to not date a Tory?

[bejeezus]

Well...actually I dont care if IABU or not, I just couldnt do it.

What I really want to ask you; if you have Labour/left wing politics could you/would you/are you marry/ have a life partner who has Conservative/right wing politics?

And vice-versa of course?

The conservatives have opposed the welfare system since before it was introduced

It is called social security for a reason

Hmmthinkingaboutit - I see what you mean but there are certain people who always vote the same way and I approached this thread with that mind set I suppose.

In the way that she smashed the mill and manufacuring and other industries to smithereens, and lft a huge workforce with nice work today

Not everyone is an entrepreneur or academic or has abilities in blue collar work. It doesn't make them lazy spongers

Have to go now, BBL

'Many left-wing posters in this thread for whom it is a given that left = good. If you believe that, then it is easy to justify hatred of the right. To the extent that being a hater makes someone a worse person, ironically this makes the left on average more evil, in my view.'

What about those on the right who have contempt for the concept of collective responsibility?

I don't hate people - I am not a 'hater' but I deeply resent the way that the tories are hell bent on dismantling the state, deficit or no deficit (good excuse for them). It makes me angry to see them openly shit on disabled people, particularly as my daughter will always rely on the state as there is no way she will ever work or live independently. They know that people will suffer as a result of their policies but they don't care.

Those are the reasons for the hateful remarks you've noticed. Some people are angry.

No I could never date a Tory.

'Most people inherit their beliefs.'

Actually, this is sometimes true. A friend of mine voted conservative only because her parents do. She is a public sector worker and 2 months later was holding her breath to see whether she would be one of the 5/7 people in her department who was going to lose their job.

YABU OP.
Three reasons:

1. There is very little to separate the Tories and Labour. Their policies are much more similar than they are different. Labour had its own austerity proposals which were within a nat's fart of the Tories'.

2. They are both wrong on most key issues. They are both very illiberal in their own verious ways.

3. They are both a million miles to the left of Obama's Democrat party. Would you say you can't date Obama because he's too much of a fascist?

I'd have trouble dating anyone who was extremely closed-minded in their political views.

I am right wing. Whilst I agree with many of the left's social ideas, I agree with the right's approach to the economy, and in the present climate I have to say that economic issues are of far greater importance. If we don't sort the country out, there very shortly won't be any money to implement any social policies, however deserving people are.

I dislike short-termist reactionary thinking from either side of the spectrum. Consequently I'm not very impressed with any of the main parties right now...

This thread is bonkers. How would you even ask about somebody's politics if you were to start dating them? Why would you? Would you not see what sort of person they are without attaching goodness knows what labels.

I think people are fundamental good, kind, generous, selfish, lazy and inconsiderate regardless of their politics.

People who blether on about the Tories seem to be entirely blinkered to the foibles of the Lib Dems, Labour and any other party. Labour were in power for goodness knows how many years... and what a mess. All politicians LIE, no matter what party they belong to.

It all just sounds horribly ignorant and pitch-forky... and quite stupid really. Keep your politics to yourself - same goes for religion - and there's nothing to argue about. Perhaps some people just love to argue/live to argue...

How can you keep your politic opinions to yourself?

Surely the things you believe in make you what you are

perceptionreality, its not who they are voting for thats the problem, but the way they vote. People don't vote in the same way or for the same party all for the same reason. You can vote for X party, and not be X. In fact just as many people are more motived to vote to prevent something rather than to support something else these days.

I think you need to look in detail at the reasons behind why people vote, as much as the beliefs you think that might represent. A few people have pointed out about the left seeing the right as evil etc and act accordingly, which is as ignorant as any other form of bigotry out there. There can be a huge range of views within a party. Eg The Tory party for example has a reputation for being anti-europe. And yet you had people like Michael Hesseltine in it. They have a mixture of business type and christian types who make up a large part of their ranks. I don't think for one second they share the same points of view on a lot of issues.

Just because you are part of a group does not mean to say you sign up to every belief that it has. If you are prepared to defend every belief it has without question and without having the courage to say, "um actually I was wrong" THEN you are an idiot.

Equally, the converse is true. If you think that everyone in that party or votes for that party believes and supports every single thing on that manifesto, then you are an idiot too.

As for collective responsibility. I have to say its a two way street. Not enough ordinary people have done this yet imho. I favour politics becoming much more long termist and less popularist tbh as all the political parties pandering to that, are behind a lot of problems we now face.

Sure they are, usualsuspect but how can you boil them down into politics when many people, (myself included), believe a range of things that would cut across all of the manifestos.

Does anybody seriously think that everybody in the tory, labour, lib dem or whatever party believe all the same things? Same goes for religion, you can ascribe to one particular one yet still find merit in others and perhaps disagree with your own.

I just get fed up reading stupid 'X-bashing' comments. 'X' of course is anything that the pitchfork brigade decide on that morning.

There is quite a lot of stuff coming out about how brain wiring drives political affiliiation, see this summary on Wikipedia and this wiring also tends to have associated traits

For eg as a rule "Liberals" are more open to new experiences, "Conservatives" are more conscientous about getting stuff done.

Alpha males trend Conservative, and "the results from many previous studies in other nations, support that high intelligence is associated with supporting centrist, meritocratic positions. High intelligence is also associated with having any political opinions at all."

Personally i find zealots/extremists of any stripe to be both the stupidest and evilest.

Forgot to mention that as its due to wiring and has survived this long, there are probably strong survival benefits in having people with both conservative and liberal leanings.

I just know I could never date someone who had views that were totally the opposite to mine .

I'm quite happy knowing that a Tory would never date me too

Oh absolutely, Whatmeworry, it's absolutely scientific - totally reliable as irrefutable proof. It's right up there with the Zodiac. Apparently, if you're a Capricorn, you're hardworking and conscientious about getting stuff done... imagine if you were a tory as well as a Capricorn, you'd be unstoppable.

Completely agree with you about zealots and extremists... they should be put into a soundproof room, the doors sealed and leave them to bore each other to death.

You can't keep politics to yourself within a marriage really. Particularly if you have children. You do have to be able to agree, or agree to disagree at least.

Why can't you keep it to yourself? I know plenty of couples who vote for different parties and they don't discuss politics because they know they will argue.

Whether you have children or not is irrelevant. You agree a way to bring them up - what religion they will be (if any), where they will go to school and in what medium, etc.

Politics doesn't define a person - or it shouldn't.

I'm married to a Tory-voting Capricorn. Luckily he pours his energy into work. Pity me when he retires.

I am neither Tory nor Capricorn! The politics can cause ructions but I try to stay apolitical around him.

Fortunately I know I am his intellectual superior.

perceptionreality Fri 11-May-12 17:11:28
You can't keep politics to yourself within a marriage really. Particularly if you have children. You do have to be able to agree, or agree to disagree at least.

Which is about respect or sharing something. And really fuck all to do with politics. It could be about what colour the bathroom is painted and why tbh.

Politics doesn't define a person but it does underpin your values.

Oh absolutely, Whatmeworry, it's absolutely scientific - totally reliable as irrefutable proof. It's right up there with the Zodiac

Well, the brain stuff has been gaethering so i think there is something in it. But I am shocked that you are casting doubts on the accuracy of the Zodiac :o

It would depend on what other values they had to redeem themselves as my own values and beliefs are a very important part of who I am. I could not date someone who had values that I despised or who did not respect mine. I never have dated a Tory, have tried to be more open minded and then they go and start speaking.

YANBU

Can you tell a Tory just from hearing them speak?

Politics are one of the things I care least about in a mate.