To think I'm too old for this passive-aggressive nonsense?

[PrincessTeacake]

I've talked about this a bit on here before, so bear with me please!

I'm a sort-of unofficial mother figure for a group of girls. I joined the group because we're all into EGL fashion (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolita_fashion) and I ended up taking over it to a certain degree because a) the group is mostly teenagers who have the attention span of a gnat and b) because I work in childcare and it comes naturally to me. I had been a member of another similar group where the girls were older but I found them a bit stand-offish and rude so I left for the group I'm in now.

The fashion itself has a reputation for attracting and encouraging bitchiness within the ranks, and a lot of that comes from a certain anonymous message board which can get downright cruel. I had a confrontation with the girls of the older group because two of the younger girls from my group had their pictures posted there and I suspected the other group, because none of the international girls would have really cared enough to post them, it was a clear vendetta. Although they denied it, one girl said some really nasty things about the girls posted and another insinuated that because I was having a glass of wine on a Saturday night in my own house that I was an alcoholic and shouldn't be allowed work with children.

There's been a lot of tension since, the younger girls got posted again and the older group got the blame regardless of whether they did it or not. They said a few nasty things about me personally (which, to be fair, I'm old enough to brush off) and it's out of pure jealousy that our group is bigger and more relaxed than theirs. I also really yanked their chain lately by doing a successful stand-up set in my frills (they take the fashion deadly serious). Now we're at a standstill and I do keep seeing posts on the anon message board that are clearly from them, they can't even be subtle about it.

I just feel like I'm too old for this crap. I keep an eye on things because the younger girls are still very sensitive to this kind of thing, but I never say a bad word about the older girls, partially because it does nobody any good and partially because there's one girl in the older group I like and respect a lot who has begged me to keep a lid on any drama if I can. I encourage the younger girls not to bitch about the others too and we stay active, but it feels like so much work and I'd rather just be enjoying myself. To top it all off, I've had ongoing harassment from a person with a serious mental illness and she's trying to horn in on this drama too, but that's a whole other story.

Also, the girl who is ranking up most of the drama is near enough my age, she has a mortgage and a full-time job, surely she's too old for this crap too?

Okay, a word on the name of the fashion. It has nothing to do with the Nabokov book, that's a common misconception because of how notorious the book itself is. Because it started in Japan and the common Western meaning of the word means little to nothing to them when the fashion spread to other parts of the world it took the name and all the unpleasant implications with it. Sometimes we do like to use a different term when explaining it to strangers, such as dolly fashion (but not the same fashion as dolly-kei, which is totally different and even more confusing) or EGL, or aristocrat, but lolita is the given name and what it's referred to when buying/selling the dresses. I posted the link above to stop people from googling the term and coming out with the wrong idea. EGL means Elegant Gothic Lolita, although I don't dress gothic in any way.

What you think of the clothing doesn't really bother me that much, I don't think of myself as a princess (I'm well beyond that stage) but it's something that's commonly said to me by little girls because of the style. I've had a few rude comments as well as compliments when I'm out with the group, we all have. Also, the majority of girls following the fashion are in their twenties, my group is particularly young because they're all new to the fashion. The other group are mostly 20+, the oldest member is the same age as me. If it was just an online thing it'd be easy to give up, but we have a meet once a month where we all get together and have tea and a natter together. It's a lot of fun and I don't want to give that up. It's mostly one girl causing the trouble, and she's almost as old as me.

you really do this ?

really ?

I would say you need to stop, for quite a few reasons

So you spend your spare time meeting up with teenagers and dressing like a little girl? All sound a bit odd to me.

so you hang out online with a bunch of young teenage girls, and are surprised that there is bitchiness?

Get a life. And a grip.

There's nothing wrong with having a dress-up hobby, so will the posters getting their non-frilly undies in a bundle give it a rest? The OP isn't any more wierd than re-enactors, belly dancers, steampunks or sci-fi fans and there's nothing creepy or suspect about EGL in itself.

However, OP, I think what's happening here is what tends to happen in a lot of smaller circles of non-mainstream culture groups: you get a more intense level of emotional involvement and bitching. Like someone said upthread, try and model a mature way of dealing with bullies, and it will blow over.

Well - like anyfucker said really - there is possibly much more I could say - but my pizza is burning..

The only pleasant comment I feel I can pass is this. Grow up and stop hanging around with kids.

Its not the hobby, its the behavior.

How old are you OP?

I'm sorry, I don't believe it has nothing to do with the Nabokov character. It's about grown women dressing like little girls and its called Lolita. It's plain and simple. The Japanese seem to have a thing for underage sexual fantasy. it seems to be quite acceptable there which I don't understand.

so why does the usage of the term with this application PREDATE the nabokov novel then?

I don't know that it does, exit. please expand.

Just in defence of the OP, I found this online:

In the context of fashion, the term 'Lolita' does not exclusively relate to sex. The usage of the word can be considered wasei-eigo or deriving from the female given name, 'Lolita' relating back to Japan's relations to Portugal. Early Japanese lolitas thought it meant something cute in Portuguese and therefore adopted the wasei-eigo term "lolita".

The fashion is thought to have been partly created to react against the growing exposure of the body and skin in modern society. Adherents fight this with modesty, presenting themselves as "cute" or "elegant" rather than "sexy".[5] One follower of the Gothic Lolita fashion explained:

We certainly do not do this for the attention of men. Frequently, female sexuality is portrayed in a way that is palatable and accessible to men, and anything outside of that is intimidating. Something so unabashedly female is ultimately kind of scary?in fact, I consider it to be pretty confrontational. Dressing this way takes a certain kind of ownership of one?s own sexuality that wearing expected or regular things just does not. It doesn?t take a lot of moxie to put on a pencil skirt and flats. It?s not, as some commentators have suggested, some sort of appeal to men?s expectation that women should be childlike, or an attempt to pander to pedophiles. Pedophiles like little girls. They don?t like grown women who happen to like dresses with cakes on them. I?ve never been hit on by a pedophile while in Lolita. We don?t get into it because it is some sort of misplaced pedo complex or anything, and the objective isn?t simply to emulate little girls, despite the name Lolita.[6]

----

Lolita is just a name. When I lived in Spain I met a number of Lolitas, from 8-80 as the saying goes. It used to be a pretty popular name over there, and one I would have loved to use for DD.

Ok dressing up may be unusual. But I'm surprised at the comments here. Would you say the same to a Punk, or a Goth, or an A&F WASP? We all wear a style surely? Isn't the OPs style just another variation? V Westwood does a lot of clothing in this style - She's celebrated over here.

Animee (sp?) is v popular in Japan, EGL just reminds me of that.

well maybe you should find out about things before you have such a definite position.
Does this woman look like a sexualised child to you http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&biw=1366&bih=667&tbm=isch&tbnid=pfJj7teoznHexM:&imgrefurl=en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lolita_fashion&docid=dGWDunxrGQiTvM&imgurl=upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2c/Black_lolita.jpg/220px-Black_lolita.jpg&w=220&h=333&ei=Bo-pT-S3HPD04QSxwoHOCQ&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=637&sig=111913779800204188908&page=1&tbnh=136&tbnw=93&start=0&ndsp=26&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:75&tx=11&ty=54

did it, exit? perhaps nabokov had heard of it, then?

op, perhaps you should locate some older people to wear your children's clothes with?

Nabokov probably just picked a name, just because its so ingrained as one meaning now in certain countries doesn't mean it is everywhere, or meant anything before that.
Its a name, not an uncommon one.

Linky no worky Exit

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Black_lolita.jpg

Does this one work Pictish?

Just a big coincidence that adult women dressed as little girls call themselves Lolita then. Couldn't access that link you posted, exit, sorry. I find it creepy and I'm afraid won't be convinced otherwise. I actually dress head to toe in authentic 1950s clothes including corsets and seamed nylons so I'm not adverse to dressing up. It's just the little girl thing I can't get over. Right I'm off. Enjoy.

This is strange to me

Are any of these spats your fights to have? At the end of the day teenage girls will argue and bitch until the sun goes down, getting involved will only fan the flames surely?
Maybe time to bow out and do something more age-appropriate. Like go to the pub.

Yes...thanks Exit.
Mmm....to each their own....but I still think that the OP is hanging about with people too young for her.

Are you one of them?

Sorry one last thing. Where is the proof that it predates them nabokov novel?

Pictish, was that to me or Exit?

look it up for yourself if you want it, I'm not your researcher.