To really believe algebra is a waste of time...

[Feminine]

unless you are intending to go in to a math/science driven career?

Not radical I know but really, its a waste of time isn't it?

I think teens would be better off concentrating on math that actually helps when they leave school...I have a teen myself and teen siblings -I hear this opinion regularly.Many of the brightest students struggle with it, surely they could do something else? something more practical perhaps?

The jobs I have heard it is used in, is quite silly.

If I am ignorant, and we would would all be much better off if we were all better at it , then I (in advance) apologize. :)

I watched a programme once about primary maths teaching in Britain (many teachers struggle, and therefore so do the kids) and in response to the anti-algebra brigade the professor (an inspirational teacher) said:

"Algebra is every child's birthright".

I couldn't agree more - it is so perfect and beautiful. I loved it and hope my DS will in time too. Maths is ace.

Maths tutor here and I'm sorry but I agree with everyone else about the need for algebra. The US school system sounds like the Belgian one though. I have to say the A level syllabus is easier.

algebra is rather basic maths. If someone cannot manage it they are not gifted at maths. saying my child is really gifted apart from the basic stuff he cannot do, but as that is just algebra, spelling, etc it is not important, just comes across as blinkered. Someone who cannot do basic algebra is not very employable either.

At its most basic it is just everyday common sense.
You go to boots see the three for two offer, know you will have to pay £20 in total and using 3x = 20, you can work out the real cost of each item. You have a job that will take 30 man hours, but they are only six hours to get it done, using 6x = 30 you can work out how many people you need. It really is stupid to say it is not practical just because you cannot do it.

I am another Maths graduate. I think there is a problem with Maths at school in that there is too much emphasis on "doing" Maths and not enough on "understanding" it. Too many students get good grades at Higher/A level and go on to do Maths at University only to find that they do not have an aptitude for it after all and really struggle.

Basic algebra is really the first abstract concept that most pupils come across. It looks like more time should be spent in making sure that everyone understands the concepts involved.

I agree with many of the posters above. Algebra ia a very useful tool in real life. I use it when I work out how many rolls of wallpaper I need for a room, how much material I have to buy for curtains given the size of the pattern repeat etc..

My dd is only in S2 so I have no idea what algebra Higher/A-Level syllabi contain now, but I am intrigued by what advanced algebra is done at schools in the US. OP - do you have a link to examples? Are they doing Group Theory and things like that?

YABU, because of what BOF said right at the very top.

longtime its perhaps a bit like Belgium here, yes, I have heard that said before :)

kelly nowhere have I said my son is gifted at Math ...he is SO far from that we established ages ago (on this thread) that he has not been complaining about basic algebra ...its the stuff he is doing now. We also worked out that he has probably been working me a little.I also didn't say it was stupid. I based my original post from the advanced level papers he has shown me.

purple I don't where to find it on line...I'll ask DS later and try to remember to post it :)

I don't think his teacher is all that with it though...yesterday she told DS that America is the only country that used miles a a form of distance measurement ...when DS explained that the UK did also, she asked him "if he was sure?"

Sorry feminine. I did algebra america, and to be honest I prefer the British way wher eit is a lot mroe integrated. When I was there the different fields of maths were taught at different levels, so in the ninth grade you did algebra, but might not touch calculas until a couple of years later.

"America is the only country that used miles a a form of distance measurement"

Of course that is not true as anyone who has ventured onto a UK road will verify.

Using feet and inches throws up some suprising anomolies. I asked a class of mine how tall they were (this was in Saudi Arabia, the class comprised mainly Pakistani, Egyptian and Sudanese kids) as far as I remember, none of them were able to give me an estimate in terms of m and cm, but nearly all of them were able to tell me in terms of feet and inches!

In the UK we apparently ditched the Imperial for Metric some time back in the 70's. Yet here we are about 40 years later STILL using imperial measures.

Having had a mini-rant, I would be rather miffed if I couldn't buy a pint in the pub.

you can go metric and still have a pint. We manage it in Ireland! I always get really confused if I cross the border and the signs are suddenly in miles per hour. My car only does kilometres, I have no idea if I am speeding!

kelly I agree ...from looking at the math GCSE + A level bite size ,EVEN I can see its better.

plus, there is the option to take the GCSE at different sets...here ,there is nothing like that. You either get it ...or you don't!

complex I was talking to my son about where we (UK) still used pints ...its nice to keep them I think

When we come home there are more differences for my son to get used to again, than I (at first) realized. Much of the GCSE website was a breeze...until it got to ways of measuring and weighing...

The US system does teach different areas of maths in different years. DD21's progression through it from 6th grade on was pre-algebra, basic algebra, advanced basic algebra, honours algebra, geometry, analytic geometry, precalculus and AP calculus. Then she had to do maths in university too (US universities usually have core courses which every student must take no matter what their eventual degree is in). There were about 6 levels of maths in her high school. Some students graduated having passed the level she did in her first year in their final year.

I went to school in Ireland where everyone takes maths to the end of secondary. Again, you can take it at a few different levels. It's supposed to teach you to think methodically and clearly, and it probably would if it was well taught.

From CollegeBoard description of prerequisites for calculus:
'Before studying calculus, all students should complete four years of secondary mathematics designed for college-bound students: courses in which they study
algebra, geometry, trigonometry, analytic geometry and elementary functions. Thesefunctions include linear, polynomial, rational, exponential, logarithmic, trigonometric, inverse trigonometric and piecewise-defined functions. In particular, before studyingcalculus, students must be familiar with the properties of functions, the algebra of functions and the graphs of functions.'

There is a description of the courses for Ab and BC calculus on there too.

I hated maths at school but I have to disagree as I am sure algebra is good for logical thinking. I hated it though. Really hated it. Detested it in fact. I went on to become an English teacher. Although you do need to pass a maths exam to become a teacher, but luckily there was no algebra in it!! Schoolchildren study a lot of things that may not be relevant to their future career but it is still good for them to study these things. Education is not just preparation for work, the gaining of knowledge is an end in itself (IMO).