Why do lots of people seem to try their hardest to make 'outspoken' people happy?

[AgentZigzag]

AIBU to suspect everyone knows someone 'outspoken'.

Those people who complain about everything, have to pass critical judgements on everybody, nothing's ever right for them, and worst of all they pride themselves on calling a spade a spade (but don't like it back).

I've noticed the people around them though seem to bend over backwards not to upset them, (although it's futile because they're never satisfied with anything) it's like they can't bear the thought of catching the difficult persons negative attention because this is much worse than telling them they're out of order.

Maybe it's something to do with wanting the persons approval?

Or is this what you do if you want the quiet life?

My Aunt is like this - there is always drama. She was especially confrontational with me when my dd was tiny and I was exhausted.

I walked in to the kitchen at a family gathering to help out - having been feeding my baby. Aunt barked "you're only coming in to help because you know the work has been done"

I replied "I've not seen you in a long time, and this is the second time today you've had a go at me".

She marched out in a huff and has not spoken to me since. What really upset me was her siblings telling me that I was in the wrong and should apologise to her They were so used to pandering to her, and I was just so much softer a target, being extra vulnerable and all that. It has made me think less of all involved.

I think that is how you differentiate between the blunt gobshites and the truly manipulative, negative people. When you are having a hard time, the former try to help, but the latter think it is an opportunity to put you in your place.

I was unsurprised when said Aunt subsequently fell out with her own DIL because she completely refused to accept that her baby's routine should be respected.

Interesting OP. The ones that I find particularly alarming are the clever ones who combine vast amounts of charm with manipulative agendas. They often go a long way as they inspire a lot of loyalty (or fear).

Quiet, shy types can also be manipulative. The 'don't hit me' responsibility-shirkers, get people to do stuff for them.

I dread to think what opinion others have about the way I operate though. Sometimes I think I'm too blunt, but only because I can't see the point of fannying about while the elephant in the room is ignored.

Holey, are we cousins? !
I have an aunt like that, said the exact same thing to me once after I was BFing my 5 week old son, years ago. (she disapproves of bfeeding, btw!).
Has always been 'cranky' and badtempered, especially towards me.
When I complain to my Mother (her sis) she says ''that's just the way she is....''.
Well, in recent years dear aunt has had her comeuppance. Her son did not invite her to his baby's christening. Her DD has finally stood up to her. I 've stopped sending her a Cmas card, etc,
And next time we're in her town(where other rellies) live, she are not going to see her. Her last attact on me was particulliary vitrolic and she has gone too far. I don't want by kids near her!

I shared an office with someone like that for years and we were classmates before that. We used to be good friends. At the beginning she was or seemed more like SGB describes - the person who pointed out unacceptable behaviour when nobody else dared - and I'm afraid I rather drifted into her shadow because I'd been through something rather traumatic over the summer before I first met her and had a shite year before that, so I was being quieter than usual. Then the steel lining on my ovaries started growing back and we came into conflict a lot more, and eventually I became the target of her bullshit. I did initially go out of my way to keep her happy, had a few occasions of locking horns with her - then I disengaged. Kept dealings with her on a professional level, didn't hang out with her outside work unless there was a large group containing at least one other person with a low bullshit tolerance, and got on with my life. It annoyed her. She went through a bit of a phase of really wanting my attention, then she moved on to other targets.

I also agree with Applewhite and one sided sensitivity.

I don't know that it's always as you describe, OP. There are many different types of outspoken

I tend admire those who will speak out and voice concerns and complaints others might be too afraid to.

I also think the word 'bullying' has been used lightly and bandied around too much here.

I too agree with *Applewhite).

Another thing i 've noticed is that when they have a soft moment and just being normal/not nasty for 5 minutes everybody is touched

ClaraSage how unpleasant to name another poster. Not sure that was called for.

As far as I am concerned, 'outspoken' and 'doesn't suffer fools gladly' are euphemisms for rudeness and ignorance.

You beat me to it ComposHat

btw Wrote your name in lowercase but it conjured up a horrible image.

ClaraSage you're being quite provocative and run the risk of derailing the thread.

I don't believe that outspoken means you are rude or ignorant. A poster previously stated she made sure her outspoken views didn't purposely hurt anyone, that doesn't sound rude or ignorant to me.

Maybe there's some confusion over what the terms actually mean.

Bang out of order ClaraSage.

And I think you'll find on here that posters who have 'henchmen' tend to do so because the offer opinions that have been found to be valuable.

boomerwang I totally agree with you about the different meanings of outspoken. I like my outspoken friend who will say it as it is. He has never said anything mean/ degrading but he will just come out and ask/say what ever it is. In fact he makes a point of never discussing weight/ clothes choice etc as he says has it has the potential to upset a conversation!

No, she is scary and really goes in for the kill if you disagree with her. She names names and reminds posters of other posters previous threads to get one up on them . Cross her at your peril.

You're mixing up "outspoken" with "being a dick"

I'm outspoken. I'm blunt. I don't have very many social skills. I know how to be assertive*.

You don't like me, do you?

*There is not a fine line between assertive and aggressive. Aggression is shouting until things happen your way. Assertiveness is not giving into aggressive people.

And yet, I'll challenge people bitching about others. I'll tell someone to shut up if they're bullying someone in public. If someone tries to control me, in private or public, I'll ask them to stop, and if they carry on or get worse I'll confront them about it in a constructive, assertive manner. If people spout crap with the intention of proving someone wrong and making others look rubbish, I'll wait until they say something I know to be untrue and slam them on it, the more public the better. If someone tries to control someone I know into doing something I know they don't want to do, I'll divert the conversation somewhere else and give the person some pointers on how to say no in private.

I don't complain unless I'm asked my opinion. I never pass judgement on someone without them asking me in private. I won't insult someone (intentionally, see above about lacking social skills) unless they start it. I won't get aggressive unless there's no other choice.

And if I ask someone their opinion of me and they call me a dick, that's cool. I asked.

I dislike dickheads as well. Especially those that hide behind being 'outspoken' and 'assertive' when actually, they're just rude. People who are genuinely assertive are great though.

There will always be someone you find unpleasant, Clarasage, but show you have the high ground and ignore it. People will decide for themselves what a poster is like. Trust in their perception.

Sounds more like Clara had a run in with AF, and AF found her wanting.

21yroldman, I prefer to know exactly where I stand with people. I'm not much of a game player and I admit I get bored quickly with some fence sitters and anyone two faced, but I do wonder if that doesn't necessarily mean I only have time for people who are like myself. I think I'd dislike that even more.

I also like to know if I'm being a 'dickhead'. I might look about me with incredulity but if enough agree then I know I am doing or saying something unacceptable. Getting to the point quickly can save a relationship, imo.

boomerwang Sounds like we'd be great friends if we ever met in RL!

Wrong, Sarah.

Then you really shouldn't be singling out AF. It is mildly understandable if you've had a run in with her, but very bad manners if you don't even have that as an excuse.

AF may be blunt, but she has great insight and does offer excellent advice. The difference is that she is not deliberately rude or provocative.

Move on now Sarah. You've made your point but you are not going to stop me or anyone else voicing their opinions.

Hang on, if you can voice an opinion so can others. That's what a forum is about.

Although I admit I'm adding fuel to the fire :(

To post or not post? Hmm...