to be a bit bitter about inheritance

[ShagOBite]

I had a horrible childhood, and lived in poverty. I won't get an inheritance.

Friends of mine had lovely childhoods, the best education money could buy, and as many boosts as possible to their careers. They are already much more privileged. They don't need any more money now, as their careers are ticking along nicely, and still get parental help when they can't afford a new conservatory or whatever.

Soon enough, their parents will die and leave them with even more money. That they don't need. And so the cycle continues.

I know it is bitter of me, I don't like feeling like this, but it is so unfair. I've had to work so hard to make a success of my life, it is so frustrating when others get handouts for nothing. Some of my friends have hardly ever worked, safe in the knowledge that they will be fine and dandy in a few years.

I get the argument that you work hard to provide for your kids. But if it stops them from working hard, and especially if it's 'old money' (ie. the working hard bit was done generations ago) it seems so unfair.

AIBU?

Yes yellow not that that was directed at you.

The OP keeps repeating herself, and so will I?

Do you understand the concept of flogging a dead horse?

What on earth are you finding upsetting about people not agreeing with you and saying that communism won't work.

That's the thrust of it really.

ShagOBite - this is a sort of communism really isn't it? Please go away and read up about the inherent (if you will forgive the pun) problems with that system.

You and I clearly have nothing coming to us inheritance wise, it is amazing that given that we have opposite opinions. I wonder if you had the assets I had you would give it all away?

Oh ffs. we don't agree so let's get it deleted.. why not a flounce yet, what the hell did you think people would say?????????

Diddums

I never had any expectations as my mum has had dementia for many years and has been in an expensive care home. We now have to sell the family home to pay the charges. I don't feel sad or bitter, after all it wasn't my home was it? People continually told me to rent it out etc, but we used her pension to half the fees and it just seemed wrong at the time because there is always the (incorrect) hope she may have returned home.

The solicitor and estate agents (unbelievably) have been kind, considerate and sympathetic and the EA has offered cheap fees for sale and legal fees.
I won't receive a lot, but I am very grateful for the smallish sum I will get after everyone else is paid. It isn't always what it seems inheritance wise and I haven't personally really known anyone who has been left a lot of money.

I'm just having a bad day. Can we leave it there please?

They won't delete it anyway.
It's rare that they do and there have been no personal attacks.

The thing is about the internet, DamnBamboo, is that if you bore of the debate, you can just leave.

So if you haven't fully convinced anyone with your argument and are tired of flogging a dead horse, why not go and do something that does interest you?

I'm not bored, and don't tell me what to do!

I'm also not trying to convince anyone, and I think you'll find that most people don't agree with the OP anyway, so your point is?

Thanks also for your "idiots guide to how the internet works"

Let me make this crystal clear:

I wasn't trying to tell you what to do. How would that work, anyway? Would I come round to your house.

Let me make this crystal clear also:

you need to chill out.

I have read the thread and there is some good stuff on her that you could take from it if you wanted to.

It would be a shame for this to be deleted, it's interesting to hear how some people feel about these things.

You are looking for 'fair', but life will never always be fair to everyone. A change in legislation won't bring our Dads back, but for me it would have made my life a hell of a lot worse. maybe for you it would have made it better, but that still wouldn't be 'fair' on one of us.

We all have our demons Bite, some are to do with money and some are not. It is not helping you to focus on what is fair and what you could have in comparison to others if they hadn't inherited. You need to recognise that even if people have had help financially, they will still have a cross to bear at some point in life.

'But a change in legislation wouldn't give either of us our dads back. It could, however, address the problem that we have of some people having too much and some not having enough.'

What change in legislation? You haven't said what you would do.

Remove the threshold so that no-one gets a penny? What about husband and wife? What about siblings who live together - should they lose their home through having to sell to pay the tax if one of them dies? What about parents who die when their children are minors - what happens to the money then?

OP I'm sorry but you are being hopelessly naive about this.

I am chilled out.
I find your tone rather rude,and patronising.
If you've read the whole thread you will understand I wasn't talking about me flogging a dead horse.

The OP comes up with the same reason time and time again, and when presented with appropriate rebuttal, hasn't responded and has changed the subject, subtlely several times.

My making it crystal clear was to revist the points that had been repeatedly ignored.

That's all.

You do all know, don't you, that English succession laws are among the most liberal in the world?

In France, for example, unlike the UK, you do not have complete freedom in terms of whom you leave your French property and other assets to. French inheritance law specifies that your relatives have rights to a certain proportion of your estate. The proportion that is due to your legal relatives is known as the Reserve Legale, while the proportion that you can freely give away is known as the Quotit Disponible.

To illustrate this, consider the case where you are survived by one child. This child would be entitled to half your estate. If you had two children they would be entitled to one-third each; with three children they would be entitled to one-quarter each. If you have no children that survive you, other members of your family (e.g. surviving parents) may qualify as legal heirs and therefore are entitle to a share of your estate. This is based on the French legal principle that property should be preserved within the bloodline.

A husband or wife is not a legal heir and therefore has no legal entitlement to a share of your estate.

www.france-property-and-information.com/inheritance_tax.htm
This explains why there are a lot of tiny farms and vineyards in France.
Many countries are even stricter.

When it comes to the children of the rich expecting an easy life, can we learn from the many squillionaires who deliberately limit their offspring's entitlements? They do it so as to ensure the next generation learns how to work. It does seem to support the belief that high entitlement makes for a less 'worthwhile' individual.

Can we also have legislation about having parents that die young, or disabled children (so we have a fair distribution) or our elders not getting dementia and having to care for them - yes hopelessly naive at best

I think the OP has lost a lot of perspective, and has got entrenched, which is why she is finding this upsetting

Honestly, OP, there's no way your idea could work practically. In fact, I don't agree with you that it's even right morally.

Think about inequality a little. It is not restricted to our society. So why should your children have better treatment than the children born in the Sudan or Ethiopia?

If you can reconcile in your head the idea of your children living whilst those in the Sudan or Ethiopia are dying of famine, then you can reconcile the idea of inequality in the UK.

Also inequality does not just arise post-mortem. It arises through the children's upbringing. Mine are relatively privileged, I think. They live in a big house with thousands of books. They go to private schools. They belong to a tennis club. They have music lessons/choirs etc. They go on holiday regularly. None of this is free. Do you propose to take this all away from them during my lifetime? What would be my reason for working so hard?

Only read OP. Everyone has moments of envy but you have got to remember that there is always someone better off and always someone worse off, much worse. Once you have enough to live on, money doesn't bring happiness. To starving people in wartorn countries, your life must look enviable.

None of us deserve anything. We all come to this life empty-handed.

It is my joy as a parent to give to my children as much as I can. I studied hard and work hard, and that is my privilege and I fully intend to use it to the best of my ability and with the grace of God.

My parents inherited nothing other than a strong work ethic and good family values, and that is, in turn, what they have given to me. Neither DH or I have had anything more than token handouts from parents (gifts, given in love), but we have succeeded in education and used that to get where we are now. Nothing else.

OP, your writing style and some of what you write shows you to be an educated woman. You are in no different position to DH & me when we were your age.

We have managed, through working for other people (not our own good fortune, gambling or anything else) to earn a combined 6-figure salary as we knock on the door of 50. It wasn't always easy, especially when I wasn't working and when we were upsizing our housing. We are content and think we have given our children a good start in life, and hope that they will be able to look after themselves as adults. We also give 10% of our taxed income to the church, so are looking after others voluntarily (we give time and talents too).

I would not expect an inheritance and would think that my parents should spend any money they have on themselves. However, I don't think it should go to the government either. As it turns out, I received nothing from my mother and will get nothing from my father when he passes. My MIL left me some costume jewellery (worthless other than sentimentality). My FIL has been very prudent and has invested enough to keep him going in his old age without being a burden to any of us. He gives everyone small (£100 - 200) monetary gifts at Christmas which he dresses up as inheritance tax avoidance. He doesn't want to die with money in the bank.

It is perfectly possible for an educated young woman to enter adulthood without a pot to piss in and still make a good life. That others have more is really not giving airtime too. You can drive into Chelsea and see it all, but it is irrelevant. It's also important to realise that you don't become comfortable in your 20s or even 30s. You have to play the long game.

Very quietly whispers - dh's parents and grandparents grew up very hungry and very cold. DH's grandad left the mine on his 18th birthday (in 1926) and walked a lot of miles to work for his country and to make sure every one of his children (6) could stay at school until he or she was 18.

My grandmother's grandparents arrived in this country as refugees from Ireland, my grandfather's parents arrived in this country as refugees from Russia, my father arrived in this country as a jewish refugee from Germany. They all arrived vulnerable and penniless. and with little or no family support. By the time I was born, my family was regarded as "landed gentry" - there had been one very successful marriage - grandma's mother due in part to her father's grit and deterimnation. My mother and I had incredibly privileged upbringings, largely because two of my mother's brothers died fighting for the country that became the home of their families and the money went to grandma.

My mother has spent most of the money and I don't begrudge her a penny of it. She has had a wonderful, exciting and interesting life entirely at her own expense. My MIL is probably worth more now but has lived a "mean" unhappy and rather boring life.

DH and I have made our own money and when we had our first child at 33 and 34 respectively were worth about 300k. That money has multiplied significantly since as have DH's earnings and a huge amount of tax has been paid as a result - in the order of £250,000 pa in recent years.

We live modestly (relatively), we expect our children to work for their livings and to continue to put back in and to contribute to society. Whatever our children get has already been taxed in spades - I do not and will not accept an IHT regime any more punitive than the one we have already.

I am sorry for your struggle OP but many people struggle. The successful ones tend to believe their glass is half full and look to the positive things their lives offer. I am sorry for your difficulties and your heartbreak but only you can reverse it - not me, not your neighbour, not a different regime.

When you smile, the world smiles with you - best foot forward and a straight back.

My mother's uncles, not brothers.

I think there are some very interesting perspectives here- and I love the quote about comparisons. I may have to write that on the blackboard as a daily reminder.

It seems to me that the best inheritance of all (warning, sick buckets may be required for those with delicate constitutions) is a stable, loving upbringing by involved and caring parents. I have friends lucky enough to have had that, and it is something that can't be lost, squandered or taken away, unlike money.

Since presumably we are all parents on here, then we have the desire to provide that for our children in common, if little else. I have no money and will probably never have it, my daughter will probably not go to university unless she saves up for several years first, but I need to focus instead on what I can give her.

I certainly don't want her inheritance to be my bitterness or unhappiness.

"I would not expect an inheritance and would think that my parents should spend any money they have on themselves"

There's a whole generation of pensioners pissing their savings, the equity from their homes, and their great final salary pensions on cruises, M&S shopping binges and Lakeland products.

And a whole generation to follow whole will end up old and cold and reliant on the state in old age. Partly through paying into their elderly parents wonderful pension schemes and to fund their health care.

There's a whole generation of pensioners who've done incredibly well on property and the ones paying the price are today's adults who have been impoverished by high property prices.

I feel very at the thought of encouraging elderly people with big families to spunk all their cash on conservatories and leave their children with nothing. It doesn't sit right with me.

Think about inequality a little. It is not restricted to our society. So why should your children have better treatment than the children born in the Sudan or Ethiopia?

Quattrocento totally agree with this argument. And should we mental maim any child that are born exceptionally brighter than most because they will likely have better earning capacity.

Life isn't equal that is why society works.

There are many examples of families where inherited wealth has not brought happiness: Onasis, Kennedy, Guiness, Getty.........

Many of the deaths in those families arose as a direct result of having wealth.