To think it is about time to stop being a Christian country.

[ShagOBite]

On the council prayers debate, lots of people have said "but we're a Christian country". Why are we? Should we be? How do we go about changing this? It seems so inappropriate and unnecessary in this day and age.

And when I say 'do not practice a religion either way' I include in that people who call themselves Christians but do not ever practice their supposed faith (which probably accounts for most people in the UK in fact.) So between the true Christians and the non-practising, loosely affiliated kind, added to all the increasing number of people who don't assign themselves a religious label at all, your bog-standard Brit-cum-part-time-Christian is still massively in the majority.

And besides, even if Islam does become the dominant religion in the UK, there is no real reason to fear that provided faith and state are kept completely separate. It's only when religion starts having sway over politics and the law that we need to worry. Which is another good reason to move swiftly towards a completely secular state.

And besides, even if Islam does become the dominant religion in the UK, there is no real reason to fear that provided faith and state are kept completely separate. It's only when religion starts having sway over politics and the law that we need to worry. Which is another good reason to move swiftly towards a completely secular state.

What an absolutely spot-on paragraph!

Much of this reaction from people like Pickles is just a big hissy fit about the fact that they don't want change because they see a threat to their own personal way of life. He isn't actually doing any good for the nation as a whole. Do we really want to be more like the USA where we are scared of outsiders? I hope not!

It looks like the BBC are trying to get on the band wagon, but for the life of me, I can't see what point they are making here: www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17112688?

It looks like they are saying that we are all Christians because our kids get Easter holidays from school.

The most stupid thing about it, is that they have used a photo of a Mexican footballer to show how Christianity is an integral part of British footballing culture. I bet the photo of the breaded fish was probably taken with fish caught in international waters .

That's it - I'm going to glue a breaded fish to the back of my car :o

No idea. No-one is trying to get rid of our (post)-Christian culture. Or traces of other religious heritage (days of the week, the name 'Easter'...). As usual, missing the point of secularism entirely.

That's it - I'm going to glue a breaded fish to the back of my car
The piece of cod that passeth all understanding?

:o

I can't really what point that article was making either Some interesting-ish facts I suppose, that I didn't know before, like the Mother's Day one. Along with more tenuous ones such as Christianity's influence on food product naming - 'Angel Delight', for example...!

Just that our Christian history and culture is embedded. So what? I'm happy to make little 'piece of cod' jokes that rely on this - that has no bearing on the fact that I want a secular state.

I have my little fish with feet badge on my car

And you're right Mrs TP, I'm not at all fluffy. Not one iota

I'm not sure what point anyone's trying to make by repeatedly bringing up points like Christianity being embedded in our culture and history, even if we wanted to it's impossible to erase history, that's a given. No one on this thread or elsewhere has suggested that (no matter how much people like me wish it were possible). Christianity is just plain not relevant anymore, it's in it's death throes, no point in continuing to fight, it's making some people (Eric Pickles for a big example) (excuse the pun) look silly.

Its because there is no rational and just reason for not secularizing the state. There is nothing to actually be afraid of, so these people create bogeymen and fictitious dystopias to cling on to their priveliges.

The UK could just become like France, where the State and Church are rigidly rigidly separated. And while eveyone's at it, get rid of the Monarchy as well (maybe after the Queen snuffs it, as she is quite good) or make them choose - head of state, or head of CoE, but you can't do both.

No-one is asking anyone to stop being Christian and I don't think anyone is really suggesting that Christianity or any other religion is a bad thing but why can't people just practice their own religion in their own way and in their churches, as they do now, without the rest of us having to have it as part of our every day lives?
I don't believe the basic story but I believe I am a good person who conducts myself well and follows a moral code very similar to that put forward in many religions. Why then do my children have the Christian message taught to them as fact?

Ela are your children at a church school? do primary schools still teach christianity in assemblies?

Yes, ours does, despite apparently being 'non-denominational'. We also have Christian songs sung at various school events. Not a huge deal you might think and not something I complain about as I am not against them learning ABOUT religion(s), but it is taught as fact, which leaves me in a difficult position at home. I always take the line of "that is what SOME people believe". My greater point is that it shouldn't be the default setting in our daily lives. It shouldn't be assumed that we are a Christian nation when a significant proportion of us are not.

do primary schools still teach christianity in assemblies?

They're all meant to, by law, unless they have specific exemption (eg majority muslim intake)

That's interesting that exemptions exist do actually exist Grimma, I didn't know that.

Here is everything about 'collective worship'. Down near the bottom is the bit about schools being able to have an exemption - but its only from the 'broadly christian' bit, they still have to worship.

I'm astonished that anyone got to this point in this thread without realising that all state schools are supposed to involve children in worship.

It is my main issue. Because your only options are,

1. Remove your child and home-school (if you are a millionaire, I couldn't afford it and frankly don't think I'd be that good at it)

1. Remove your child from assembly and let that child deal with any fallout (not pleasant and I was one of those children so I know).

1. Suck it up.

Everyone keeps going on about finding a different school but they are almost all supposed to do it so it's not an option.

It really isn't an option (finding a crap-free school). When I was looking for a primary school for DS, I avoided the church schools on principal - for one thing, having been sent to one myself, I am more than aware that they are not, actually, automatically good schools. Not only might one's DC be taught appalling superstitious crap as facts, but they might well spend more time talking to their imaginary friends than they do on learning to read.
So DS goes to the generally lovely 'community' school, which is massively multicultural in terms of pupils. Yet he still comes home talking about Lent and Shrove Tuesday, so we have little chats about these being a bit like Diwali (which, to be fair, he also comes home chatting about, but with less expectation that he should be participating at home) and I have repeatedly failed to get cunting Samaritan's Purse kicked out of the school.

The Bishop says

"Marriage must remain a union between a man and a woman, says the Archbishop of York, and David Cameron will be acting like a ?dictator? if he allows homosexual couples to wed."

John Sentamu shows just why church should not have priveliged position in the State (if anyone missed it, article here)

A 'dictator' who - shock horror - allows consenting loving couples to have their relationship put on equal terms with any other couple?

I think someone needs to take that twat Sentamu aside and tell him that people are talking about allowing gay marriage, not making it compulsory.