Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Where is the fucking justice for Trayvon Martin? a 17 year old INNOCENT CHILD shot to death simply because he was walking in his father's gated community.

939 replies

chewchewmeaw · 17/03/2012 19:10

Why in gods hell has that MURDERER not been arrested?

Are they looking for riots? they will happen if Zimmerman is not brought to justice. I am so sickened by this.

I wouldn't be surprised if you haven't heard this story yet - very slow in reporting it.

He was begging for his life': Family's anger as police finally play 911 calls made by neighborhood watch captain who shot black teen

Trayvon Martin,17, was shot dead by George Zimmerman, 28, last month, who claims the killing was self defense and has not been charged
Police finally gave into mounting pressure on Friday and released eight 911 calls
The teen's family say the calls show Zimmerman was the 'aggressor' not Trayvon

The police have finally released the 911 calls made in relation to the killing of an unarmed black teenager who was shot by a white neighborhood watch captain.

George Zimmerman, 28, had called 911 to report a suspicious man and can be heard pursuing Trayvon Martin, 17, on foot against the dispatcher's advice causing the teen to run away.
Moments later the police are bombarded with calls from terrified neighbors as a voice in the background can be heard desperately screaming for help before the sound of two gun shots.
When police arrived at Florida's Retreat at Twin Lakes Townhomes they found Trayvon, who had been returning from a store with candy for his younger brother, had been shot dead by Zimmerman.
Scroll down for video

Trayvon Martin, 17, left, was killed by George Zimmerman, 28, right, after the neighborhood watch captain pursued him as walked in a gated community

Zimmerman had called 911 after spotting the teen walking through the gated community.
'This guy looks like he is up to no good. He is on drugs or something,' Zimmerman told the dispatcher from his SUV.
He added that the black teen had his hand in his waistband and was walking around looking at homes.

More...
Teenager's death gives life to others: Organs donated by girl, 16, who died in crash provide new hope for the desperately ill
'These a---. They always get away,' Zimmerman said on a 911 call.
During Zimmerman's initial call, he told the dispatcher he was following Martin and the dispatcher told him, 'You don't need to do that.'
But Zimmerman sounds as if he continues to pursue the teen saying: 'He ran.'
Scroll down for video

In Zimmerman's 911 call he said Martin, pictured, looked like he 'up to no good' and on drugs as the teen returned home with skittles for his brother
He then refuses to meet police officers at an agreed location and asks for them to call him on arrival instead so he can tell them where he is.
Sanford police officials, who have not charged Zimmerman after accepting his claim that his actions were in self defense, finally released eight 911 calls on Friday after mounting pressure.
Martin's family had demanded the release of the calls to help better understand how Martin died while walking home from a convenience store last month.
'He was yelling for help, and no one could help him. He saw his life being taken away from him,' the teen's father Tracy Martin said.
He said they will continue pushing for charges to be filed against Zimmerman.
'We?re hoping this doesn?t happen again to another family, and that America opens their eyes ... even though this won?t bring Trayvon back,
we don?t want there to be another Trayvon,' Mr Martin said.
Scroll down for video

The teenager's parents; mother Sabrina Fulton, right, and father Tracy Martin, left, are said to be devastated after hearing the 911 calls of their son's last moments

Benjamin Crump, the attorney for Martin's family, said that the 911 calls show that the teenager spent the last few moments of his life terrified and Zimmerman should be charged
After listening to recordings of 911 calls, Martin's family said they're more convinced than ever that the Zimmerman should be charged with a crime.
'You hear a shot, a clear shot, then you hear a 17-year-old boy begging for his life,' said Natalie Jackson, the family attorney. 'Then you hear a second shot.'
The case has been turned over to the State Attorney's Office which can decide whether to file charges or present evidence to a grand jury.
Attorney Benjamin Crump, who is also representing the family, told reporters outside Sanford City Hall that Martin's parents both broke down and cried as they listened to the recordings.
'They are completely devastated, and they are in unbelievable grief,' Crump said. 'The last seconds of his life were in absolute fear.'
Scroll down for video

Martin was visiting his father and stepmother in Sanford where they live at The Retreat at Twin Lakes, pictured, when he popped out to buy snacks for his younger brother
He added that a third witness has come forward saying it was the boy who was crying for help.
Martin's parents, Tracy Martin and Sybrina Fulton, previously sued to have the recordings released. A hearing for the case had been scheduled for Monday.
Moments after Zimmerman's initial call, dispatchers were bombarded by seven 911 calls from frantic neighbors describing a fight between two men, screaming and then a gunshot.
'There is somebody screaming outside,' one female caller said, as an unknown male voice can be heard crying in the background. Then a shot is heard.
A male caller described a physical altercation between Martin and the shooter.
'I just heard a shot right behind my house,' The caller said. 'They're wrestling right behind my porch. The guy is yelling 'Help.' I'm not going outside.'

By the time police officers arrived, unarmed Trayvon, who had been carrying Skittles and soda, was dead on the ground from a single gunshot
Another woman said a man in a 'white top' was on top Trayvon.
Earlier on Friday, Martin's parents called on the FBI to take over the investigation, saying they no longer trusted the Sanford police department.
Sanford police Sgt. David Morgenstern said the department stands by its investigation but welcomes help from any outside agency. FBI agent David Couvertier said the agency has been in contact with Sanford police and is monitoring the case.
'We are committed to having somebody review this to see if we made a mistake,' said Sanford Mayor Jeff Triplett. 'If we made missteps and there is something there, we will act accordingly'

Trayvon's family believe Zimmerman should be charged and brought to justice for shooting their young son
Several Sanford residents who spoke to The Associated Press said they think there would have been an arrest already if the shooter had been black and the deceased had been white.
They said blacks and whites in this city of 53,000 residents were pretty much in agreement that an injustice had been done with no one arrested, and that there was no racial divide in how the case is being perceived. The city is 57 percent white and 30 percent black.
Zimmerman's father delivered a letter to the Orlando Sentinel on Thursday, saying the way his son is being depicted in the media is cruel and misleading.
He also says his son has received death threats and moved out of his home. George Zimmerman is Hispanic and grew up in a multiracial family, the statement says.

OP posts:
Kiriwawa · 14/07/2013 18:22

I don't think that's what I said, Tabitha/ashoething.

What do you mean by 'the whole trial was a farce' Tabitha? Do you mean that there shouldn't have been one?

WestieMamma · 14/07/2013 18:22

I understand why the jury reached the verdict they did, with the evidence they had. What I disagree with is a system which allows a civilian with a violent criminal record to carry a firearm, pursue someone innocently going about their business, get into an altercation with them which results in their death and then walk away without any culpability. Rights come with responsibilities and if someone exercises their right to carry a gun they should also carry the responsibility of being fully responsible for the consequences of them doing so.

TabithaStephens · 14/07/2013 18:24

There shouldn't have been a trial. The police handled it correctly in the first place, as has been born out by the result of the trial. It was a justifiable homicide.

limitedperiodonly · 14/07/2013 18:24

We're now talking about dispatchers' orders, are we?

It wasn't an order. It was informed advice to prevent trouble that Zimmerman chose to ignore. He may have come off worse. Except he was armed with a gun and a metaphorical white hat.

Ashoething · 14/07/2013 18:28

Whether or not someone should be able to carry a gun is a whole other debate though.

Kiriwawa · 14/07/2013 18:31

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

GoshAnneGorilla · 14/07/2013 18:33

What! Of course there should've been a trial. The police should not just take someone's word over shooting an unarmed person dead.

Ffs sake, the police didn't even bother to investigate initially, that's part of what caused the outcry.

Would you happy for there to be no trial in the Oscar Pistorius case either, or is that different because a pretty white lady is dead, rather then a "threatening looking" black teen?

staffie99 · 14/07/2013 18:35

Kiriwawa, I like how rather than answer a reasonable question about where the jury went wrong, you went straight in with a personal attack. Almost as subtle as flinging your own actual shit and screaming obscenities.

Kiriwawa · 14/07/2013 18:39

I don't think it is actually Ashoething. I think it's a good thing to question other countries' laws. That's the way that countries with poor human rights records generally improve the way they deal with their people - through external pressure from the international community.

Unfortunately, the US has largely considered itself outwith these international sanctions. But I hope that the drip drip effect will gradually have an effect as their human rights record is becoming increasingly difficult to defend.

Kiriwawa · 14/07/2013 18:41

staffie - of course there should have been a trial so I didn't feel that Tabitha's post deserved a reasonable response.

A man shot an unarmed teenager who wasn't actually doing anything wrong as far as we know. His big error was coming into contact with George Zimmerman

Ashoething · 14/07/2013 18:42

It is another debate-the question raised in this thread was whether it was unreasonable that George Zimmerman was found guilty. Not Aibu to think the gun laws in America need to be changed.

Ashoething · 14/07/2013 18:43

AS far as you know?-the evidence presented to the trial was that trayvon attacked George Zimmerman. This is the evidence that the jury accepted to be true.

Ashoething · 14/07/2013 18:44

Apologies-I meant not guilty in my previous post.

Kiriwawa · 14/07/2013 18:47

Let's not revisit that again - we all have different perspectives.

The OP asked 'where is the justice for Trayvon Martin?' so I think it's totally valid to consider US gun laws and the general failings of the US justice system

staffie99 · 14/07/2013 18:51

Neither is there any evidence that the deceased wasn't doing anything wrong or suspicious. All we know is he was later pounding the crap out of some guy who may or may not have had reasonable cause to follow him previously. I'd rather we didn't convict people by filling in the blanks about what happened, doesn't seem like a sensible way to run a legal system.

Ultimately seems to be an issue about widespread gun ownership escalating incidents that otherwise would be less severe, but that's a different debate.

TabithaStephens · 14/07/2013 18:57

You don't need to have "a reasonable case" to follow someone!

LittleSporksBigSpork · 14/07/2013 19:01

I think the problem for the public is that we were given a lot more information by the media - some false, some true but was dismissed by the judge or not used or prepared well by the prosecution (their treatment of their witness Rachael was horrible). Zimmerman's support's online played a media campaign with a lot of false information as well which has caused a backlash in many corners as a lot of their information was highly racist and has tinted the entire thing for many - particularly for those who live in that area where it became overwhelmingly wall-to-wall media at times.

It's also easy to forget that in many areas, police corruption (and police 'targets' that lead to stop and searches - see NYC) has gotten so bad that people are making 'how to deal with police' for civilians and having "the talk" includes teaching kids how to handle authority so they don't get killed and reminding them that, in the States at least, police are allowed to lie to them so they have to know their rights and be calm while doing so. Even LeVar Burton, the most loved and wealthy Black actors in America has a procedure to prevent police shooting him, that shows what little faith in the system many people have. Most of us never expected Zimmerman to be found guilty - as it is said: the system is built to get the results it wants.

Kiriwawa · 14/07/2013 19:16

Both the defence and the prosecution both agreed that Zimmerman described him as 'a fucking punk' before they'd made any bodily contact.

As far as I can see, this was a bloke with previous convictions for violence with a gun. Faced with a teenager who also had convictions (but not for violence). Bloke challenges kid, there's an altercation, bloke shoots kid.

It seems to me that it's entirely impossible not to view it from a UK 'reasonable force' lens (although I've spent a long time living in the US). It's a challenge that isn't made in the US but that's how I'm processing it (and probably many others are - this is a largely UK based forum after all)

TabithaStephens · 14/07/2013 19:17

The amount of false imformation given by the media skewed towards making Zimmerman appear guilty - "Trayvon shot dead while walking home with skittles and iced tea", editing part of his conversation with dispatcher out, misrepresenting him saying "punk" as saying "coon", repeatedly showing a years old picture of trayvon as a young boy when more recent photos were available, far outweighs anything put out in defence of Zimmerman, most of which was put out by people on twitter and facebook, not so-called "trusted" news sources.

Kiriwawa · 14/07/2013 19:18

OFFS - double negative shame

It's impossible to avoid the fact that ...

littlemisswise · 14/07/2013 19:26

Trayvon did not have a criminal record Kiri.

OldMacEIEIO · 14/07/2013 19:30

yes he did littlemisswise

Hurley?s detectives, all of them veterans with excellent records, told a different story under oath when questioned by Internal Affairs. They knew the shell game was about to be exposed upon first learning that Martin was one of their students and outside agencies would be requesting his records.

?Oh, God, oh, my God, oh, God,? one major reportedly said when first looking at Martin?s data. He realized that Martin had been suspended twice already that school year for offenses that should have gotten him arrested ? once for getting caught with a burglary tool and a dozen items of female jewelry, the second time for getting caught with marijuana and a marijuana pipe.

In each case, the case file on Martin was fudged to make the crime less serious than it was. As one detective told IA, the arrest statistics coming out of Martin?s school, Michael Krop Senior, had been ?quite high,? and the detectives ?needed to find some way to lower the stats.? This directive allegedly came from Hurley.

?Chief Hurley, for the past year, has been telling his command staff to lower the arrest rates,? confirmed another high-ranking detective

LittleSporksBigSpork · 14/07/2013 19:31

Tabitha - The most common picture wasn't years old, just six months, and the most recent picture shows he still looked like a young boy. Many pictures flying around weren't even him. Snopes dissects pictures

OldMacEIEIO · 14/07/2013 19:33

the judge ruled it inadmissible - clarification

littlemisswise · 14/07/2013 19:39

Really OldMac? Earlier in the thread it was said he didn't, and Wiki says he had no juvenile record.