to say something about SIL's baby plans

[nomorethan2thankyou]

ok bit of background. SIL (DHs sister) has 2DCs and we have two DCs. she is a single mum, absolutely lovely and loves her children more than anything. however, she does have a range of health issues which mean that me and DH help her with looking after her DCs a lot (at least one day every weekend and over school hoidays with her eldest). we are happy to do this because she really needs the help and her two DCs are lovely and get on with ours really well, but we do find it exhausting with them altogether. she does struggle with them at home, especially when her youngest DS was a little baby and did need help from the family a lot.
well at the weekend, she told us that she had decided she was going to have another baby by having one night stands until she got pregnant basically. i think she expected us to be pleased for her. we just kind of froze and didn't know what to say. she thinks she can manage it (i think she has forgotten how hard she found it when her youngest DS was newborn) because she knows she has help from family (DHs parents help her out all week with her DCs).
not only are we worried about the risks she is taking with her health and her managing on her own with 3DCs, but we are also worried about PIL managing (in their 60s with their own health issues). she is also heavilly in debt and gets by on her overdraft, so we do worry about her coping financially as well.
DH thinks she is being selfish and feels angry with her. i feel sorry for her because i know she isn't happy and desperately wants something to make her happy (i think she may be a bit depressed, which is making it harder for her to manage her current health issues, although i don't think it would be a good idea for me to say anything). PIL just desperately want her to be happy and will always help her out when she needs them no matter what, although i'm certain they don't believe it is a good idea.
the fact is although DH and I are happy to help her out with her two DCs, realistically we all know as time goes on and it becomes more difficult for her and PIL she is going to be relying on us more and more to help. we love them and are happy to take on more of an active role with them. but the fact is we couldn't manage to help in this way if she had another one, 4DCs together is hard enough for us (we only had 2DCs oursleves for a reason!). we know it is her decision, but surely if you know you are going to rely on help from others then you need to consider them as well?
i know she will carry out her plan and will get pregnant. don't know what to do. do we say anything? do we tell her that we can't manage to look after all 5 and if she does have another one she'll have to sort something else out (thats what DH thinks we should do but i know if we withdrew that support it would only make more work for PIL), do we need to get a bit tough and do as another family member has said and tell her to stop being selfish? really don't know what to do but we cannot manage with helping her with anymore children. that might make us the selfish ones but we can't change that.
sorry about the length of this post.

I dont think Lastnerve was being intentionally disrespectful. Of course people with disabities can be sexy and have living relationships. I think Lastnerve meant that the type of man who would go straight round to sil's house ( with her dc there) for sex on a first date are probably not going to be expecting someone in pain, unable to move and needing a lot of assistance. Just like they probably don't expect her children to be there and probably don't expect to be a sperm donor for child number 3 either!!

"I'm surprised that many men are lining up to sleep with someone who sounds like a bit of an invalid."

I really don't want to hijack this thread but I have to say that, intentional or not, the statement above is offensive and as a person with a disability I felt obliged to point it out.

I feel unable to stay silent in the face of terms such as 'invalid' and the assumption that disabled people are, by default, unattractive.

It's not just LastNerve who thinks this way, it's quite a common belief and one that I believe should be challenged. No hard feelings against LastNerve, just very hard feelings against that way of thinking. Now that Lastnerve is aware of this I'm sure she will take it on board.

Hijack over.

This all strikes me as really really sad, she obviously has a lot of problems and believes a baby will bring her happiness. She is right it is her body and she can make whatever decisions she likes about it, however she is not right to expect/demand your support and guilt you into giving it - stick firm on the fact that you cannot and will not provide further support and hopefully she will think twice - work on PIL to say the same. Maybe an email or letter outlining your concerns may be less heated, i'd keep away from the One night stand, respect issues etc as she can claim this is not your business and focus on the practical side. How she will not be able to manage and that you cannot support her further. She is being completely selfish and unrealistic to expect PIL to do so, at their age their health could change at any time and even if they wanted to support her they may not be able to, you would not be prepared to pick up the slack in this event and therefore she is being irresponsible in even considering bring a baby into the world that she could not look after in these circumstances. Fast forward a few years, the older kids will end up looking after the baby and themselves whilst also caring for mum.

Should add, she really needs help and some counselling

SIL needs to look for a life for herself outwith the home and DCs.

She needs to join clubs, meet people.

I was a SAHM and found it boring and I was fit enough to go out and about.

Better to put energies into helping in that way.

It's not just LastNerve who thinks this way, it's quite a common belief and one that I believe should be challenged. No hard feelings against LastNerve, just very hard feelings against that way of thinking. Now that Lastnerve is aware of this I'm sure she will take it on board.

I'm sorry if that comment was offensive and it cam across in a way that was against disabled people it wasn't meant that way.

I meant that someone physically is unable to look after ther children in the most basic ways e.g changing nappies , but is physically able to have sex with lots of different men? something doesn't sit right with me you can't have it both ways.

I'm not implying she is ugly or what not , I'm Implying someone that promiscuous has to have some kind of physical stamina like I said you can't have it both ways. Especially the sort of men she is looking for.

*came across , lots of typos there.

I also don't think Lastnerve is being deliberately disrespectful - I certainly wasn't offended by the comments made or terms used, IMHO I think in a lot of cases, if the intention is good, then there is no problem with terminology used, the problem arises when the overly PC brigade make an issue where none really exists - IMHO this does no-one any favours.

& FTR as an "Invalid" I think actually lastnever makes a very valid point - I didn't read it as presumption that illness or disability makes us sexless - but that if the OPs SIL has the health & energy to be looking for & engaging with various one night stands - which requires even more effort than a loving & considered DP - then she she sure as hell has the energy/health to be looking after her own DCs.

nomore I am really glad your DH stood up & spoke out, he is a real star for doing that & I just hope your PIL do come around & see sense.

but the more I read, the more I am sure there is a Narcissistic Personality disorder going on with your DSIL - my DM is one as is my DB , so I know the signs well - a massive sense of entitlement but complete out of touch with reality & absolutely no empathy for anyone else that her actions effects - inappropriate behaviour with DCs - telling a 7 yr old she's going to have another baby in her circumstance is NOT on & generally feeling they have a right to be the centre of everyones universe no matter who that is, or how unfair - I also wonder how much she uses her health problems to control you all - especially PIL as its a role they will find hard to break - my DM is genuinely ill, yet still constantly invents illness & will use it to control to a quite fanatical degree - this has become more & more obvious with age, but looking back it was always there

i know a lot of the time is genuine, you can tell straight away. however, sometimes (especially if the latest bloke hasn't called back) it does seem that her frame of mind is makes it more difficult for her to manage milder symptoms

I'm not saying she's not ill, but that speaks volumes - yes her state of mind can affect her health - but like the rest of us, she CAN still get on with it & cope with bringing up her own DCs - the fact that she chooses not too & feels its everyone elses job & feels is acceptable to wallow in her illness, all pity me, pity me, when life doesn't go her way, tells me that quite likely she does a lot more of that, than you & her family realise - as the DD of a Narcissist, I really feel for her poor DCs & all of you who care for her:(

Thank you rockinhippy.

Tell her straight, she can't manage with the ones she as, and that you will not be a le to help if she decides to have another.

Have just caught up with this and OP, your husband sounds like a star! Your SIL, not so much.

Honestly, if she really cannot see what she is doing/planning to do is wrong, then I would consider talking to SS for some help and advice. A friend of mine did when she was struggling as a single mum with twins and a baby and they got her some help which was gratefully received.

This is actually making me really angry for you OP. Those poor children.

Goodness, what a kind and generous person you are OP.
Could your sil talk to anyone to discover the root cause of her unhappiness and perhaps decide for herself that it is not a responsible path to take?

Tough love was needed and given. PIL are enabling her which isn't helping. For the sake of your own DC and the time you need with them and your DH I think withdrawing a bit would give her a bit of a reality check. It would be useful if PIL could do the same even if they explain it's for her to see the realities of how well she could manage. After all, God forbid, but something could happen to any of you tomorrow. She cannot just assume you will all be there like a safety net.