to think that if you don't want people taking photos of your child in the school play don't let them be in it!

[2anddone]

Hi I am sure this has been done a hundred times before but I am so pissed off. DS had his school nativity play today and at the start we were told no photos or videoing was allowed. Typically enough it was the first school production where he hasn't cried. They are not filming the play or offering us any other ways to get a 'memory' of the play and the reason given was that 2 parents had requested no photos were allowed. This is not due to religious beliefs it was simply they didn't want other people taking photos of their dc. I know IAPBU but I don't care IMO if you don't want your child photographed in the play collect them early and don't let them be in it! Rant over

Yes, they may kitkat and i wont like it but i wouldnt expect the majorty or 20 or 30 sets of parents to bow down to my wishes. Either I keep dd out of the play or I accept that. I think they should ask thought and if it is split then they should err on the side of saying no, but not if only one or 2 sets of parents disagree

And IReallyHateMyCat - you have experienced abuse, and I am sorry that you did so and am sorry that you are angry but your experience of abuse is not everyone's experience of abuse and just because you were dealt with in a particular way or have a particular viewpoint does not mean that someone else's viewpoint is not just as valid as yours.

As you yourself said, do not assume.

IReally - I do wonder if most children would feel like you though. I think most children want to fit in and be involved in school events.

I'm sorry for what you've endured though

If you consider what you said to someone who did suffer from severe abuse you might understand telling you to fuck off isn't in my head half as offensive.

janebirkin so are adoptive parents told that the birth family are dangerous and to look over their shoulder every 5 mins? Sounds like you are telling me they are.
In that case no, i don't understand the details.

I have a family member whose son was adopted at birth because she has psych problems (bi-polar). The rest of us in the family were told we couldn't adopt because it would be "confusing" for him

Also, i work with drug users, some of whom have children adopted not because they are dangerous as such, they just don't give a shit.

YABU

The play is for the kids to experience performing, learning songs/ lines and actions and co-operating as a group ,not the photo opportunity.

If people didn't splash pics around on face book etc school might not take such a hard line. DS's school have tried the "reasonable" approach, photos allowed but notices asking people not to share them digitally/ on social media, but still some inconsiderate so and so has done so with pics that feature not only their own child but also a child whose parents have not given permission and are legally unable to give permission., so we all get a letter home ... next time we may also have a photo ban at this rate.

YABVVU- but you've either realised that or aren't really as bothered as your initial post suggested.

I don't think that sending your child to school to take part in a normal school activity means that you are effectively consenting to them being video taped by the other parents.

If only two sets of parents say no, and the school says tough luck, they can't take part, what do those kids do during the rehearsals and such like? They are missing out on an educational activity through no fault of their own. I am sure the parents would have a good legal leg to stand on when they complain that their child is being unfairly excluded from an activity during curriculum time.

The school does not exist for the benefit of preserving memories for posterity on film or in digital format. They need to put the education, and safety, of the children first.

IReallyHateMyCat - I will say again, your experience is not everyone who has been abused experience. I am sorry that you are so angry and I am sorry for what you saw and experienced but that does not give you the right to insist that other children, where courts and judges have made other decisions, be made to feel like pariahs so that you can have a video of your PFB.

IReallyHate - are you actually saying that it's better for children who've escaped from abusive homes to be further punished for being a victim by telling them that can't be part of a normal school experience?

Jamiecomehome thanks for your comment- My worry is that some children (say kids whos parents are in the forces for months or years or in hospital) will be equally devastated by their mums and dads not being allowed to take part. And I suspect their are more of them than children who have genuine issues regarding their safety. No one wants to leave any children out and maybe a better compramise would be having the play on 2 days (which i think usually happens anyway) and one being photos Ok and one being No photos

IReallyHateMyCat - the play/performance/carol service/sports day is for the children to take part in - not the mum and dad to take part.

Really the school have got better things to do than organise their end of term play performances around parents photography "needs".
I was never devastated by my dad not seeing me in primary school plays because he was at work. That was just how it was.

Schools have enough planning and organising to do, often involving the teachers putting in lots of work in their own time, in order to make these performances happen. Just go and actually watch it, I am sure it will be memorable enough for you. If others can't come with you, there is always next year.

Then why invite the children's parents to watch? You must realize that's where the fun is for the children otherwise parents wouldnt be expected to sit through an hour of Oh Come All Ye Faithful outside of school hours.

Yes of course it is fun for the children when the parents come to watch. But watching does not have to mean recording. It can actually mean just sitting in the chair and actually enjoying the show.

The children's parents are invited to watch. They have a choice. If they choose not to go, then they don't see the performance. If they choose to go, then they get to see and remember the performance.

I'm quite sure teachers do performances for lots of reasons that are linked with the curriculum but I doubt they are solely done for the fun of the children and the enjoyment of parents.

What would you do about Sports Day? Should the no-photograph children be banned from that too?

YABVU

This isn't some new, crazy idea thought up to offend you personally. There have always been child protection measures in place in schools - this is just an adaptation of those measures in response to the very central place the internet has in our lives these days. It has never been harder to protect your anonymity should there be a need to do so when we are all at the mercy of everyone else's privacy (or otherwise) choices.

It is a million times more important for vulnerable children to be both protected and included than it is for you to have a bit of paper to stick in the family album. We have loads of photos and cine film of me as a child - we have none whatsoever of me in primary school plays etc - the only school photos are the official ones which makes me wonder if there was a no photography policy at my primary school even back then.

Unfortunately, you can never be sure whether or not a parent will obey a request for caution and use a photo for private use only, or whether they won't be able to resist sticking it on the internet with all sorts of tagging and location information.

I am going to DS's nursery nativity play this week - DP asked if I could video it and I said I wouldn't think it would allowed. His initial reaction was oh FFS because he immediately assumed "paedo-hysteria" - when I pointed out the various issues raised by adoptive and foster parents on this thread he said "oh, hadn't thought of that - obviously they have to do that then". I am surprised that people can have the issues pointed out to them and still think it is unreasonable.

The right of a child to participate fully in one of the funnest parts of the school year for many kids trumps the right of the parent who chooses a job where they can't go to the play. My dad couldn't take time off work, I'm not scarred by that.

Whereas most children who can't be photographed are at very real physical risk.

I can't actually believe I'm having this discussion with a victim of abuse - it seems really perverse.

Children may need to remain anonymous for all sorts of reasons - for example a family may haver been rehoused and given new identities on a witness protection scheme - they would not want their photo on the internet linked to their location - you as a fellow parent would not be aware of this. If you provided the costume you can "recreate" the memory at home!

Have any of you ever heard of a SPED house?

Because if you had experience of it, you would know that there are people, families, who are in real danger if I photo ever ever escaped on to the internet

one not I.

Just googled SPED house and am none the wiser. Can someone explain?

Special Purchase Evacuated Dwelling.

A family literally does a midnight flit. No one knows. No neighbours. No friends. No family. No one. They are just gone the next day. And the house is bought by the authorities and sold. They are given a new start elsewhere.