To expect a midwife to carry out termination duties?

[foglike]

To think a midwife has to carry out these duties and not claim religious discrimination because she's catholic?

bbc link

BadDay it is a very tough job you do and I hope if I ever have to have a LT termination you or someone like you is there. Those poor parents, that poor baby. The NHS is very lucky to have professionals like you.

badday that's a lovely thing you did for that baby. Am sure you are a very caring midwife

I just read a really interesting quote by Ayaan Hirsi Ali

"Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice"

I'm not a coward.

badday, thank heavens you were there to comfort him. You did an amazing, heart-breaking job. I'm pro-choice but the idea of a baby being born alive after a termination is horrible - surely something must have gone very wrong?

The parents were offered feticide, but declined (not unusual). They knew the baby could be born with signs of life.

This is one sick old world.

Kelly, once again with the misquoting. I haven't claimed cleft palate isn't life threatening or fatal I said - "Some of the conditions that they can be aborted for are not necessarily life threatening eg. Downs syndrome and cleft palate."

Badday - that was a lovely thing for you to do. How sad that you had to be put in that position though. :(

that must be horrendously difficult for the midwives and doctors involved.

You really do sound brilliant BadDayAtTheOrifice I couldn't have done what you did.

We're lucky to have you and people like you looking after us.

Yes it is edam. Even for those who hold no objection to it. To force someone to do it is just wrong.

I'm not even joining in on the emotionally fueled chat that's going on. I can't win this one on MN when people start talking about babies dying in their arms and I know when to give up. Just have a think about who the comfort provided was really for.

You can't win?

That is what I said. I'm not meaning prizes or anything, it won't cost you anything.

You have a very strange way of thinking Rational...

"You have a very strange way of thinking Rational..."

Strange? How? Please expand..

If you look back at the thread you'll find that most posters think along the lines of rationals view bumbley.
It's not a competition it's a hard topic to discuss for many women.
Rational highlighting the emotive rhetoric employed by some posters in respect of babies etc is a valid one.
There is a difference between pro life and anti-abortionists you know?

Actually fog, a lot of the emotive language came from Rational herself during the thread and tbh I'm not sure that the majority of posters agree with her idea that people should not become HCPs unless they are prepared to carry out abortions - most people seemed to understand and respect the need for the 'opt out' even if they think the midwives are taking it a bit far in this particular case. As far as the strange way of thinking goes...someone who refers to not being able to 'win' after someone posts their real life experience has a very strange outlook on the whole thing imo.

Especially when she says that people should 'get on with it' and compares abortion to amputations and removing cancerous eyes...yes, I would say very strange!

Rational used it in irony when she was bombarded with it.

You're being disingenuous again bumbley.

And I wont even mention your use of semantics to play with her "Win" remark.

But there are better arbiters of your posts than me here so it's all well and good.

What would you have done? Would you have left that baby to die on it's own?

You don't know that baby didn't get comfort, baby's born prematurely got comfort from touch

So I've apparently misinterpreted "I'm not even joining in on the emotionally fueled chat that's going on. I can't win this one on MN when people start talking about babies dying in their arms and I know when to give up." Care to translate for me foglike?

Why?
Are you struggling to read?
I commented on BadDayAtTheOrifice selfless and noble act earlier and admire her greatly for it.
You're using her experience to lend ambiguity to Rationals posts.
I find that uncomfortable.

Actually, what happens to babies who are aborted still alive prior to 24 weeks here? In the US they have the 'born alive' bill which means that whether they are wanted or not, if the babies show signs of life then they are entitled to medical care. What is our position on it here?

"You're using her experience to lend ambiguity to Rationals posts." eh? how exactly? She was the one referring to it as 'emotionally fuelled chat'