to get the measure of it all seems like a fairly sensible reaction to me.
I do wish ds would stick up for himself more-when I was a kid I had 3 older brothers, so I was accustomed to self defence, but it's just not in ds's nature.
Having said that I feel so blessed to have a thoughtful, interesting and kind child, and would be mortified if he became a bully.

I am going to talk to the school about the teasing, and will continue to be a pita on his behalf.
Sometimes it does feel as though schools sort of blame the victim, in that they advise on how to teach children not to get bullied, which to me is focusing on the wrong part of the problem. They should be operating a zero tolerance policy on ANY kind of bullying, and there should be more of a culture of shame in school for those that hurt their peers, whether emotional or physical.

I was told by one teacher 'Sometimes you have to let life be the teacher'. I will never forget that.

Moomie are you feeling any better about it all?

hi thanks for replies, sorry i haven't been back

i am a bit i suppose sparkling but i am so worried for him. he has his parents evening this week, i will speak to his teacher then

although i don't hold out too much hope as the other week when DS was pushed over in the playground by one DC then had his legs stamped on by 2 other DC, i told her about it and she couldn;t give a shit. just some lame stuff about oooh i will get the dinnerladies to keep an eye on him

i was thinking of asking his teacher if there is any children he particularly gets on with in the class, and approaching their parents and asking if they would like to come and play. and also he is booked in for a football academy thingy over the half term (although tbh i worry how he will be at that, as when i was at school the boys who played football were always the "hard", nasty little shits)

and i am glad in a way to hear that i am not the only parent going through this, that there are so many other DC out there like DS.

I like football ! Aside from that, what you have described is real bullying. Do bullies even get any punishment any more ?
does the school Tell their parents what they have been doing ?
I don't know about anyone else but if my child was stamping on another Childs legs I would want to know.

I was an exceptionally quiet child. I'm now a teacher. We're not all impressed by loud children, please don't tar us all with the same brush. The only time I might mention a child being quiet to a parent would be if they never felt able to contribute in class and I therefore wasn't able to engage in a dialogue with the child and encourage debate and higher level thinking.