to think "no actually, the stress of stopping smoking won't be worse for your unborn baby than you smoking"

[UphillBothWays]

I'm fed up with hearing this as an excuse for continuing to smoke in pregnancy! I've heard people say this in real life, on TV, and now Stacey Solomon is claiming her doctor OK'd her smoking too.

Yes, quitting smoking is hard, but don't claim it's better for your baby to be exposed to carbon monoxide, cyanide and nicotine fgs.

I would have a lot more sympathy if they said "I know it's awful and I'm trying my hardest to stop but I'm struggling and have slipped up"

So no comments on this then?

Smoking also damages sperm. It doesn't just reduce sperm count, it actually affects the nucleus of the sperm and leads to a heightened risk of miscarriage and birth defects.

How come we don't see many men treated to the same opprobrium given to pregnant women?

Just googled Stacy Soloman articles. Not one single mention of whether the father smokes or not.

I'm not trying to say that smoking when pregnant is great but it irritates me a lot that women are treated with such a double standard.

Yep, cartblanche I agree with you.

There was some silly bint on TV a while back on that 'mums from hell' programme (can't remember exact title) who seemed to be proud of the fact that she CBA to give up smoking. So not all mums who smoke feel awful about it. Some of the Jeremy Klye types couldn't care less.

Normally I am very much in favour of tolerance, but this subject really makes my blood boil. That defenceless baby has no choice but to take in its mother's smoke. I think we have every right to speak up in its defence.

To be honest, I would naturally be concerned if I saw a morbidly obese woman that was pregnant but I wouldn't know if that woman had a clinical condition, or had already sizeably reduced her weight or was taking great care of her diet during this pregnancy. With a pregnant woman smoking, I see a pregnant woman in the process of doing something that is medically known to cause harm

It wouldn't make a blind bit of difference if she had a clinical condition, had already siezeably reduced her weight or was taking great care of her diet.

The FACTS still remain that there are higher risks of her baby having....

Macrosoma
Neural Tube Defects
shoulder dystonia
Stillbirth

And for the Mother....
pre-eclampsia
gestational diabetes
Emergency C-Section
Death

And that's to name but a few

In other words, carrying a baby when you are overweight is also medically known to cause harm.

It's true not all mums to be care about quitting.

One of my friends smoked when pregnant twice and she is the most paranoid, pfb parent type worrier I know who always worries about her children being safe etc and is honestly a really great mum to them. I know if even she couldn't quit how hard she must have found it and how guilty she would have felt (I'm not excusing it - I'm just saying that not all mums just "don't care").

However, I also used to work with a woman who smoked throughout her pregnancy and regularly used to make horrid, ignorant comments before she 'went out for a fag' in a jokey way whilst laughing like "I'm just going out kill the baby!" and "well it doesn't matter if the baby comes out small because I'm small anyway!". I would be so and I couldn't bare to listen to it any longer and eventually said to her how offensive I found her comments (this was way before I even thought of having children myself).

She basically went bonkers at me crying in the middle of the office saying how out of order I was for picking on a pregnant woman and "stressing her out" and she felt bad enough as it was etc and used humour to make herself feel better about it (and of course come out with the old faithful line of the doctor telling her it would be more stressful to stop). I just couldnt stand listening to it anymore. Fair enough if you really, really struggle to quit but why say things like that!

Rhino I was answering cartblanche with my last post

And I'm merely 'evening up' the pregnant mum bashing

Yes it's ridiculous to say it's better to continue smoking during pregnancy than to give up.

Smoking in pregnancy should not be tolerated because it's selfish and the smoker should give up.

Just as actively trying to conceive when you're overweight is selfish and the Mum to be should get down to a medically acceptable weight.

Both for very serious reasons.

Agree that smoking in preg is awful, selfish and disgusting. I feel very sorry for babies who have mothers who care so little for them that they smoke when preg. I am an ex-smoker so I know how hard it is to give up but I did when I actively sought ttc

Worra I am a name changers but blimey you are obsessed with fat people. Nearly every post I have ever noticed of yours has some anti-fat sentiment to it.

What gives?

Nothing 'gives' as you put it starwisher

I just don't like double standards

Mention a pregnant woman is selfish for possibly putting her unborn baby at risk and the majority will agree.

Mention a pregnant overweight woman is selfish for possibly doing the same thing and you'll quite often get a different response.

The results are still possibly the same for the baby and Mum to be though...no?

Oh and if that's the case, then I would hazzard a guess you only notice posts on that subject from me.

There are 1000's more that have nothing to do with the subject

I used to notice your posts as they made me laugh

Then they got all fatty fatty fatty

But I think your right though tbh.

Can we just not concern ourselves with our own lives & stop getting our fucking knickers in a twist over things we have no rational control over?

Really?

Don't sweat the small stuff - & it is small stuff really - none of your arsing business - or are you all going round with your check-lists?

FWIW I hate leggings & fat arses. Makes me feel very fucking sick. And I pity the child that has that as a style role-model.

Now THAT will damage the poor little bastards.

But that mother may be doing everything else by the book Rhino - or she may not.

Who's the fuck to know?

& who the fuck, other than that mother, should care?

Or is she just a cipher for the opinions of others once that egg has been fertilised?

Sorry Rhino but you're wrong

There is no guarantee that smoking will damage a baby...it just increases the risk massively, in the same way being overweight does.

Indeed but when has a thread ever stayed on topic?

I think it's fair to point out that those pointing the finger at pregnant mothers and accusing them of risking their babies lives, are doing exactly the same thing if indeed they are.

I think the difference is smoking is the more obvious risk in the sense it's the first one people think about.

But threads like this produce all sorts of other lines of thought and that can't be a bad thing when it comes to the health of an unborn baby.

Ahh so when someone posts a FACT that pregnant smokers can put their unborn baby at risk and themselves, that's ok.

But when someone posts a FACT that pregnant overweight women can put their unborn baby at risk and themselves that's somehow not ok?

A pregnant smoker is somehow worthy of more judgement?

Ok then I'll leave the thread so it can continue with the 'old smokeist bullshit' again!

(Not that it is smokeist or fattist to point out a baby and its mother is at risk of serious complications or death)

What a load of bollocks, not all smokers will have low birth weight children who develope exzma and asthma in later life

The same as not all mothers who do everything by the book have healthy children.

Thank you op for posting this.

YANBU

Smoking in pregnancy is harmful and quite frankly selfish and feckless.

Not many people know that smoking in pregnancy not only effects your children but your grandchildren too.

Ah... the old 'smokers are irresponsible, fat people are not' routine' rumbles on. That doesn't work; either the welfare of the child is of concern or it isn't.

Babies can be miscarried or born with defects for any number of reasons. A person who has smoked or drunk alcohol or eaten something on the avoid list or even a person who has done none of those things, will batter themselves around the head and heap scorn on themselves. They don't need derision and nor do they deserve it.

I personally wouldn't judge a pregnant woman for smoking nor for being overweight because firstly, it's none of my business and doesn't affect my life one job and secondly - because I don't know the circumstances and I'm secure in my own decisions and therefore don't need to run anybody else down for theirs.

As far as smoking goes, if you want somebody to blame, blame the government - for banging on and on about the perils of smoking yet not taking the step to make it illegal. Blame them. Not as much fun as ripping another woman to pieces but hey ho.

This thread is a real eye-opener and I wonder at the quality of parent who has seemingly nothing to offer than judging and tutting. I guess I feel sorry for those children too.

I've always liked Worra's posts; she isn't anti-fat that I can see but the double-standards are irritating beyond measure. How about those of you with your self-satisfied smugness taking a look at your own lives to see where others might be judging you... or is that a step too far somehow? Much nicer for you to blithely ignore your own fallibilities whilst ripping other people you don't know, to shreds? Pathetic behaviour.

Christ, why this a weird obsession with assuming that ANY of us who agree with the op that smoking while pg is bloody awful, and trying to kid yourself it is 'ok' is a step worse, must be nasty judgemental old cows with children who are 'damaged' by our viewpoint?

And why the obsession with shrieking 'yeah but some women are obese, and some women push their prams along carbon momoxide riddled dual carriageways??

It's all quite bizarre !

Smoking is a pretty disgusting thing to do to yourself. It's even worse to inflict it on a child. Yeah, it would be great If there was a govt ban, but seeing as there isn't, then what's the point of banging on about that on this thread? And how do you know many of us don't make our views known to the govt anyway?

Stacey solomon is a pathetic individual for smoking while pg and trying to kid herself and others that she's been 'okayed' to do so. And frankly, anyone aged 45 downwards which is the only age group likely to get pg, must have taken up smoking in the full knowledge that it is really harmful... The message has been out there for years

Can I just say to all those saying you don't get physical withdrawal symptoms from quitting smoking...err, bollocks!

My dh gave up two years ago and it was like something out of Trainspotting! He was in bed for 24 hours sweating and shaking, hot and cold. The next day he vomitted and for about 5 days he had a banging headache.

I'm not a smoker so it was a real eye opener and made me realise how awfully addicted someone can be.

Proud- that is a really unusual and extreme reaction. The vast majority of people don't experience anything like that. Anecdotes == data