For this little girl to have put me off sending dc to private school.

[reallythough]

Name-changed as I have a feeling I'm going to get flamed and I'm a bit scared.

We are unsure of whether to send our dc to private school or state school at the moment, we have one starting school next September.

DC who will be starting school next year attends pre-school at a nursery attached to a private school which we really love, the staff are brilliant, dc is very happy and has lots of friends. Last week I picked dc up and walking out of the school an 11ish year old girl and her siblings ran out shouting 'oh Daddy you've got your new Range, look at Daddy's new Range everyone' on repeat about 5/6 times whilst looking around to show everyone that she didn't know (it was a particularly nice car).

I don't want our dc growing up surrounded by people who place importance on materialistic posessions at such a young age. It made me wonder whether a state school will be a more organic surrounding for dc to grow in rather than the quite narrow selection of people they will be socialising with at an independent.

I read something the other day about how we try to re-create our own childhood for our children and I went to private school but after juniors was desperately unhappy there and felt trapped. I am not criticising the girl at all but it did remind me that on the whole a lot of the people I went to private school with were very materialistic and quite narrow minded. AIBU for this to have jolted me to have a serious re-think?

If, Xenia, you mean to hold yourself up as a good example of how private education can equip you to deal with people from all walks of life then you've failed.

You have consistently failed to demonstrate any understanding of how people other than high fliers/ high earners live. You might be able to "deal with them" but you have no understanding and no empathy with them at all. Just like the current shower in Govt, really.

Having friends from state schools and other walks of life allows people to see how others live, what their lives are like, what barriers they face etc.

It matters not in the slightest whether you've ever had it tough, by the way - if you have then your lack of empathy and understanding is even more bewildering and offensive.

Here, here Thumb.

"
I made my comments in the light of the statement that somehow children benefit from being at state school, that it gives them skills somehow to handle all kinds of people, to be able to be in this supposed "real world" which I have never understooD"

I think this is a valid point though.

A comma after "real world" would alter the meaning of that statement considerably.

I don't think in terms of my daughters learning to 'handle' people though, but to be able to understand something of their lives, to have encountered them at all, to know they exist and aren't fenced off and away from them.

For example, of the ethnicities which is not cited as being part of the lovely rainbow of diversity one finds in private schools is gypsy/traveller. I think seeing in a day to day setting that actually gypsies and travellers don't all leave school at eleven only to dream of getting a dress from Thelma Madine is of some considerable benefit.

Edgar re your point further down many,many comps have kids from many different backgrounds.I went to one of them.It was shit but there was a wide variety of kids there which included the kids of farm workers,unemployed,forces,teachers....

The school my kids will probably got to is exactly the same-kids will range from being the kids of the unemployed,self employed,shop workers to doctors,vets etc.

It's quite scary how those with little experience of state education really have no idea what it is like and are actually very prejudiced.

i repeat again: whether a school has a wide social mix, is a school vs school thing, not a state vs independent thing.

only one of the comps i went to had a wide social mix, the other two really didn't due to the self-disinclusion of the MC/ UMC element.

I think you are all looking at comps through rose tinted glasses! Yes, you do get children from all walks of life but the reality is that the bottom still sink to the bottom, and this is often, but not always, those from the poorest back grounds. My foster son is at a comprehensive in a very middle class area, however none of his friends at school are in this socio economic group. Children can be just as snobby, despite their left minded parents.

Not all schools are in very middle class areas though.Mine wasn't particularly.By the third year I was in all the top groups but I had already made a variety of friends,still had a variety in tutor groups and actually believe it or not those in the top groups did actually contain a mix to a certain degree-the teaching was still shit and there was still bullying though.

some state schools may not have a broad mix, but no private school has. Selection by fee. Unless 50% of the kids are on full bursaries and even then it'd only be those who have parents who know how to get a kid into private school.

Private schools may have a wide ethnic and faith mix- but they are all catering for a narrow socio- economic group.

This is just fact. Incontrovertible fact.

Possibly- but not all those who send their children to private school are rich- we certainly aren't. We just have an affordable mortgage and spend our money on school fees rather than other luxuries! A couple who both smoke 25 cigarettes a day could cover the fees for our one child. It is all relative.

Yes, I certainly don't buy a lot of things for me or for the children. That's a fairly working class thing to do.

What was I being asked above? Of course I know that comprehensives educated a wide range of children. obviously some are in leafy areas with very expensive houses but in plenty of parts of the country outside big towns there is one school only and most children go there.

(I was asked about the man who used pleb when he should have used prole - if he did at all - let us see the CCTV and why were those jumped up jobsworth policemen suddenly changing the rules? But of course if he were rude he should not have been. He needs latin lessons from Boris J)

Here is a very common proletarian for Xenia.

wouldn't it be nice if people of all walks of life went to the same schools?

wouldn't it be nicer if, instead of then subdividing along lies that roughly follow the exterior forces of social division, kids actually did learn to get along with people of all walks of life??

wouldn't it be great if, then, they all had an equal chance at doing well once they left, depending on ability?

the first isn't the case. the second isn't the case, or at least not at any school i went to (even the best one) the third isn't the case either.

claiming the second occurs at state schools but not private when it seems to happen at neither..where's the evidence for this?

Xenia, your shock comments demonstrate an ignorance that is compatible with a low level IQ. You do understand that these connections that you are buying for your children are not going to equip them with a great amount of advantage in the present and emerging economy don't you? Employers are looking to recruit the best people for the jobs not the best connected. There is too much competition now for any old boys network to hold on to a market and as such employers need the most intelligent, most competent employee that will give them the competitive edge. My DB works as a senior partner in a city law firm, he went to comprehensive in South London and has got in to his position through hardwork and on his own merit. They employ people who are the best and believe me it isn't those with the best connections it's those who can make them the most money!

Prior to my DC I worked in the Cabinet Office and my job involved actively breaking down all the social connections that were prohibiting the quality of the recruits. You're deluded if you think in the UK all the positions of power and decision making are being made by those with connections. You should ask for your money back if you're thinking this is what you're purchasing for your children- guarantees that don't exist! Mind you least they'll know how to 'handle' people that they usually wouldn't be expected to mix with.

Your right. Everyone naturally gravitates to people who are similar to themselves. And no amount of social engineering will really change that.

Golden- on some levels you are correct, however there will equally always be nepotism. This will never change and it happens across all classes.

Scarlett that it utter,utter shite!!!!!!

I can't afford to send my dc to private because we spend our money on luxuries.We don't have luxuries and still couldn't send our 3 dc to private school.We also don't smoke.Most people wouldn't be able to afford to smoke as a couple and thankfully the vast maj of people don't.

I have no friends that smoke and none that fritter money on luxuries,oh to have money to fritter!

"You're deluded if you think in the UK all the positions of power and decision making are being made by those with connections. "

did Xenia claim this? if so, she wasn't the only one - some have attributed the success of public school students to this.

I think there is much more to the high pre-ponderance of public school educated people in public office. I think there may be something about that type of education that produces more confident candidates.

I did sit the civil service exams, and fluffed the interview stage (in a memorably cringeworthy fashion). connections wouldn't have got you anywhere with it. being confident, outspoken, highly educated - those things would have helped.

Scarlett your last comment was completely untrue too.

The one re people gravitating to those like themselves.

People will only do those if they are given no choice,are led to believe that is what they should do or if they have little confidence.

Nepotism is only perpetuated if it offers some advantage, if the advantage no longer exists it will cease to be relevant - like I said old boys networks don't own markets how they used to so they can no longer afford to act in this way if they want to remain rich!