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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to feel sad that friend is happy to be separated from her newborn for first 3 nights

543 replies

Whoneedssleepanyway · 26/06/2012 14:34

My friend is due to have DC2 in a few weeks and after a very bad labour resulting in some problems for her DS, she has booked into a private hospital for an elective CS.

I w her the other day and she said the hospital insist she stays in 3 nights and it is brilliant as they will take the baby to the nursery all night for her so she can sleep and will feed the baby for her as she doesn't intend to BF.

I didn't pass comment as this is up to her but I can't help feeling a bit sad that her baby won't be with its mum for the first 3 nights of its life but will be with some stranger, both my DDs slept with me (on my chest) for first 3 nights.

AIBU?

OP posts:
1944girl · 27/06/2012 01:52

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TouTou · 27/06/2012 02:51

YABVU - but then, I'm assuming you didn't have an ELCS with your Dc?

CS leaves you in agony over your abdomen, on drugs that cause drowsiness and generally very poorly equipped to look after a newborn. On top of that, being on a dark ward, trying to lean over to pick up your newborn from their cot without rupturing your stitches and with no stomach muscles (you are told not to co-sleep as your medication makes it too dangerous as you could easily fall asleep on the baby or not be aware of where the baby is), on a ward with other babies crying, inadequate staffing, the catheter getting in the way...

I would have killed to have my DCs taken from me for a few hours at a time to get some sleep. You would still spend time with them all day and most of the night, but unbroken sleep would have meant I was more joyful about the whole thing, instead of feeling sick with exhaustion much of the time.

I hope you don't make your reservations known to your friend. I would have love to have had a straightforward birth and had my baby sleep on my chest, but as it was, it wasn't to be.

sashh · 27/06/2012 04:48

Good grief woman can be so nasty to each other. In the days of living with extended family mum would not be expected to care for a baby alone. \Baby may well have been breast fed by more than one woman.

Doting relations would take turns to change nappies, make sure mum has some sleep etc.

It is the mother's choice to use the nursery and get some sleep. If it is the hospital I worked in she will also be given champagne.

Cynner · 27/06/2012 05:24

Any one remember the Pearl Buck story where mum birthed baby in field, swaddled him up, and continued about her work? Now THERE's a mum to aspire to! The rest of us must just muddle along, making the best choices we can for ourselves and our babies. Often what is best for mum is best for baby. I can't see how an aching, sleep deprived mother can possibly be an asset to her newborn.
I'm guessing now is not the time to admit I would have hired a wet nurse..

pigletmania · 27/06/2012 06:16

Yabu. They used to do that back in the day so that mother can get so e rest. Don't think that it harmed any babies

Byecklove · 27/06/2012 06:47

Fuckity I'm sorry, that sounds like a truly scary experience. Obviously you did exactly what needed to be done - again, I was only talking about well babies and mums.

Mrs Apple - of course I don't have any evidence. I didn't state a fact, I gave my opinion. It might be utter bollocks but surely we're all allowed to draw our own conclusions. In utero you are already talking to/ interacting with baby. I think they know and I also think that shapes them, even just a tiny bit. MIL feels terribly guilty that she didn't want DS when she first found out. She confided that she thinks he felt that, although she's never told him. I don't know, nor did I ever say I did. OP asked a question and I offered my opinion (not based on fact. I've never seen a perfect circle either). Wasn't looking to get into a clanging match.

Byecklove · 27/06/2012 06:48

Fuckity I'm sorry, that sounds like a truly scary experience. Obviously you did exactly what needed to be done - again, I was only talking about well babies and mums.

Mrs Apple - of course I don't have any evidence. I didn't state a fact, I gave my opinion. It might be utter bollocks but surely we're all allowed to draw our own conclusions. In utero you are already talking to/ interacting with baby. I think they know and I also think that shapes them, even just a tiny bit. MIL feels terribly guilty that she didn't want DS when she first found out. She confided that she thinks he felt that, although she's never told him. I don't know, nor did I ever say I did. OP asked a question and I offered my opinion (not based on fact. I've never seen a perfect circle either). Wasn't looking to get into a slanging match.

Whoneedssleepanyway · 27/06/2012 06:56

Good to see this is still going... Wink

The thing I am finding hardest to grapple with is how you have all leapt on me as being the most awful friend and judging me saying I am jealous, I have issues with babies being bottle fed, I think I am a superior mother all massive assumptions from my relatively short OP....at the end of the day I refuse to believe that there is not one of you who hasn't once wondered in their own minds about something a friend is doing, a good friend will support a friend in whatever decisions they make...as I made quite clear in my OP, this is her choice and I wouldn't dream of questioning her on it and haven't, it is clearly a very emotive issue. My biggest crime to post this on the internet, something lots of people do everyday and I am pretty certain I have anonymised this enough that she wouldn't recognise it but in any event she isn't a MNer.

Anyway that is me done on the subject. Thanks

OP posts:
everlong · 27/06/2012 07:06

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everlong · 27/06/2012 07:06

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RichManPoorManBeggarmanThief · 27/06/2012 07:08

But you are judging her- you are saying you're sad for her baby to be separated from its mother overnight (i.e. this is a sub-optimal thing vs sleeping on mother) and your tone and language ("stranger" etc) suggest disapproval.

Yes, I imagine we've all had issues with something a friend has done. What's that got to do with anything? I'm not sure why you posted if you weren't looking for opinions (possibly you just wanted validation).

Shagmundfreud · 27/06/2012 07:12

"I can't see how an aching, sleep deprived mother can possibly be an asset to her newborn. "

"what's best for mother is usually best for baby"

Isn't that the mumsnet mantra? 'good for me/good for my baby'. Because in essence there's a lot of truth in it: it's hard to parent well when you have no personal resources to draw on.

But sadly it's not all 'sewn up'. Sometimes our needs DO conflict with the needs of our children and when that happens you can only arrive at a balanced decision by trying to see it from everyone's perspective and take everyone's needs and special circumstances into account.

And that's what I don't see much of on this thread: thinking about the experience of being newly born. There's a dismissive view of the idea that babies have any sort of special emotional attachment at birth to their mother, or that they need anything other than the sort of care you'd provide to a small (fully grown) mammal: drink, food, a warm place to sleep. Note, I say 'fully grown' because those of you who've cared for puppies or kittens know that if they're separated from their mothers at birth, you often try special things to recreate the sense of having their mother close: a hot waterbottle to simulate the warmth of her body; a clock to simulate the sound of her heart. Why do we think about these things with newly born puppies, but not with a newly born human?

"I can't see how an aching, sleep deprived mother can possibly be an asset to her newborn".

Stretch yourself.

Most mums are 'aching and sleep deprived'. That's part of the normal experience of birth. They still manage to care for their babies well, don't come home with raging pnd, and also manage to give their babies what they want: close and prolonged contact.

Seriously - women haven't always made brilliant choices for their babies. Sometimes out of ignorance, sometimes they're pushed towards it by the prevailing culture. Think back to the days when there were women (surprisingly large numbers actually) who ff their babies out of choice, in the days when formula feeding was profoundly unsafe. Or the aristocratic women who passed their newborn babies over to wet nurses living in the country, and didn't see them for months at a time. Or the 'Truby King' mothers who ignored their crying babies for hours at a time because they believed that cuddling a distressed child ruined its character.

There have always been suboptimal childcare practices. The lucky thing now is that we know more about babies, and about how they thrive best, emotionally and physically. The vast majority of comments on this thread have no interest in what we know about newborn responses or physiology - their focus is completely on adult needs and feelings. I'm not going to argue that adult feelings are irrelevant or unimportant but - some balance PLEASE! Surely in a modern and humane society we can find a way to provide optimal care for a mum AND a baby?

everlong · 27/06/2012 07:18

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Rosa · 27/06/2012 07:18

I also had both dds overseas, stayed in for 3 days. (dd2 4 as I had a d/c and needed follow up bloods) babies were taken at midnight and brought back round 5. If a baby wouldn't settle or was screaming it was either brought to you or depending on your circumstances you were asked to go to the nursery. ( stitches, drips etc). During the day babies were in the nursery for 2 hrs when docs did rounds and on day 1 visiting hours , when they were in the nursery for all to view ( they always seemed very well behaved and also when I have gone to see friends babies)..... You could choose to keep baby in with you for full 3 days but at night you were 100% alone, mine seem to be fine with what they went through- i couldn't bend after dd1 so all help was gratefully accepted so were the bouts of sleep.....

RichManPoorManBeggarmanThief · 27/06/2012 07:22

everlong Hell yeah! course I have. But what I'm saying is that if i came on here and said "I judged my friend for x. AIBU" and everyone said "Yes. YABU" I wouldnt then flounce and say "God, I can't believe people gave their opinions"

everlong · 27/06/2012 07:24

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RichManPoorManBeggarmanThief · 27/06/2012 07:29

Anyway that is me done on the subject. Thanks

I took that as a flounce Grin. I guess i'm just confused as to why the OP posted.

EugenesAxe · 27/06/2012 07:35

YABU. If I had chosen to FF immediately I would have been very happy to be able to rest.

Everyone is different - respect her decision.

Silvercatowner · 27/06/2012 07:47

I would have loved that arrangement, I'm afraid. I was verging on PND and felt incredibly claustrophobic after the births of both my boys. I would have really appreciated support and time on my own to sort my head out - I suspect it may have preempted and prevented some of the problems I had later on. Both boys are in their 20s now and we are extremely close (far closer with my 2 than friends who have offspring the same age, who did the earth mother things)

everlong · 27/06/2012 07:47

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EugenesAxe · 27/06/2012 07:48

horriblefilagain can I just say I DO think OP IBU and I'm not just saying to disagree. I expect that goes for everyone else posting YABU. Sod off.

Tangointhenight · 27/06/2012 08:02

To be fair to.OP her comments weren't the ones that riled me on this thread, it was others who got all judgey and I don't particularly feel OP is being U to 'feel sad' because she obviously had a lovely bonding experience those first few nights, as I'm sure did many women on this thread. I totally agree that there are many 'selfish' mothers out there, in fact I see them everyday, but I think after a traumatic ordeal where you may have had a serious operation, loss of blood, stitch from backside to your neck, or PND issues in the past, its not selfish to ask for some help. I'm sorry but it doesn't make you a bad person.

rhondajean · 27/06/2012 08:15

I think I found the ops original tone patronising whether she meant it or not. There was an implication the other woman's parenting was second class.

And then it all kicked off...

CPtart · 27/06/2012 08:19

Why can't babys dad take the baby home and get on with it if not being BF??? As much skin to skin as you like then!

baskingseals · 27/06/2012 08:41

it's getting the balance right betweeen the mother's needs and the baby's. both are vulnerable in those early days. it's a hard call. however a newborn baby, by definition has to be prioritisied over a fully grown woman - or not?