to think the state should pay part of our private school fees?

[wolvesarejustoldendaydogs]

Don't jump down my throat! It's just a thought.

State schools are overcrowded and there aren't enough good ones. Private schools are expensive.

What if every child had a right to have their state school 'payment' (whatever it costs per child per year') paid to a private school? Obviously parents would have to top-up (probably a considerable amount).

That would create a bit of a market, with more choice, making private schools more affordable and state ones less overcrowded.

Or is it a stupid idea for a reason I will think of soon after pressing 'POST'?

Why on earth should I pay (through my taxes) for your child to attend a private school?

You could also argue that why should all childless taxpayers pay (through their taxes) for your children to attend state school ?

amicissimma

I 've read your post six times and still can't get it to make sense.

1. Education IS a leg-up, though socio-economic status is the most significant factor in educational achievement

1. So what if the independent teachers set up in the Isle of Man? Would this be a bad thing? Would we care?

1. No-one thinks that schools would improve by an influx of ex-private school teachers - except Tory fuckwits. They're always saying state teachers have so much to learn from the independent sector...and WHEN have they flooded in to share their expertise?.....holding breath....turning blue..

1. I've taught in a lot of state schools and the highest attainment has been where there is the widest mix of class backgrounds.

Yabu

A few tax facts. Yes, many private schools have charitable status, but even if they didn't there would be very little for them to pay tax on. Most are run on a tight budget and there is little surplus after paying the salaries, property costs etc. (I know this from looking at the accounts of my DDs' excellent private school when they were complaining about the heating not being put on!)

There is no VAT on education, whoever provides it - schools, universities, private tutors etc. It is exempt.

Tax breaks for teachers' pensions? They have the same tax breaks as everyone else's pensions, and the schools get no tax relief for paying the contributions because they don't pay tax in the first place...!

yabu

I am NOT paying tax to subsidise state schools
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO way

Why on earth should I pay (through my taxes) for your child to attend a private school?

Well why on earth do I pay through my taxes for your child to attend a state school? What a ridiculous argument. Someone upthread said that it costs £5,000 a year for a state-educated child. So if I am paying that out of my taxes towards your child, why would you not pay that out of your taxes towards my child?

And then if I make a personal decision to top up that payment and go private that's none of your business surely? Just like if I get child benefit that I can use towards my childs food, and I make a decision to top up that payment so we eat steak not mince?

YABVU

If you can't afford to send your kids to private school then don't do it.

To expect the state to help you pay your fees, that is hilarious!

OhDearNigel think of the childless paying for children to go to state schools as being a bit like car drivers paying taxes that allow the impoverished non-drivers to go on buses and trains.

All those people choosing not to drive.

Wankers.

It does amuse me too when I hear how much state schools can learn from private. If you only take kids whose parents can afford at least £12,000 per year, test them to weed out the less bright and then stick them in classes of less than 20, then you'll do well. It's hardly like for like.

Nigel - the assumption is that that the childfree were presumably children themselves once and had their own state education While if you were privately educated that was your parents choice so they paid for it.

Can't speak for the rest of the UK but in Scotland, the Tories had the "supported places scheme". Drained £hundreds of thousands, if not £millions away from the public sector.

Labour ended the scheme, but phased it out dependent on where pupils were in their schooling eg P4 pupils were funded to the end of P7 but not into secondary.

You want a private service, you pay the private price Imo.

Echt - with the lack of state funding that goes into public transport it is more like all us priviliged non-driving bus users subsidising the car drivers tbh.

Heidihole, It's about being part of civilised society. We provide for the mass, and if you want steak instead of mince, then YOU pay for it.

When you're drooling, witless and shitting yourself in a nursing home, it'll probably be someone from a state school who is wiping your arse.

porcamiseria -

I agree with the poster who mentioned the German state education model. Also I believe Finland is held up an example as the best education system in the world. It's also a state education.

However there will always be people who would rather send their child to a below par private school rather than a comparably superior state school.

I thought I was being sarcastic bigmouth:)

YANBU - if you send your child to private school you are saving the state the cost of their education. If you're using private education you're probably paying a lot of tax as well (or someone else is on your DC's behalf, like wealthy grandparents), so you are paying for something you don't use.

It might be cost effective for the government to offer a voucher for half of the state school funding to parents to take their DCs private, that would make a lot of people who are boarderline able to afford it take the option, and cut the education costs for those (like me) who could go either way but will probably use state as it's a bit of a squeese for private. (Mind you, private schools might just up their fees to take this into account)

"When you're drooling, witless and shitting yourself in a nursing home, it'll probably be someone from a state school who is wiping your arse."

And when the nursing home sacks them it will probably be someone from independent school who is representing them in court, no?

sorry I have a 'thing' about public funding of public transport (or lack thereof).

Can I have the money that would be spent on repairs if I lived in a council house to spend on my leaking roof?

Not with the changes to legal aid surely Graham? I doubt the average careworker will have the access to that level of legal support in future. Whereas there will always be bums to be wiped.

You have a very fair point, bigmouthstrikesagain.

No they shouldnt, if there are school places available in your area you should take them.

'bad' schools will never get any better if a range of student dont go to them.
If you perception of 'bad' is due to ofsted, well they are a load of crap anyway.

People are very quick to ang on about the bad aspects of a school but very few will take the time to give good reviews.

So YABU to expect payment for private school if there are normal school places available.

Im starting to think Im in a minority who send their child to their catchment/local school , only catastrophic goings on would deter me.

funkybuddah, I too send my DCs to our catchment schools; to be honest it never occurred to me not to. We're lucky that they both are good schools and more importantly they suit the needs of my DCs very well. We are in a village and the school is almost opposite our house. Some neighbours of ours send their child to a school in a neighbouring village that has a higher 'snobbery' factor than ours. It's so they can say 'Oh my child goes to X school'. I can't comprehend that.

I think paying fees out of gross income would be wonderful.

And the free 15 hours does not give you free hours at private school nurseries in herts anymore. Ds2 starts at the nursery of the school his brother goes to tomorrow and we get nothing towards it.