to think that doctors shouldn't go on strike over pension changes

[starwarrior]

Why shouldn't they just suck it up like the rest of us?

Mirry - People will be going into work as rostered, but will not do routine work, so from that perspective like a bank holiday. The staffing for emergency and urgent care will be better on the 21st than on a weekend day or a bank holiday (because staff will go into work as if it is a normal working day).

babybarrister - I wasnt saying that it was impossible that an NHS consultant could have been earning 110K on retiral, just that as that is more than the top of the salary scale, not all consultants retiring will be earning that much.

I work for the OOH service and many people cannot get an appointment with their GP but cannot face yet more days in pain. But they are perhaps spinning a line, I've no idea.

The practice I attend does not do evenings or weekends and closes one afternoon for training. But I won't move because the three female GPs are absolutely brilliant.

Dear all, I am an emergency doctor and we will not be joining the strike!! I am sad to read that the press has turned doctors into a lazy greedy bunch wanting nothing but money. The public is quite unaware that we have had problems for years with having progressive salary cuts and many unpaid long hours, not to mention huge cost for studying, exams, professional registration and many more. Now the government wants to take yet more money by cutting the pensions. Interestingly, the goverment representatives in favour of those pension cuts are not having their own pensions cut and work lives extended to age 68, otherwise they may think about going on strike too? It is easy for them to judge and give us bad press when they themselves remain totally unaffected. Anyway, to all you patients out there: We will continue to work hard to give you the best care possible regardless of what happens to the pensions!!! Best wishes, Goldie

babybarristerI I think you have your sums wrong, the estimate I got from the nhs pensions service was nowhere near that amount otherwise i would retire tomorrow, I wouldnt bother striking!

It is not 70+ over a whole career, and pensions are changing from final salary to career average.

regard to gps ,i find it is harder and harder to get an appointment unless you book in advance ,which is no help if you suddenly become ill.
i think that the whole gp structure should be changed and not mess with their pensions
i dont expect them to work longer hours just do split shifts like
surgery open 7-9 (7 hr days in a split shift)
so basically if they provide the service well- give them a great pension.
the fact that gp appointments are hard to get leads to the mass problems in AE which costs the nhs millions .

David is doing his job well, I must say. He's trying his best to turn the public against the NHS, just like Thatcher did with the miners. Doctors work for their three figure salary, harder than our ministers! Hurrah for our Nhs! Without which I wouldn't be here today. Doctors don't just heal, they do a lot behind the scenes. I can't believe some people's perceptions. Change from benefit bashing I suppose!

wfrances

It shouldnt be that way - most GPs now have shifted to making appointments availible at short notice eg people having to phone up on the morning that they want an appointment, rather than being able to book in advance.

One practice near me has started making appointments bookable online.

On call consultants in hospitals don't get paid any extra, it's part of their duties. Most docs don't see patients privately. It's mainly orthopaedics, which brings in a good deal of revenue for the Trusts they work in, it's not all theirs to keep. Most hospitals have a private wing, they wouldn't have if they didn't make any money from it. And again hospital docs work hard for their money. They don't get millions in bonuses every year. I know of a whole ward of nurses who have all moved to Australia for a better standard of living.

babybarrister.

Nurses have the same pensions eg lump sum + proportion of final salary. They do tend to have lower final salary, but also will tend to have spent more years working because of the shorter training. Payments into the scheme are tiered, so the percentage of your income that you pay rises with an increasing salary.

In teaching and lecturing, you usually get 6 weeks at 90% and then the rest of the SMP period at half pay, to be refunded if you don't return to your job. The private companies I used to work for were actually more generous.

Average public sector pension works out at £5000 pa or something paltry like that, doesn't make sense to froth at headline figures without bearing in mind this is a minority group.

Vev, given I know Doctors who feel the same and feel that some of their colleagues are out of touch and rather arrogant about their pensions, I don't "Dave" needs to do anything. I think there is also something of a problem with the attitude of some doctors on the subject too.

Yes, they should be allowed to strike or take whatever industrial action they want, however its all this business when you see people - including some on this thread - whining about their pensions and using the word 'only' before an astronomical figure that is more than anyone else could hope to get that grates with the public. It actually smacks of an inflated sense of entitlement and over inflated egos. Dave doesn't need to do a thing as some doctors are quite successfully managing to do that all by them selves.

If doctors want support and sympathy then they really need to consider the approach they take and the arguments they use. They are intelligent enough to understand the principles of pr, and frankly given the fact they deal with the public everyday, you'd expect most to have a more worldly view of the world than perhaps they do.

They did strike.

On the whole, you are correct, doctors will tend to get better pensions than nurses, because doctors tend to earn more, but if you look at the payscales you will see that nurses in senior positions dont do that much worse than doctors in senior positions. Nurses also get unsocial hours payments (if they work those hours) which are superannuable.
I'm not for a second begrudging what nurses get, but I think that it is overly simplistic to say that doctors pensions are overinflated and nurses are fine when in reality there is a degree of overlap.

Perks I got in the private sector included (not at same employer!): bonuses, share options, free champagne on desk when we had to move buildings, free breakfast, free lunch, tea lady trolley with free hot drinks and posh biscuits/cakes twice a day, £300 and two weeks' extra paid leave when you got married, Christmas parties, free or reduced price books and magazines, taxis home if you worked after 8pm, free dinner if you worked after 8pm, family BUPA membership, *free parking in central London (those were the days!), and more!

*=during last recession!

Perks in public sector:

Bike loans, season ticket loans, professional maternity pay to top up SMP ...

... er ...

That seems to be it.
Plus I have to pay for my own CRB check.

Really hiveofbees? Some nurses get pensions of more than £40000pa? How many?