AIBU to not want my ILs to control our finances?

[SweetChilliSauce]

This is my first ever post so please bear with me if you can ? apologies for the length but I?m trying to avoid drip feeding.

DP?s parents own two houses. The house they live in (DP?s childhood home) and the house that belonged to DP?s grandmother, which they inherited when she sadly passed away a number of years ago. DP?s grandmother?s house has been in their family for around 100 years so it is owned outright ? no mortgage. The house had been empty since she died.

When DP and I found out we were expecting DS, his parents were incredibly generous and offered us the opportunity to move in to the empty house and live there for 5 years, rent free. This was, they said, to give us a chance to save for a mortgage, and not be under financial pressure to have both of us working full time whilst DS was little. We knew that this was an amazing opportunity and very kind of them, and we gratefully accepted. We have been here for nearly two years now.

The house was in need of a substantial amount of work, but we were more than happy to put in the time and the money to make a home for ourselves and give ourselves a chance to pay off debt / save when the work was done. In financial terms, the project cost us around the same as what we would have paid in rent for a year, and I worked hard renovating the house both whilst I was pregnant (we were trying to complete the work before the birth so I did this full time instead of working) and for some months after the birth. DP?s parents also contributed financially to the project, as did mine. We didn?t ask either sets of parents for this help, but they offered, and we were very thankful.

I am pretty good at handling finances, and have been looking after mine and DP?s budget and outgoings for quite a while (I do this because DP doesn?t want to, and I do enjoy a good spreadsheet(!) ? the arrangement works well enough for us). We have certainly had odd periods where we have overspent but we have learnt from them, and we?ve been on an even keel (paying off credit cards / overdrafts and saving money) for a good while now. We know how much we have to save in order to put down a deposit on a mortgage, and are working on target towards this. We are responsible and everything is budgeted for.

Recently, despite the original agreement under which we moved in, DP?s parents have told us that they now require us to pay them £100 a week, which they will ?look after? for us. They have said that they ?do not believe we will save for a mortgage if it is left to us?, and thus need to control the figure of £100 a week paid to them and have it resting in an account to which they and DP (not myself) have access, though DP is not to touch it without their say so.

I feel really uncomfortable with this arrangement. I could almost understand it if they were saying they had changed their mind and now wanted us to pay rent on the house (but would be a little as that wasn?t the agreement under which we moved in and carried out all the work), but the idea of someone other than DP and I controlling our savings does not sit well with me.

I think that our savings should be in our savings account. This is mostly because it is simply our money, but also because it leaves me in a financially vulnerable position if DP and I were to break up (which I hope to God never happens, and don?t foresee happening, but I guess nothing is ever certain) as none of the money would be in my name. DP and I have just always had ?our money? ? we?ve never been divisive.

I also think we should decide for ourselves how much we are saving, rather than having the figure dictated to us. At the end of the day, we're the ones that face the consequences if we frittered away our cash. We are currently putting away about £60-70 a week and we really are living on a shoe string to do so ? if we gave £100 a week to his parents we would have nothing left in the pot after bills to buy anything that wasn?t the weekly food shop, whether that was some babygrows for DS, a new workshirt for me, a haircut for DP, taking DS to the farm... everything. When I told my ILs they said we could ?ask? them for our money back to buy whatever the item was that we required.

I just don?t want to live like this. I know we are capable of just spending what we need and putting the rest into savings (not least because that's what we've been doing) ? I don?t want to go and have to ask my inlaws for our own money every time I need to buy myself some tights. I have tried to explained this to them but they don?t seem to see the problem. I certainly don?t want to have to ask their permission and for our own money if DP and I want to go out for dinner or something else that?s just for ?enjoyment? (FWIW we?ve been out for dinner once this year so far...).

This is really stressing me out and it?s starting to cause problems between DP and I. If I?d have know at the outset that in order to live in the house we?d have to let DP?s parents control our finances and savings then I?d have said thanks but no thanks ? it is just not a situation that I would be happy with under any circumstances. It feels really controlling and belittling.

AIBU to not want to do this? I think, really, that I would much rather we moved out and made a go of it on our own ? paying rent and saving for a mortgage at the same time like everyone else, even though it would obviously take longer. AIBU?

What a nightmare.
I wouldn't buy their house - they'll still always view it as them helping you out and try to control it.
Move out and rent and then buy elsewhere...far, far away from them!.

I would look at moving out as renting nearer your dp's place of work means you can save more money towards a deposit.

Could you not just insist on a proper legal, signed rental/tenancy agreement and pay rent to them as your landlord?

As you are not married the contract would have to be in both your names.

I would also do a spreadsheet with all the money invested in their house, plus labour costs for all the work you have done.

Renovation costs are very high. Just think if they had had to put in all the costs themselves, and employ professionals to do the work???

I imagine it would add up to far more than if you had been renting the property, so you haven't been living there for free.

If renting from the ILs doesn't appeal, then I agree that moving to rental accommodation close to jobs and transport links would be a far better option.

Yep a huge spreadsheet of how much you have spent on the house, how much your parents have sprent on the house that it structural/integral/has added value the your time and present it to your dp to show his parents at how much you have invested in the property.

Actually first of all I would ask you dp where he wants to be in 3 years time, if it's buying a home with you then show up some rented properties that moving in to would help you save money more quickly than where you are currently living.

I would have to call their bluff. It would be inconceivable to me as an adult to have my parents or in laws managing any part of my financial affairs (I don't discuss what we earn or what we have in savings as it is our business). I would not be willing to relinquish that control for anything, it would make me feel like a child. You need to reset the power balance so they can't use money as a way of trying to influence the course of your life, so that when you speak to them you speak as equals.

Actually given your latest post I'm revising my thoughts, I thought they were trying to be helpful, although a little cack handed as put it. However they've accused you of lying about the £ you've spent on renovating it? It's not a healthy situation to be in.

I can understand Sundae's point about wanting to protect their son but on the other hand you do need to stand back and let your children develop and learn financial responsibility which they won't do if they interfere. OP, it sounds as though he is learning, his parents should respect him enough to let him manage his finances.

I'd follow the excellent advice on looking at HB, local rents etc. I've been in a similar position once with the ILs, never again, I was so angry that decisions had been made without mine or my OH agreement which resulted in a £4k hit to us. I let it go for the sake of my OH but wouldn't do it again.

Not a chance. While you should be, and presumably are, grateful for what they have done o far they are now looking to control you. Tell them that it wonr be happening nd that you will be moving out at the end of 5 years, or sooner if they wish to evict you and give you reasonable notice.

If you don't have any form of written agreement at the moment, what happens if your ILs go under a bus tomorrow? Is your DP the sole beneficiary and would get the house, or would you have to move out to have it sold as part of their estate?

I'd call their bluff and say you were going to move. I'm more concerned about your DP tho, why isn't he backing you up?

It really wasn't sensible to move in and renovate with no written agreement. You are unlikely to get that money back.

At this stage, in your shoes, my priority would be sorting out DP, who needs to decide whether he's committed to you / DS and being an adult, or taking the easy way out and being an obedient son, to your detriment.

Assuming he supports you, I would then call their bluff, and be ready to go through with moving out and even move areas (so that you could get paid work). To stay, I would insist on a legal agreement. If you / DP don't want to get married I would also seek a co-habitation agreement.

Going by your latest post, SweetChilli, they seem like the type of people who would boot their own grandchild & parents out of a home to make a profit on your hard labour.

Not sure I would even want to marry into such a family. It is going to be very taxing for you, and I can sense it is already putting a strain on the relationship with your dp.

They have brought to this world a spineless spendthrift young man, with no sense of budget and he has had the luck of meeting a good woman with financial sense. I think you are an innocent in all this, and when they want to take over the finances they do so because they know their son. (Not flattering to him, and highly patronizing to you) And the end result is that they are railroading you, the person who could have brought sense to his life. But he is too weak to stand up to them, and take their side, quite frankly because his character might be a bit lacking.

What do you think you will do?

First of all, you need to document how much you have spent in hard cash.
It is non of their business, but you might need it to convince your dp. If you can show that you have spent more than your debts, and that you would in fact have been able to clear your debts if you had rented, so in fact you have spent more on the house than you would on private rental, this is important information.

I know I am rambling on. But, this is my story:

5 years ago we discovered that my mum was developing Alzheimers. She was my dads carer, he had a stroke 10 years ago, and has been paralyzed in a wheelchair since. They live in the far north of Norway, we lived in London, where we have a business. I moved heaven and earth and convinced my husband that uprooting the family, (we have two children) to help my parents was the right thing to do. So we did. It has possibly been the worst and most expensive venture of our lives, and caused us nothing but unpredictable problems.
I had not lived with them since I was 18, and did not realize what a controlling person my dad was.

Moving my family into the vicinity of controlling and manipulative people have had its consequences. My parents are wealthy, and like your dps parents, think using money and assets to get what they want, is par for the course.
We had been running our business and was doing reasonably well. Lived in a good London neighbourhood, had an au pair, could afford foreign holidays, etc.
Naturally, we were not as wealthy as my parents. We dilapidated our funds by moving, it cost a fortune. We had gotten rid of stuff in London to make the move, and we had to buy new stuff in Norway. Boy, you dont realize how expensive pots and pans are when you have to kit out a house again from scratch. So we were pretty broke. My dh had problems working from home as the kids were noisy. My dad suggested he build my husband a garden office, in exchange for us not going to travel to see my husbands family for summer holidays but staying and looking after them. With people like this there are always conditions attached.

My father had absolutely no appreciation for the fact that we had uprooted everything to be near them and help them in old age, spent a fortune on the move, had to spend £12k on tax specialists alone doing our first tax return due to dual taxation and international issues, and £3k a year thereafter only on this. No appreciation for us having a uk salary, and living in a country where living costs were 30% higher than in the uk and having a bad currency rate to deal with too. These were my problems. I should have thought about this before! I should have had foresight! I should know that any decent person have a buffer of at least £30k emergency money in their bank accounts (incidentally, this was just 10% of his buffer).

I did not expect them to offer any financial help to us. But neither did I expect that he would try use the fact that we were now hard up as a way to manipulate, guilt trip and control us.

Sometimes you come across people who seem generous, and sometimes you realize that the generosity has strings, and is dependent on the future yield this generosity will produce to them. In YOUR situation SweetChilli, the generosity was tied up with the fact that your inlaws would get you to finance and refurbish their house for them. There is very little in it for you. They have used you to get to a result. Somebody to live in, pay for heating and electricity, and project manage the refurbishments of their property.

We are back in London now. My father lives alone in his big house. I still try to help him, because I am a decent person. As soon as my mums dementia got so bad we had to section her for the safety of her and my dad, and she was moved into a secure unit in a nursing home, we made our arrangements to move back to London. It cost us another fortune, but it is better to be on our own and independent, than in a situation where we are guilt tripped and manipulated.

I just hope that your dp will have the backbone to see that his parents are acting out if self preservation and might have their own best interest at heart, and not the interest of you and him and your child.

So you give them £100 a week on the provision that if you need to buy anything they will give you some money back. Ok, so say you need £10 for tights, £10 for a haircut for DP and £5 for a babygro and they say no, then what? They will not give you the money willingly, you will have to grovel to get your own money back. Say no and keep saying no.

QS, just on the point about them knowing their son and him being sprendthrift. That is what he used to be like, parents can be very good at seeing their children how they used to be, and not necessarily how they are now and not respecting that there children grow up. My MIL still asks me if I need to coat before I go out.

"I have said that once I am earning, I will have to put away in my own savings account the same amount as is being given to his parents each week, for my own protection".

No OP, assuming your being at home was agreed between you, any money your DP earns is family money, and all savings should be saved in joint names, or equal amounts in each name. Anything else is unfair to you, especially since you're not married.

If your PIL are financially astute, and work in the field, then they clearly do not have your best interests at heart: if they had, they would've got lawyers to ensure everyone was fairly treated in the arrangement, eg any money put in by you / your parents would be re-paid, subject to sale at a higher price. The comment from your FIL that you wouldn't be together if not for them is also revealing.

They are looking out for themselves and DP, and making sure that you have as few legal rights and money as possible.

The question is, is your DP going to come through for you?

bigjoeent, I did not mean he still is as spendthrift (he might be), but that they see him as he was. Not a grown man with a job and responsibilities.

Quint, wow, what a lot you have all been through, so hard. Hope things ar easier now back in london.

Money with strings is not generosity.

I read somewhere once that parents always see their children as they were when they were 12 years old. That doesn't leave much room for personal development and reasonable perspective.

QS, sorry I just read it that way.

I would seriously be looking for a 2 bed flat close to your dps work. You will most likely (depending on what area you are in) be able to save more money than you are now, heating bills, travel costs, council tax etc.

Even if you broke even, by God it would be worth it to be independant of the ils! I could NEVER live like that.

What ever you do, this house, and the way your dps parents have treated you over this will from now on always be "the elephant in the room" in your relationship.

It would be a lot cheaper to have a small two bed in town, cheaper bills, cheaper council tax, cheaper transport, etc.

Letting the house go, and to be returned to his well off parents after you have been working so hard to increase its value and rent-ability for them, is going to be gutting though. Especially seeing as you are pushed out because they are now making financial demands on you.

Can you get past all this and move on with him?

Your DP is the one who was financially irresponsible as a student. His debts are still being paid off. You're the one who is good at managing money, to the extent that your DP asks you to manage it. So why are your ILs proposing that your DP and not you have access to the savings account?

This stinks. Your DP needs to grow up and deal with this. Or you need to break free from any obligation from the ILs and get your own place.

Don't even think about it, you'll never get the money back. If you're going to lose 100 pounds a week, rent and be independent of them. Don't allow these people control over you.

What wil happen if you fall back on the mumsnet classic of " no that doesn't work for me"

YOU and possibly your child are being stitched up like a kipper.

You are either his life partner and his child his chief concern or your partner sees you & his child as a short-term tag a long in a playground game controlled by Mummy & Daddy, to be discarded as soon as they grow bored.

They will only release these savings if the property you eventually meets with their approval What happens if you split up or want to emigrate to Australia together? Can you tolerate being permanently infantalised? What are the long term emotional effects on YOUR child of being raised by "kidults"?

Personally I'd plan to move out asap, somewhere closer to childcare facilities so I could work and regain my independence.

I'd draw a line under the money already invested in the property(making a quiet vow to repay my own parents at £10 a week if I had to). Accept you've been used & manipulated to get to this point and draw a firm line in the sand going forward.

The situation is too absurd to waste any breath discussing with either partner or IL's. I'd just get on with sorting out MY life as a mature adult with a child to provide for. No way would I engage in such an insulting farce.

Existing as a lone parent on benefits for 6 months or so in a worst case immediate scenario, while you get on your feet is a far less scary prospect than the dependent existence the IL's would condemn you to.

Actions speak louder than words. Your partner will either man up and follow you on the path to freedom and the exitement of building an independant loving life together or you'll find out where you stand & build genuine security for your child alone.