So we all know not to use disabled toilets, but what about disabled fitting rooms in shops?

[PengyQuinn]

Today I went in to M&S to try to buy some new bras (I know, big mistake, but there are only 2 shops that do bras in town). I had DD with me (18mo) in the buggy, in the fitting rooms the lady looked at the buggy and immediately said she didn't know where I could try the bra on. I pointed to the empty large fitting room at the end and she said no, that it was only for disabled customers. I suggested the other empty large room, but she said no, that was for bra fitting only.

I said I was happy to go in a normal room but that I would have to keep the door open as it is too small for the door to close and I wasn't happy to leave DD unattended (I know some people are happy to do this but I'm not).

She then said I could go in the disabled fitting room but did a lot of tutting and sighing saying 'what if a disabled person comes in'. I told her she could knock on the door and I would come out as soon as I was decent.

I understand that priority for the larger access fitting rooms should be given to disabled customers but I hadn't realised that they were the same as disabled toilets. I understand why disabled toilets need to be only for disabled users only and I only use them if it is the only baby change facility and I have no other options.

So was I BU to want to use the larger fitting room?

YANBU, the woman was being ridiculous. If she was on duty in the changing room then she could have let you know if somebody came along who needed either room more than you did. And then to refuse to let you leave the door on an ordinary cubicle open either - well, what the hell DID she want you to do?!?!

I'm fairly sure they're accessible changing rooms, not disabled ones. Many disabled people would be absolutely fine in an ordinary changing room (eg shaky old people who have a walking stick and need to sit down a lot - not a problem in most changing rooms) whereas many non disabled people would not (eg parent trying to try new clothes on two pre schoolers).

Also, I have never ever seen a wheelchair or walking frame user in a changing room in my life (and I love shopping!) The chance of holding someone up because you are in the accessbile changing room is microscopic. I wouldn't use one unnecessarily in an unattended changing room but if it was the only one free in an attended changing room then I would expect the attendent to let me know if somebody else needs the room.

For those who say they would NEVER use a disabled toilet - I was in a shopping centre late the other night and both the male AND the female toilets were closed for cleaning (late night xmas opening so I suppose they have no option but to clean themwhile customers are still in) The queue outside the two disabled toilets was a mile long (not literally but very long - we waited 10 minutes). These two toilets are specific disabled only ones (there is a separate baby change) but what else were people meant to do!? I would have given up waiting but 4 year old was threatening to wet herself if she didn't get to go.

Would people use the disabled loo in those circumnstances?

manic I very rarely go shopping; when I do, I need an accessible changing room (wheelchair user). The last two occasions I have had to wait for a long time (20 minutes) until people with no visible physical impairment to finally emerge. Yes, it was my time I was wasting. Completely unnecessarily.

It's absolutely unacceptable that you were left waiting 20 minutes Julia. But I don't think that means accessible changing rooms should be left empty 99% of the time. The vast majority of changing rooms are attended, at least during busy times. All it takes is for the attendant to show a bit of initiative and tell the person in the changing room to get some clothes on and get out if someone does in who needs the cubicle more than they do.

But they don't. Like just using the disabled parking space for one minute. That's the minute I turn up, the space is taken, go park somewhere much more awkward, come back to find they're not disabled, by now I have parked, got out with difficulty, gone back to where I wanted to be. Likewise, everyone else could use a regular changing room, but I can't. It would be nice to get the little bit of leeway of not having to wait, just a bit of compensation for the fact that every other thing we ever do takes longer, is more difficult, more awkward. Because the able-bodied people in that toilet/changing room/parking space don't need it and we do. Really, it is that simple. I need it and you don't.

I think the parking one is a bit different Julia - I find parking my car accross the back of one in a parking space effective, especially at supermarkets. My number gets called, I go to customer service and inform them that no I am not blocking a disabled space, I'm blocking the person who is using the space without a blue badge.

I think maybe a policy of "you can use it but if someone needs it more than you, then you will have to leave and let them in" would work, after all it's not like a car where it is left, with a changing room the person is there and can be asked to move.

I don't often try clothes on because I just find it so physically difficult, but occasionally I do.

Oh and if I see work vans in disabled bays I phone the number on the side and ask why they are using it.

Serenity, I don't think anyone is saying that having a pushchair makes them a bit like a disabled person. But having one is a legitimate reason to use a larger changing room or toilet, because they have a physical reason to need the extra space.

In most normal loos, you can't get a pram in the room (especially if it's crowded and there is a queue), let alone in the cubicle. I would find it hard to carry a baby and pee. Also I wouldn't leave either my baby unattended or my pram. That would leave me with no other choice.

sashh Liking your thinking re blocking them in

It's not "legitimate" if it's for wheelchair users only then there is no legitimate reason for a non wheelchair user to use it. If it's ok for non wheelchair users to use it it's ok for everyone to use it, no need for justification.

I was a carer for my dad who was a wheelchair user and I would never ever use a disabled parking space but I think the situation re loos, changing rooms etc is evolving as facilities for disabled people are finally becoming more common.

You used to get maybe one disabled loo to 10 able-bodied ones. Now, you'll often have 1/3 or even 1/2 of cubicles adapted to suit disabled people which is great but it's not realistic to expect that able-bodied people will never use them.

If you need more space in order to pee and keep an eye on your baby, then it is a legitimate reason to use a disabled loo. Same with changing rooms.

If someone with a pram can't use a normal loo/changing room because they cannot physically get it into the space provided, then they need a larger alternative.

I thought no one used disabled toilets as they're disabled. OTOH acessible toilets are for anyone who needs extra access.

I've got a question, my disability doesn't affect my bladder control and I'm not in a chair, does that mean I shouldn't use it?

I would think that if you are not using a wheelchair and your disability doesn't affect bladder control, then you should probably use the normal loos. I think it's about need, and whether you can physically and reasonably use the normal ones or not.

I don't use the disabled loos when out with pushchair - just leave the door open.

But in shops - normally shown to the large changing room when I have the pushchair with me and to be honest its never actually occurred to me to refuse to use it.

M+S in Manchester assistants tell you which cubicle to go into.
I have often been sent to the large/ double cubicles on my own, no pushchair. When DD was in a pushchair I always went in them.

Disabled loos are accessible for wheelchair users. You're being a dick if, for example, you're deaf, and you think thats a loo just for you because you're disabled. Surely people don't think anyone with any disability gets a special loo?

Bit cross that I mention in one thread that I have a hearing problem that it's brought into a discussion about toilets.

I walk with crutches. When I use disabled loos I'm using the extra room to get in with four legs, somewhere to put my crutches without them leaning on me, the higher seat because I can't get all the way down to a normal seat easily, the supports that I use to pull myself up with when my joints won't straighten out, the lack of queue because standing still for long is painful. Have I missed anything? The incredibly low sink they often have is a pain in the... well... back and often I'll go to the ladies to wash my hands rather than try to use them. Sometimes, like if I'm in a pub and not far from the toilets or if I'm popping in somewhere from the car, I don't use my crutches.

I'd love to meet one of you when coming out of the disabled loo with my decent bladder control, lack of wheelchair and maybe even lack of crutches...

Back in the days of benefit books, pre-crutches, I have come close to waving one in someone's face who thought that just because of my age (and hers) that I must be healthy, not that she had any obvious form of disability either.

I'm disabled and don't mind having to wait to use disabled changing rooms. Able bodied people gave to queue so I don't expect to go to the front of the line

Have not gave