To be fed up with my mother

[Netguru]

Long post to try to avoid drip feeding.

Ten years ago my then husband and I decided to add in an annex to our home to rent out for extra income. Finding out about our plans, my mother who lived locally asked if she could move into it and, in return, allow me to rent her house out instead. Whilst the rent would even itself out, she would benefit from no bills and security and I would benefit from child care. She was then 62.

My husband and I divorced and I remarried, buying a new house with my new partner (now husband). He took on the dog, three kids (then 18, 11 and 9) and my mother - who expressed a wish to move with us. We found a house with a small annex (18ft by 10 ft) and said we would enlarge it as and when we could afford to.

Paying the bills for mum turned into two newish cars, various holidays, sky, phone etc. She got older and was in pain from a bad back, so she looked after the children less and less, often resorting to taking them to McDonald for tea rather than cooking a meal - or leaving the eldest to sort out things for the two younger ones (now 21, 13 and 10). Swimming lessons were 'too difficult' driving 5 miles to school 'too expensive on petrol' so a credit card was provided for that.

Her friends come to see her, I leave them alone. People come to see us and she trundles over, uninvited, and sits down in the middle of the conversation. I know she liked the company but she has clearly forgotten that there need to be boundaries.

It felt like we were paying more and more with mum doing less and less. She was moaning to sll her freinds that she was tired and the children were too much work yet she wouldn't do anything but the minimum eith them no baths, no homework, no clubs. I get home at 8pm when I work so her reluctance means that none of this gets done at all. So bad have been thinking about quitting work for a while.

She was getting older and more frail so I could live with

So why the post?

She is a mild hoarder and her flat got more and more crammed with stuff. I have not been allowed up there for months and she knew I would be irritated at the mess. I don't want her to throw away her memories or keepsakes but I don't see why she needs tubs of used batteries, piles of cardboard boxes or three bloody washing up bowls in a room with one sink. Even so, that is her business - or it would have been if she was happy but she wasn't. So we've blown our savings getting the place extended - more space to fill with crap. Hoping it would make her happy and stop the constant 'poor me' routine.

No such luck. She phoned me at work today to say she was going to buy another tv. The building work is not yet finished, the garage is full of her stuff, her flat is full, the new extension isn't finished. I can't pay my credit card bill this month because of the work, yet she was going to go and buy a 2nd tv which doesn't even have a room to go in to. It's a small thing I know - but I snapped.

Why now? I'm trying to juggle builders, decorators, get carpets done when you can't even see the floor in the place and she not only wants to buy more but has to call me at work about it and then act all hurt when I say wait a few days.

I am tired of being the adult. I am tired of saying no. I am tired of being the bad guy.

Before I snapped today I have tried to talk to her. I'm pretty useless at confrontation and she is even worse. 'Please give me a little privacy in my home' is interpreted as 'we don't want you'. 'Please stop moaning about us to everyone' is 'we are ungrateful'

I know we benefit from having another adult in the house. Going back to the original agreement, we made it on the basis that all would be better off - not just financially but in every way. I feel I have done my bit but she has done less and less and is also unhappy.

I need her to take one child to school each day, cook something for the two of them at night, sit while they do their homework (twice a week) and make sure the boy has a bath occasionally. If a childminder/au pair agreed to do these basic things and then didn't I'd give them notice.

What on earth do I do?

Well I´d be getting an au pair in, I think!

Plus perhaps putting the rent on her house aside so that she can have that if she wants.

And having a clear out of the annexe!

Ps you seem very anxious for it not to look like you're the bad guy, throwing out an elderly lady, which is quite understandable, so it's really important that you phrase the text (or letter) to make it clear that you aren't throwing her out, you are agreeing with her that it isn't working and also concerned about her obvious unhappiness.

Don't do it by phone call because there will be no written record and she'll twist it to her friends and say you phoned up telling her to leave. Of course she won't necessarily choose to show her friends what you actually write, but it will make you feel in a stronger position knowing there is a record of what's actually been told to her. If you know the friends address a good old fashioned letter may be best as at least the friend will know you've written.

Having my Inlaws here was fascinating. We are not particularly close but they are calm rational people

They haven't been your live in 'help' for the last 10-12 years though have they?

My jaw has been on the floor reading this thread.

First time I've ever said this on here OP but you sound entitled I don't think you've done badly out of the arrangement over the years and now your mother is older and tiresome you feel like you're not getting enough back?

Words fail me.

My mother threw a hissy fit that should couldn't buy a tv, walked out calling me an absolute bitch - and I'm the one who is behaving entitled.

Well. That is your opinion. You must be a much nicer person than me.

I'm sorry to hear it has come to this.

I think part of the problem is that the boundaries have become very blurred. For example if you collect the rent on her house and effectively manage her finances, it means she has become dependent and may also resent you having so much control. She may be afraid of being on her own again, which feeds her resentment.

It makes far more sense for you to have the annex for an au pair for a couple of years until your youngest is able to take care of himself.

Do you have any siblings or anyone else who can help you to sort this out?

The things we do to not pay £950 a week for nursing home care! That's what my mums fees were a week.
I'm not sure what the answer is but Why don't you sell the house now and get her some private care. It would provide company and help. At 72 she is too old to be doing child care for you. This day was going to come so you should have had that discussion really.

I think the mother is behaving badly but I also think there are a few things which don't hang together and it would be helpful for the op to clarify

Who made the arrangement for PIL to decorate the annex? If it was you op, why did you expect your mother to make coffee and lunch and be generally welcoming? Especially as you know she has form for not being like that? It reads as if you got PIL in to decorate and disappeared off out somewhere (clearly not work, as you mention being home by 4 pm and your work hours are much longer ) Why are the 70 yr old PIL decorating anyway ??

Whatever the in and outs this is clearly a co dependent relationship and the whole thing smacks of living in eachothers pockets. However either party feels now, each side entered into it for what they were going to get out of it. It's now gone sour so time to get out. Personally I would advise renting the annex to someone outside the family; keep things on a professional footing. Generally speaking, getting grandparents to live in or be involved in regular childcare is fraught with difficulties. It would have been far better to let her remain in her house and sort your own domestic arrangements in the first place (though I'm sure you realise that now!)

I think part of the problem is that the boundaries have become very blurred. For example if you collect the rent on her house and effectively manage her finances, it means she has become dependent and may also resent you having so much control. She may be afraid of being on her own again, which feeds her resentment.

I think on reflection this is a really good insight.

It doesn't sound like she needs a nursing home yet.

Some 72 year olds are very active and when mine was that age regularly invited my kids to stay for a few days in the holidays.

Ps - I know you said MIL suggested you go out, but really, did you expect your mother to offer lunch to the in laws? By your own admission she is difficult and stroppy and was upstairs watching daytime telly and hadnt even come down to say hello! In your situation I would have stayed to help decorate or at least laid some lunch out ready.

I don't wish to offend, but for someone who is clearly a capable high earning woman in the workplace , you seem to have a rather childlike dependence on having your mother around , even though she is an extremely difficult woman. And you seem to blindly carry on in situations which your common sense should tell you won't work. You know what your mother is like- what on earth did you expect when your inlaws came round? And this is the 4th time she has walked off threatening to leave! Unless you decide to put a stop there will be a 5th, 6th and many more times.

Why shouldnt she buy a new TV though?!

But its clearly not just about that is it? And yes sorry but you do sound entitled.

Sorry - as ever it's easy to leave an unintentional false impression.

I was gone two hours buying uniform (two shops in two counties). I brought back a takeout lunch for them as a treat and then carried on decorating with them until they left. The lunch and coffee thing, like most of the things I have mentioned are side issues I guess. It's just she can get around, make coffee for her friends, go out to museums and lunches, but when people are helping her out she sits, sulks and leaves them to it. I guess I just think that is rude.

She should and could buy a new TV. She just didn't need to a) call me at work about it - I'd seen here that morning, there were no plans then. b) buy it when the space for it was still open to question and there was a danger that she would buy the wrong one size wise and then face a struggle taking it back c) act so hard done by when I just asked her to wait a couple of days.

That was so bitchy on my part? Really?

But you mentioned the lunch and coffee thing, so clearly it is an issue to you. That's the part I don't get.

You have a mother who was never really into domesticity, even while raising you. She is difficult and selfish and does things for herself and her friends but not other people.

So why oh why oh why get her involved with your own domestic arrangements in the first place? Why battle on with it 10 years later when she's miserable, you're miserable and now the kids are hearing her bad mouthing you?! The only thing which really surprises me is why your dh is still prepared to put up with all this crap!

I keep banging on about the co dependency but that the real issue here. You need to reflect on what it is which makes you feel you need your mother tied up with your own life when you are a capable grown up. What is it about the dynamic which makes you feel you both need to hang into something which doesn't work for either of you?

I didn't say it was bitchy NetGuru. I just don't think its something you should take issue with.

As others have said its not working as boundaries appear blurred.

Good post janey

I've just sat and re-read the whole thread. I've taken on board the minority points that I should just let her do what she wants as I earn a lot. But mostly, the recurring view is that I should not have go thyself in to this situation in the first place - and no one will be happy if it continues.

I can take that on board. Ugh.

Netguru, don't beat yourself up too much. You have got a lot on your plate with three children, a demanding job and a husband who also has a demanding job, not to mention a house with tenants and building work going on.

Probably projecting my own feelings about my mum here, but if your mum wasn't all that great when you were growing up you may well be feeling permanently 'off balance' around her, constantly trying to fix something that you can't really fix on your own.

I lost my Dad when he was 72 years old... I'll do anything to have him back.

It sounds like the original plan is not working, for either sides. Time to sit down, and talk, honestly. No confrontation needed, just listen to each other. Or, if face to face is too hard, both write a letter to each other. You mention boundaries and responsibilities... Now she's 72 yrs, I don't think she can be capable or much responsibility... I know everyone's different, but she should be enjoying her retirement and what time she has left... Doing what she wants to do. If that doesn't suit you, then, something needs to change.

I'm sorry to hear that the situation is depressing you. It sounds like you've got a lot on your plate, and maybe, it's time for change in your life too, to make your life easier. Easier said than done, I know.. But, surely, there can be some compromise. Something needs to change. I wish you well.

I would really advise you take the first step in texting or writing to her, along the lines of

'mum, I'm sorry that you are clearly very unhappy with arrangements as they are, and have been for some time. I am too. We need to get together and plan the next steps for all of us so that we can all have our independence back'

Get in there first before she just rolls up in a few days when her friends had enough of her. Otherwise nothing will change

Good advice janey68

Your mum does sound depressed. Apathy, laziness, unreasonable behaviour, financial obliviousness, lack of emotional responsibility and empathy are all symptoms I displayed when I had depression. That and eating crappy food because I had no energy to eat properly.

It must be horrible for her - she probably feels claustrophobic, infantilised, dependent and picked on.

Equally it must be horrible for you - having to take responsibility for someone that you should be able to rely on, taken advantage of etc. It's nigh on impossible to find an acceptable solution when someone is unwell in this way. Perhaps try talking about why she is unhappy, and then lay out your bottom line for what is and isn't acceptable. Perhaps renting out the annex is a better situation?

All the best - I really do feel for you.

Sympathy here for you too NetGuru. The way I read your posts is not that you're pissed off at not getting what you want, it's that you don't want much, aren't getting it from your mum whereas even though you're meeting her increasing demands she's still not happy. Lose-lose.

It doesn't really matter that your plan was not the best idea from the outset, you've made that decision and can't change it. The key is trying to make the best of the situation you're in now. I like janey68's idea of trying to start a conversation acknowledging that the situation isn't working for either of you. I almost don't think it matters what you agreed 10 years ago. A frank exchange of what you each want, need and can give now is what's required.

Well sounds like the situation is solved then but I still dont understand why you didnt just pay for a nanny in the first place given that you and your dh earn a small fortune? why did you need the income from your mothers home when you have that sort of household income? smacks of entitled to me......

Pink that's the bit I didn't quite get either!

If the OPs mum were an au pair she'd have had to give her time off, an allowance and accomodation for the babysitting she got back. Her mum shouldn't have had to give up her own income (rent profits from her house) either. Then should wouldve been able to pay for her own holidays and sky TV etc.

My understanding is that the OPs mum asked to move in. She was 62 and presumably knew her own mind when she negotiated this deal with her daughter.

However it hasn't worked out, so the problem is what to do now?