To feel I have just witnessed child abuse?

[mrsrosieb]

Please note I have only used medical terms in this post and nothing I am writing is meant to be insulting towards obese people.

I have just witnessed a morbidly obese woman pushing a pram with 2 older children-one about 9 and one about 14. These children are dangerously obese from a medical point of view.

I felt so sorry for them. If mum wants to eat a diet that makes her obese that is her choice and I have no problem with that. What I have a real issue with is raising children that may go on to suffer heart disease and diabetes-plus getting a ragging from the school bullies.

I know the SS have removed children like this. Am I right in thinking this is child abuse?

'how come 50 years ago pretty much no one was overweight at all - surely these conditions existed back then as well?'

Huge lifestyle changes over the last 50 years have made an enormous impact on the health of everyone in the UK. When I was a teenager, I knew no one who went to a gym, there were 3 channels on the TV and PCs hadn't been invented for the domestic market. We walked so much just to get places, and a lot of traditional industries were very physically demanding.

wordfactory I wonder what those people in the states think about the celebs who are normal weight or too thin? I totally agree doublevodka

It has to be looked at at a societal level, not just individuals. I know there is a sort of paradox here, in that society is made up of individuals who can buy and eat and feed their children what they like, and take responsibility for it; but at the same time it is ridiculous to pretend that the environment, the culture, the prices and availabilities of things, don't influence people; it is stupid to pretend that there are no such things as trends, and things on a bigger scale relating to our individual shapes and sizes.
It is stupid to pretend these things, but it is what we are supposed to pretend because it forces blame onto the individual while leaving the market free and greedy and damaging us all.

"voluntarism":

thedirtistemporary.tumblr.com/post/29415664452/olympian-voluntarism

I remember when all the shops were shut on Sunday, apart from a corner shop about 3 miles walk from home. So when I was desperate for a Dairy Milk, i had to do a bloody long walk to get one. We used to walk to school and that was a fair old trek too. Those days are gone, now.

Exactly fallen. Many people say that they are overweight because of hormones, genetics etc and they just cant help it. It is far more likely that it is because they eat too much of the wrong food and do not do any excercise.

However, although I agree with the fact that lifestyles have changed, I do not agree that this is an excuse for being very overweight.

I am yet to meet anyone that is fat for any other reason than they eat too much and do too little. Myself included. I was slim until I hit my mid 30's. I could blame putting on weight to getting older but I'd be fooling myself. I was out of work for a while, boredom set in and I ate more.

couthy I was not disputing that steroids make you ravenous. I was stating that by controlling your calorific intake you could control/avoid weight gain. You stated that you put on weight with no changes (to diet/exercise) everytime. If this were the case why did you not make changes?

As I stated dd was in a Hugh dose of steroids for a long time. I didn't want to get to the end and have to basically say to her 'you're fat you need a diet' so I explained the side effects of the steroids and we focused on her diet while she was on the medication. It was hard for her and for me, but it worked. (during this period of steroids she was also quite restricted physically as her condition caused arthritis in her joints, mainly knees and ankles, so the same results are likely to be achievable with increased exercise rather than decreased calories)

Sorry should preview

On a huge dose of steroids ^

YANBU and Shorter whilst I agree with some of what you say re schools sorry I think you're ignoring the fact food is a parents responsibility and it isn't hard to feed a healthy diet on a budget as I do it.

I'd never buy shop sandwiches as they're far too expensive.My dc have cream cheese,peanut butter,Quorn sandwiches which are way below 500 calories.A small piece of Savers fruit is a lot cheaper than a packet of branded crisps.Home made meals are far cheaper than ready made/convenience foods full of crap.Veg is cheap to fill up on,ditto rice etc.

One of my dc is fussy and only really loves junk food but I never buy it.If I gave into him he'd be huge but he's in a normal skinny boy.I serve cheap healthy meals and he goes without if he doesn't eat them.It's my job to teach him healthy eating and to to help him grow into a healthy adult.

fallencarytid i think someone mentioned car use which has COMPLETELY changed in the last 50 yrs. there's a thread on here with the O.P. complaining about her DH who doesn't want his 11yr old DD to walk to school That is another change.

Eating to much of the wrong food causes obesity. I am overweight myself but living in Africa, I have never seen a overweight, starving African. Medical condition or not and if you think all these medical conditions that supposedly cause obesity don't exist in starving people, think again.

Autism, thyroid problems, etc dont only happen in western countries.

Good point chicactoe - look at lots of other countries (you dont actually have to travel that far) - people there will have exactly the same sorts of medical conditions as here, but far fewer overweight people.

And it's pig ignorant to make out that obesity doesn't exist in none western countries.

Prevalence studies carried out by the World Health Organisation put it at 15% in Africa, 14% in Asia, 24% in Europe

Are those statistics linked to income levels?

Klad then you misunderstood my post. What I was saying was not that obesity doesn't exist in non western countries but that it doesn't exist in starving people. Pre-existing medical condition or not. It is directly food that causes obesity and not a medical condition.

I am confused by the implication that people's greed and sloth are causing society at large to become fatter.

Have people always had a tendency to be greedy and slothful - yes
Are people as a group in this country getting fatter - yes
Do we believe that people in general are getting greedy and slothful more than ever before - no I don't.

I think society has changed in a way that promotes fatness. I think it is directly related to late capitalism. I think people are under ever greater pressure to consume certain things (to indulge greed and sloth) and statistically the set of people able to withstand the pressure is growing smaller relative to the set who can't (because the pressure* is increasing, not the intrinsic greed and sloth)

If you don't agree with this, you have to be arguing that human nature has substantially changed in a generation, which I think is a weird and stupid argument (but I would be happy to hear someone make it, if only for a laugh)

If you do agree with this you should be arguing for societal changes to protect us from the pressures of late capitalism, not haranguing chubby individuals

*some of the pressure is actually physical: certain foods have the power of addictive chemicals to drive overconsumption. overconsumption is the holy grail of late capitalism

Alternatively, I suppose you might be arguing that human nature has not changed, but it must: we must all as individuals work ever harder to maintain our good health and that of our children in the face of ever increasing pressure from late capitalism to be fat. The basic resistance to greed and sloth which used to do, is no longer enough, and we all have to ramp it up.

This is because anything is a variable, except the logic of the market. We can change human nature, or we can die as 30 year-olds of obesity related diseases, but god forbid that we question capitalism.

ppeat - celeb culture and the prevalence of thin people in the media is the same in the US as in the UK if not worse.

However, there is a huge disconnect between the life of someone in a magazine and somone's real life. There is also a huge disconnect between communities in the US and never the twain shall meet.

vezzie you make some very thought provoking points. Did you read my post earler about the addictive nature of wheat? That and sugar \corn syrup sweeeteners etc. and salt is what keep the manuf. rich and the people fat.

But vezzie, there are people in this day and age who do manage to maintain a healthy weight (and that of their kids), by not eating shit and doing a bit of excercise.

They are not making a huge stand against capitalism or making massive changes in human nature, they are just using a bit of common sense and taking a bit of personal responsibility. It is just that you have to make those choices a bit more consciously.

doublevodka, I know there are people who can. That is why I am not talking about individuals but about groups within society.

In the worst school in the country (to make a random analogy) there will be some bright, studious kids who manage to do well. That doesn't mean that no changes need to be made to the school. There is no point in saying to the ones who might have got 6 GCSEs (ok was never going to Cambridge but deserves a chance at something) but didn't get anything, "Well if Harry can do it why can't you?"