to ask how you feel about Scottish Independence?

[PierreBourdieu]

Particularly looking for opinions from South of the Border, but all opinions welcome. My FB is awash with Independence fever after the rally in Edinburgh yesterday. As a Scotwoman I am always interested to hear the views of the English and get that perspective. I'll not disclose whether I'm pro or anti as I suppose it's not relevant here, also not looking for a bunfight! Care to share?

Scottish pounds are gauranteed by Bank of England though. So really we would need a separate currency, even if we kept the same physical bits of paper it would need to have a foreign exchange rate mechamism separate from the rest of (remainder of? wahtever) the UK.
I do agree that in the 80's manufacturing died due to FX decisions made to give a good strong London-based money market, which fucked over Scotland and lots of areas of England. Am not convinced thst this shouldn't be consigned to Thatcher history though.

Outraged, thankyou! I think i should've known that, really.....
I kind of think that some "anyone but England" malarky is just (irritating and dull) banter. My DH is English and we always enjoy the "boo"/"hurray" competition on the M6 when you get the the "Welcome to..." sign. Is no different from Manchester/Liverpool rivalry, or . Pathetic, boring, whatever, but not malicious.

Not sure. We live in London. I'm English, Scottish DH. Kids feel 50/50 and we spend a lot of time in Scotland with family.

Think Scotland could go it alone and do reasonably well but it wouldn't all be roses.

We'd miss them here in England and be worse off without them. I think it would be a real pity to break it all up and feel that there must be other ways to work it out.

Scotland has certainly had a raw deal from London at times however if I had the vote I'd probably vote NO and so would DH and DD, (DS too small).

I am English and live in England

Let them have it, raise all their own cash and spend accordingly. Good luck with that.
Also it's worth noting that the oilfields where given to the UK so Scotland on its own has no full right to the oil.
And Scottish Pounds are UK sterling so yes get a new currency that's not supported by the Bank of England.

I think we should all get to vote if the Union is up be broken everyone in the Union should vote.

This whole thing about independence is bollocks. Salmond and his cronies want to cherry pick. More rights and power but with Westminster cash. If you want independence then it's all or nothing.

No safety net

I agree that independence has to be all or nothing - but I don't know anyone, not even the most rabid nationalist who would say otherwise. The argument that "people" in Scotland think they should be independent but recieve a stipend from Westminster is frankly bizare. It's got to have been made up by some London-based xenophobic journalist, surely...? :-)

I also agree re: currency. It's a big problem as 5m population and a separate currency where the main world hard currencies are USD and Euro (ie huge populations) is a tricky one.

Everyone in the union voting would be impractical, surely? And expensive. It wouldn't matter what people in Scotland wanted, in a vote that is about self-deteminism, due to the difference in population size the future of Scotland would be decided by people in England, Wales & N Ireland? That makes no sense economically politically or socially.

I don't see your point about oilfields having been "given to the UK". Who by? God? Who exactly had the right to "give" the North Sea to the UK rather than to Scotland (whose territorial waters they are in) or Shetland (which is a whole other world).

I will absolutely be voting YES to independence.

Some of the views and comments on this thread are pathetic.

if the UK breaks up, would England not also have to try and join the EU etc? Maybe worried they won't get in.

*KatieScarlett How little faith you have in the intelligence of your countrymen. Not all of us are ignorant sheep. "

I think all you need to do is read the Dunfermline Press, the local newspaper, to dispel many notions otherwise...

Theres no real quality of political debate, or opposition in Scotland. All the parties have much the same policies, which are tax and spend, and give jobs to their friends and relatives.

It was I who said Scotland was clannish and tribal. It is not, for example, a society based particularly on co-operation with those from a variety of different outlooks and backgrounds. I was just watching Andrew Marr's history programme when he mentioned that China had to learn co-operation outwith their tribe system to stem Yellow River flooding 4000 years ago, and that it marked the emergence of a modern nation. Scotland hasn't really reached that stage yet...

I've been in Holland for three weeks and have heard more eloquent and neutral discussion of their General Election from the dustman than I've heard from any Scottish person. I hesitate to say fellow Scot, because I'm only a quarter Scottish, and that quarter is from Shetland, and many of them dislike the Scots anyway.

Mamababa, this is the kind of attitude I'm refering to. Why the vitriol?

Some of the views and comments on this thread are pathetic.

Proves my point.

And your point is????

Live in Scotland,will be voting against

I'm English and I think if the Scottish want independence then they should have it. I also think it should be all or nothing. If they want out of the UK then they should be completely on their own.

Sorry 'given' was the wrong word. The agreements between Norway and the UK. Yes that's right UK

Xkiity I get angry when we hear of free prescriptions free homes for the elderly etc but yet you get a shit deal from the UK govt?? Based on how many people live in Scotland, how many of them pay tax, and how much is spent I do not understand how it's possible to do these things without huge subsidy. But I am basing that on simple matha so am prepares to be educated.

if the UK breaks up, would England not also have to try and join the EU etc?

I don't see any reason why. The United Kingdom is a member of the EU. If Scotland leaves the UK, the UK just gets a bit smaller but it's still the UK and still a member. The EU will do anything it can to keep the UK as a member, and will certainly not raise any objection.

If Scotland wants to join the EU it will have to ask to join. I've no idea if you will want to, or if you will be accepted and on what conditions. That's your problem.
Your currency will no longer be supported by the Bank of England. You might have to join the euro if they will have you. That's your problem too. Enjoy!

Mamababa, it wasn't me saying about getting a shit deal from the UK government (well, I think everyone gets a shit deal from the Tories but that's for another thread...)
I personally will not be voting for independence and don't want to leave the Union, so it's particularly galling to read these comments.
As for free prescriptions etc it's not that we're getting extra money for this, it's just that spending is prioritised differently by Holyrood so therefore there will be less of the money in the pot spent on various other things.
Please bear in mind that, in all likelihood, the majority of Scots will not be voting for independence, and wish to remain as part of the Union.
Sallyingforth, the tone of your post is also quite uncalled for.
Jesus, I had no idea how much English people despise us

Quite a good article
newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-economy/4235-would-an-independent-scotland-be-financially-sound

Sallyingforth, the tone of your post is also quite uncalled for.

I'm sorry you don't like the tone xkittyx.
Please feel free to rephrase those facts in a nicer tone.

I'm going to bed now but will look for your version in the morning.

Seriously, that article is so phenomenally biased it is beyond belief! There are a million articles that can be linked to that will support either side of the argument, at least try and link to one that isnt so screamingly biased!

Sallyingforth - "if they'll have you". "Enjoy". Snide and very far from having a sensible discussion about the issue.
And I will say - again - that I doubt the majority of Scots are in favour of leaving the Union, and I'm personally not pro-independence and won't vote for it. So I'm not even disputing the issue, just the tone being used about Scotland and Scottish people.

I have no choice but to class myself as British - My mother is English, My Dad was Scottish, I was conceived in Scotland yet born in England.

However, deep down, I identify more with the traditions of Scotland (Presbyterian Church, Gaelic speaking - though far from fluent, the Highlands and Islands are my spiritual home).

Yet I cannot vote in the Referendum as I currently live in England.

I know that all my family living in Scotland are pro-independence. I have Scottish family in America that are moving back for a year purely in order to be able to vote in the referendum. I can't go that far (though wish I could).

As yet, I am still undecided. A huge part of me would vote for independence, for historical reasons, ideological reasons, and the fact that I don't feel that Scotland's interests are well represented in Westminster.

But there is another part of me that feels that ARE the figures good enough to be a stand alone Country? What would happen wrt EU membership? Would Scotland have to adopt the Euro?

It would be quite pointless IMO to gain independence from one union only to jump straight into another one, with no chance to gain an identity as a stand alone Country.

And if Scotland WERE to take on a share of the National debt, how would that be worked out and agreed upon? You can't just say "Do it proportionally, that's fair", because actually, it isn't. So how far do you go back? To before the Clearances? 100 years? 50 years? 25 years? Or does Scotland take on a proportion of ALL the UK's debt, even if the vast majority of that wasn't spent on anything that benefitted Scotland, or anything that Scotland wanted or needed?

I just can't see how things like that could be ironed out...

londonone Seriously, that article is so phenomenally biased it is beyond belief! There are a million articles that can be linked to that will support either side of the argument, at least try and link to one that isnt so screamingly biased!

Now now. In the world of the brave new Scotland, you are meant to pretend, Pravda-esque that the truth is the truth is the truth...

I hope the cybernats don't track me down and eat me.

Every article is biased depending on what your view is. [shrugs]

Love this quote from Blair Jenkins.

"Suppose the Act of Union had never happened, Scotland was still an independent country and the vote we were taking in two years' time was not on whether we should leave the Union but on whether we should join it.

In that scenario, what would be the case for the Union? Your main Parliament will move hundreds of miles away and your MPs will be in a small minority. You will have a Government you didn't vote for.

You will hand over all your oil and gas revenues to the London Treasury. The biggest nuclear arsenal in western Europe will be based on the River Clyde, 30 miles from your largest city.

An austerity budget will be imposed from London, cutting jobs and threatening public services, instead of Scotland being responsible for raising and spending its own taxes. You will join a country whose health and education services are rapidly being privatised."

The nuclear issue would be my most important reason for voting yes, no nukes in an Indy Scotland.

I'm Scottish, living in Scotland. Lived in England for nearly 10 years in 80s/90s. I'll be voting for independence. I encountered a lot of ignorance about Scottish education/laws and culture whilst living in England and even experience this today from extended (English) family. Main one which always gets me is when they go on and on about how much it is costing them in taxes to keep us Scots but if its so bad, then let us go!!! I happen to believe that if it really were that bad, then the UK govt would have got shot of us years ago.....
Regarding tuition fees, prescription charges etc our govt just makes different choices with our taxes....If that's what you want in the rest of the UK then vote for a party which makes it policy.

I am English and a democrat. So obviously any group should have the right to independence. But that goes for Orkneys, Highlands, Clydeside, not just whole of Scotland.
Why so much anger on both sides?
For instance, UK politicians have mostly gone for some austerity as it seems to them the least bad option. We have a massive debt because we've spent too much of our childrens' money. Spend even more if you like, Scotland, after independence but your children will have to pay it back.

Also, meant to say before: "300 years of oppression"!!

I've got family currently trapped in Syria, I think they'd gladly live in currently "oppressed" Scotland instead.