To think David Cameron has got it completely and utterly wrong re sport in schools,a competitive ethos should come after raising levels and a love of sport?itness

[Prarieflower]

Thats it really.Fat lot of good creating a more competitive ethos will do if the maj of teenagers are unfit and loath PE. Competition actually puts many children off sport full stop.

I went to secondary school in the 80s when non sporty types were ridiculed and made to feel like failures during PE lessons and Sports Day. Competition ruled over all else,nobody did sport just for enjoyment or just to maintain fitness.As a result I and many others did all we could to avoid PE lessons and thought we hated all sport.

For years I did nothing and then I discovered I enjoyed hiking,cycling and swimming-just for me.Who knows, if any had been provided and encouraged just for fitness I may well have gone on to take part in competitive events.Having better fitness levels for a start would have made that more likely.

I think schools should be encouraged to help pupils to pick sports they enjoy,they should be expected to take part in something of their choice more frequently. There should be a wide range linked to off school sites and red tape should be cut. There should be better facilities and the selling off of school fields stopped. There should be access to tasters in the specialised stuff like the dreaded javelin and shot put(sp?) which I hated. Sports Day which only celebrates athletics should be only for those that are interested and want to take part.Those that want to go the gym or have a swim should be able to do just that.Other sports should be celebrated not just athletics.

My kids are far more positive re PE than I ever was so I think schools of today are doing something right,it just needs to be extended further.

David Cameron simply doesn't have a clue re state school provision and it's needs.

Not very knowledgeable re sport so I'll await my flaming.I'm just observing and speaking as a previous sport avoider and now as a mum.

That's all very well Prarie but that assumes that you have the time to travel to a gym during the lesson time available - unlikely. We used to use our town sports centre at 6th form college to play badminton. We used to waste so much time getting there and back there was barely any time to play.

You also assume that all private schools have loads of sports facilities. I don't think they do. DH went to a private school and I have visited our local one and looked at another nearby which is reknowed for being sporty. Neither have the facilities for rowing. Cycling you did if you brought your own bike to school and it was for fun. IME the private schools are more competitive about sport not less and do a lot more of the same team games they do at state schools. Sharing won't necessarily help even if they had spare capacity for state schools (which are often a lot bigger) to use.

I think competitive sport is hugely important, and chose schools for my DC that agree.

Learning to compete is a great skill in life. Assessing what you have to do, to be better than someone else will be essential.

Being part of a team is also essential. DC need to experience this regularly. The camaraderie. The spirit. The understanding that you are part of somehting bigger than you and that you rise or fall together.

And probably the best thing sport can offer is learning how to lose. Confronting the sad fact that you've just been trounced and that nothing bad happened. Just dust yourself off and start again.

Priceless.

Ok although transport and time taken getting to the gym needs to be considered as well as a gym that can cater for that many people at once. All our local gyms are expensive and busy (inner London) would be surprised to see this happen. Using other facilities for pilates/zumba etc. Still is the one size fits all experience. Plus requires extra funding, and funding for transport of constantly moving kids backwards and forwards for what would be maximum of 50 minutes int he gym once a week.

If you teach zumba and pilates there will be my DS saying its not fair he wants to go and play football. There will be my DD wanting to go swimming or practice her sprinting. There will be my niece who wants tennis or badminton. If you've got one teacher at the gym, one out doing cycling (around central London, I wouldn't allow this anyway, heath & safety nightmare), one doing pilates, one doing zumba, where are the 4 needed to teach badminton/tennis, football, swimming and athletics.

Funding is a good idea, funding always helps. However like most things in school you won't please everybody. Some people love PE, but they hate maths or RE and they get little choice in that.

I have a few problems with the idea of competition. If there are other curriculum areas that are competitive fine, but in most primaries, sport is the main competition. If we let primary children feel that they are failures, not able to compete at that age, how will they ever gain a love of a sport suited to them that they can take on to adulthood? To accept that you can't be good at everything, we should be giving the opportunity to be seen as good at something (art, drama, reading, chess, computers etc)
If the UK is going to offer different sports, the training needs to be spot on. My secondary school offered squash as an option at a local sports club. We turned up, were ignored, and played with no instruction. Several operations later and my playing days are gone as my knees have given up.

Or their parents could just enrol them at junior gym at their local leisure centre but no that is too much effort so let the school do it.

I have a few problems with the idea of competition. If there are other curriculum areas that are competitive fine, but in most primaries, sport is the main competition. If we let primary children feel that they are failures, not able to compete at that age, how will they ever gain a love of a sport suited to them that they can take on to adulthood? To accept that you can't be good at everything, we should be giving the opportunity to be seen as good at something (art, drama, reading, chess, computers etc)
If the UK is going to offer different sports, the training needs to be spot on. My secondary school offered squash as an option at a local sports club. We turned up, were ignored, and played with no instruction. Several operations later and my playing days are gone as my knees have given up.

Indeed, word. That's why I find it so offensive that Cameron is peddling the DM myth that state schools don't do it.

sorry - posted twice. The squash must have affected my hands too

Sooooo Sirzy what exactly should be done on a budget of zero?

Personally I think schools need to start funding more widespread,better facilities ie gyms etc.Kind of hard when all the funding and land has been axed though.Maybe they could look at building communal school gyms/facilities(don't have to be posh) for schools in areas with several schools within walking distance.

Specialist teachers coming in isn't impossible.

Creativity is needed.

Our primary school isn't perfect but I have to say it's offered a huge variety of sports to my 3 unsporty kids and got them interested,joining up for things.The older kids bring in their bikes and go off cycling in groups round the town,masses of different team games and clubs,Zumba,there is cross country jogging club before school etc,etc.We seem to win at loads of inter school sports matches and we have a low level competitive sports day,pitched just right.

Nit just so you know I said the comments about private schools and I don't have those things. All mine are in state schools and its not that I don't want to share, its that I don't think its feasible. There is some truth in your post but not entirely.

Sorry ruby, the comments I found laughable and telling were these:

*Why should private schools share their facilities? Why?

As a fee payer, I already struggle to pay for my own children. Why should I pay for anyone else's beyond the humungous income tax we pay?

I don't see your average private school having any access to the ££££ in grants that are available to only the state sector.*

cantspel, I think you make an excellent point. Parents are responsible for their children doing some sort of physical activity. Although there are people who are genuinely hard up and can't afford clubs etc, most people can afford to make sure their kids do something physical at least.

Even going for a walk to the park and the like is a good thing.

Maybe parents who can't afford it could get extra help?

Prarieflower - I wish I had a mum like you when I was 13!

my son is beating boys from the lovely non charitable private schools anyway poor poor bedford boys

Btw, my son's primary school did Yoga once a week. They had a qualified instructor in. I was really impressed.

Ruby they could pick and choose,sign up at the beginning of the year,change termly if they want.Our large primary school manages it.Sends out letters,kids choose and they run what is picked. Admittedly it's largely clubs straight after school here but totally possible in a secondary during the school day with an entire PE dept at hand.

I do think they should have a bash at everything in the first year though.Maybe have mandatory PE lessons 1 lesson a week after then free choice the other 2,3 or maybe 4.If the PE choices are fluid they may wish to go back into something later on.

Maybe schools are already doing this or something similar.Would be interesting to hear from actual PE teachers.

I just want to make a serious point now. Some people cannot leave their house because of illness or disability and it is their children who suffer, it's not all to do with money. Yes some people are lazy but I know in the holidays my boys are penned in because of their severely disabled sibling for a whole 7 weeks. We live nowhere near family. they could easily get fat or suffer mental health problems long term which prevent them from joining clubs etc.

Social services give us 7 hours respite a month so it's what we are stuck with. I hope we are good parents but you can only parent within your means and I just try and keep mine all safe and happy

You really cant see why even with a unlimited budget your plans are so unworkable do you? Have you ever spent time working in a school?

Competitive sport is almost all there is as soon as you hit 12.

DD1 would love to trampoline, dive, do some sort of swimming fitness.

She's never going to be good, but she'd do it for fun.

I spent hours and hours playing tennis, I loved it and I'm useless. That didn't matter I could serve in court and get the ball back reasonably often. That was quite enough for my better friends to use me to practice with.

In winter the same crowd of us played badminton, often with the rugby allergic boys.

A couple of girls played for the county, one went off to teach PE.

We all had fun and with that, a bit of swimming and a lot of cycling stayed fit.

OwlLady, I'm sorry to hear that you aren't getting the support you need. You sound like a really good person and fwiw a good parent. You clearly care about your dc.

Sirzy I'm an ex teacher.

are you talking to me sirzy?

I do art lessons within a school voluntarily out of my own pocket

but only occasionally, I don't suggest everyone does the same

Do expand, once you have stopped laughing, nit.

Just sounded rather like a selfish and petulant child!

Soooo Sirzy I've made my suggestions what do you suggest to raise fitness levels and future Olympic success because if it's just telling kids that second is the first of the losers(as suggested further down the thread)it won't work and actually is completely counter productive.